Damaged Luger?

tharpo · 10-16-2006, 09:50 AM

Yesterday I picked up my first Luger after the California 10 day waiting period from a FFL01 licensee who ran a gun transfer operation from his house. To show me how a cable lock would go on the gun he pulled the action all the way back and stated,"that's stiff". He had me do the same thing to install the cable lock. Later I noticed that the safety was on and I recalled you were not supposed to **** the gun with it on. He admitted he had not transfered many Lugers.
Is the gun damaged? Is it safe to shoot? I took the Luger apart but I don't know what to look for. It's a 1936 mismatched S/42. Thanks for any help.

Steinar · 10-16-2006, 10:05 AM

Tharpo, If I understand you right, the gun where cocked with safety on, and was therefore hard to ****.
Some Lugers can be cocked with safety on, but your S/42 is probably not. However, it can be done with the use of force, but not made to do so. I would guess your Luger is ok. If to take the safety off and **** it again (always empty gun), and the toggle is back to normal, it probably survived the incident.

Vlim · 10-16-2006, 10:19 AM

Hi,

Basically there are two parts that need checking after such an attempt:

The sear bar and the safety bar. If they appear normal and not bent in any way, you should be fine. The sear bar has some place to move around in, so as stated, you'll probably be ok.

Alx · 01-19-2007, 12:01 AM

I really get disgusted at the way some "professionals" handle Lugers.
The "Master Gunsmith Armorer" who dismantles a Luger, in a "Armorer's Course" video I bought, hamfists his way into ruining a Luger's magazine catch spring by taking it out wrong, right in the demonstration of how to strip one down, as a gunsmith training course. Then he notices it is damaged without realizing it was done by himself. Amazing that the video got accepted, printed and copied, and distributed that way.

drbuster · 01-19-2007, 09:21 AM

Tac, with a relieved sear bar, working the toggle with the safety on should be no problem. If it has a non-relieved sear bar, then you cannot pull the toggle back or some metal will break.

Dwight Gruber · 01-19-2007, 10:09 AM

The problem here is that you cannot work the toggle with the safety on and with the pistol de-cocked. The sear cannot get past the sear bar because the safety keeps the sear bar from moving out of the way.

Working the toggle with the safety on and the weapon already cocked (with the relieved sear bar) is perfectly practical.

--Dwight

MikeP · 01-19-2007, 07:37 PM

I have a '41 byf in real nice shape showing little wear.
There is enough slop in the safety/sear fit that it will fire with the safety engaged.
No evidence of bending. Just sloppy work.

tharpo · 01-19-2007, 07:57 PM

I've taken my 1936 S/42 to the range several times and other than an
occasional jamming problem it functions fine. So I guess it has survived
the safety on, pull the toggles all the way back incident.

Alx · 01-19-2007, 09:59 PM

MikeP 's gun which can fire with the safety engaged is probably the result of bent parts or loosened "wallered" fit from the gun having had its uncocked bolt forced open back past the engaged safety at some time in its past, like tharpo's. No Luger would be that sloppy unless its action had so been forced and bent or loosened.

MikeP · 01-31-2007, 11:24 AM

In reference to the thoughts on my '41-there is no wear, wallering, or bending as I described.
I have a number of lugers from all periods for reference. None of them approach this one for fit.
My observation is that the slot where the safty slides up thru the frame is too wide.
I never tried this with live ammo and can't say what the previous owners did. It does not appear to be damaged.
I only brought it up because It has little visible wear.

10-16-2006, 09:50 AM	#1
tharpo Lifer Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: West Coast, USA Posts: 537 Thanks: 116 Thanked 376 Times in 154 Posts	Damaged Luger? Yesterday I picked up my first Luger after the California 10 day waiting period from a FFL01 licensee who ran a gun transfer operation from his house. To show me how a cable lock would go on the gun he pulled the action all the way back and stated,"that's stiff". He had me do the same thing to install the cable lock. Later I noticed that the safety was on and I recalled you were not supposed to **** the gun with it on. He admitted he had not transfered many Lugers. Is the gun damaged? Is it safe to shoot? I took the Luger apart but I don't know what to look for. It's a 1936 mismatched S/42. Thanks for any help.

