Would any of the expert Luger collectors here please comment...

[siegersallee]

Hi All,

One of the other members of this board (lugerskewl) was kind enough to give me this link an available Erfurt Luger.

I am interested in the pistol, but being a complete beginner, I have no idea of how to judge a good deal or a good Luger or even if it is a real Luger and not a restoration.

If I could get some input on this, I'd really appreciate it.

Here is the link:
http://www.simpsonltd.com/product_in...0e76b4d78cdb83

Richard

[padredan]

Simpson Ltd is one of the foremost and top sellers of lugers and collectable firearms. they are well respected in the selling of fine collectiable firearms, all you have to do is call them and they will answer any questions that you may have on any item they have listed. i have done bussiness with them on several firearms and i have never been disapointed, and if you do they stand behind what they sell. in the luger market it is best to either know what you are buying or know and trust who is selling it. good Luck

[sheepherder]

Simpson's will entertain offers...Their prices are not set in stone...

[Norme]

Hi Richard, It looks like a particularly nice Erfurt and you could do a lot worse. The only issue I have are the unnumbered grips, as all the Erfurts I've examined have had grips that both numbered and inspection marked. Simpson's prices run somewhat high, but many of us feel it's worth paying a premium for peace of mind. As Dan said, they're extremely ethical. Regards, Norm

[alvin]

Not an expert, not a dedicated Luger collector either. But in this price range, I like this one:

http://www.simpsonltd.com/product_in...ducts_id=19435

They give a few days to inspect the gun upon delivery. No risk.

[Edward Tinker]

I moved this to the new collectors area, since you weren't selling a luger...

[mrerick]

Hi Richard,

While I agree that it's a particularly nice Erfurt, the issue Norm mentions (of the mis-matched grips) is significant, especially since they are asking in the $2k range for it.

$2,000 should get you a very nice collectable Luger. All matching (except magazine); over 90% original finish.

While it would be wishful thinking to consider it almost collectable, there is a big difference in value when one has any mis-matched parts. Finding original numbered Erfurt grips is, of course, possible - but very difficult. If it were not so difficult, the seller or Simpson's would already have corrected this.

Lugers are either valued as collectable (all original; matching) or not.

I think that this one is overpriced even at retail.

Marc

[siegersallee]

I want to thank all for comments and I apologize if I put this post in the wrong place...my bad.

The thing that most impacted me is the advice to look for all matching numbers on the gun, the mag, AND the grips.

I knew about the pistol parts...but, I did not know the mag and the grips were also numbered.

I have learned a lot about Lugers just by the comments that you guys provided and I do very much thank you for them.

I am also happy to hear this seller is reputable and is known to deal because I saw another one that I like even better.

Also, as to collect ability, I had no idea of what to look for, so again...I am very appreciative of your collective advice.

Vielen Dank.

Richard.

[Edward Tinker]

Richard, you should read all the comments, this in particular!

All matching (except magazine)

Find out what era you want, what type, if Army, later police, luftwaffe, or navy

Then buy books, read the info in the FAQ and the stickies here, read, read, we are more than happy to help, but I have met many old time collectors with many restored or boosted guns in their collection that they bought when younger as originals...

[Norme]

Hi Richard, Just to be clear, I assume you are looking for an Imperial era military Luger. During this period there were two manufacturers, DWM a privately owned company, and Erfurt, a state owned arsenal. Numbering and inspection marking on DWMs was less rigid than on Erfurts, and unnumbered DWM grips are not uncommon. Erfurt however, numbered and inspected everything, including grip screws prior to !916. The photo shows a typical set of Erfurt grips. With regard to matching magazines, they are quite uncommon on military guns and most collectors are happy with a non-matching magazine that is period correct. A lot of "matching" magazines are faked, another reason to buy from a reputable source. Good luck, Norm

[siegersallee]

Hi Eduard,

Yes, your advice is good and I am listening.

There is a gun show in Norcross, GA (Eastman).
There is a dealer that will be there who has a 1913 Erfurt Luger with all matching numbers including the mag and the barrel is supposed to be pristine.

I will see it Saturday.

I am just a little suspicious about a Luger that old having a pristine barrel.

Anyway, the price is suppose to be under $1500.00.

I like the idea of post 1910, pre-WWI luger, though I'd really prefer a 1914 Erfurt with rig...I think that may be too much to ask for especially since my ceiling is about $2K.

All the information I have gleaned here will at least give me something to work with so that I at least will not be a complete fool ( I hope ).

I am looking around for the "definitive" book on Lugers.

My interest is (right now) is Erfurts in collectable condition. I'd like a 1914, but I am looking a 1916 at Simpsoon LTD and of course the 1913 this weekend.

My price expectation is about $2K but, I am not going to throw money away on an Erfurt that is just over-priced. So I am being cautious.

You guys are great...you are not being all snooty because I am a noob...

Richard

[Edward Tinker]

Richard, I am guessing when you say 1914 erfurt, you are referring to a Artillery or LP08 model?

As some folks call the lugers post mid-late 1913 a '1914' model, as it has a stock lug on it.

A definitive book on WW1 era would be hard to say, but Imperial Lugers by Jan Still (out of print) and his newer one with lugers and other info is available through him and is called Central Powers, you can buy it from him or on-line from other folks.

Other luger books are discussed in 'stickies' at the forums, especially the new collectors area, etc.

Ed

[lugersrkewl]

Take your time. Learn first then buy.. lugers have been around a long time they will continue to be. In my little experience its better to have cash and knowledge of the guns then no cash and no idea what you have

[padredan]

Roger That

[siegersallee]

With respect to what type of Erfurt I am looking for, I want the non-arty model.

I think the regualer 4in ( 100mm ) is the quintisential, definitive Luger: no slight to arty model enthusiasts, that is just my humble opinion.

Growing up I remember from the movies German officers always with a "regular" Luger, so that is what is ingrained in my mind as the "proper" one.

Actually, I had not even known that there was an arty model. At first I thought someone had modified the thing.

Now I know that there is a strong following for the arty model and they are rare and highly collectable; but, I am still a "regular" Luger kinda guy.

Richard.

[GySgt1811]

Richard,

I think you just defined for me the attachment I, too, have for the 4" Imperial. All Lugers are great, but the 4" Imperial bespeaks the essence of the "Prussian Officer Corp."

And, by the way, I'm intrigued by your avatar. Is that proper looking young Kadet perhaps a relative?

Best regards,

John C.

[SIGP2101]

Why does this one has artillery notch on the slide? Is that normal for Erfurt Lugers?
If