10-16-2006, 10:05 AM	#2
Steinar User Join Date: May 2004 Posts: 1,538 Thanks: 18 Thanked 36 Times in 21 Posts	Tharpo, If I understand you right, the gun where cocked with safety on, and was therefore hard to **. Some Lugers can be cocked with safety on, but your S/42 is probably not. However, it can be done with the use of force, but not made to do so. I would guess your Luger is ok. If to take the safety off and ** it again (always empty gun), and the toggle is back to normal, it probably survived the incident. __________________ Previously known as Morgan Kane

10-16-2006, 10:19 AM	#3
Vlim Moderator Lifetime LugerForum Patron Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Europe Posts: 5,048 Thanks: 1,034 Thanked 3,952 Times in 1,199 Posts	Hi, Basically there are two parts that need checking after such an attempt: The sear bar and the safety bar. If they appear normal and not bent in any way, you should be fine. The sear bar has some place to move around in, so as stated, you'll probably be ok.

01-19-2007, 12:01 AM	#4
Alx User Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Nashville, Tennessee area Posts: 263 Thanks: 5 Thanked 3 Times in 3 Posts	I really get disgusted at the way some "professionals" handle Lugers. The "Master Gunsmith Armorer" who dismantles a Luger, in a "Armorer's Course" video I bought, hamfists his way into ruining a Luger's magazine catch spring by taking it out wrong, right in the demonstration of how to strip one down, as a gunsmith training course. Then he notices it is damaged without realizing it was done by himself. Amazing that the video got accepted, printed and copied, and distributed that way.

01-19-2007, 09:21 AM	#5
drbuster User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: San Mateo, California Posts: 1,432 Thanks: 2 Thanked 71 Times in 56 Posts	Tac, with a relieved sear bar, working the toggle with the safety on should be no problem. If it has a non-relieved sear bar, then you cannot pull the toggle back or some metal will break.

01-19-2007, 10:09 AM	#6
Dwight Gruber User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Portland, Oregon Posts: 3,890 Thanks: 0 Thanked 1,282 Times in 424 Posts	The problem here is that you cannot work the toggle with the safety on and with the pistol de-cocked. The sear cannot get past the sear bar because the safety keeps the sear bar from moving out of the way. Working the toggle with the safety on and the weapon already cocked (with the relieved sear bar) is perfectly practical. --Dwight

01-19-2007, 07:37 PM	#7
MikeP User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: ILL Posts: 686 Thanks: 36 Thanked 452 Times in 198 Posts	I have a '41 byf in real nice shape showing little wear. There is enough slop in the safety/sear fit that it will fire with the safety engaged. No evidence of bending. Just sloppy work.

01-19-2007, 07:57 PM	#8
tharpo Lifer Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: West Coast, USA Posts: 537 Thanks: 116 Thanked 376 Times in 154 Posts	I've taken my 1936 S/42 to the range several times and other than an occasional jamming problem it functions fine. So I guess it has survived the safety on, pull the toggles all the way back incident.

01-19-2007, 09:59 PM	#9
Alx User Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Nashville, Tennessee area Posts: 263 Thanks: 5 Thanked 3 Times in 3 Posts	MikeP 's gun which can fire with the safety engaged is probably the result of bent parts or loosened "wallered" fit from the gun having had its uncocked bolt forced open back past the engaged safety at some time in its past, like tharpo's. No Luger would be that sloppy unless its action had so been forced and bent or loosened.

01-31-2007, 11:24 AM	#10
MikeP User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: ILL Posts: 686 Thanks: 36 Thanked 452 Times in 198 Posts	In reference to the thoughts on my '41-there is no wear, wallering, or bending as I described. I have a number of lugers from all periods for reference. None of them approach this one for fit. My observation is that the slot where the safty slides up thru the frame is too wide. I never tried this with live ammo and can't say what the previous owners did. It does not appear to be damaged. I only brought it up because It has little visible wear.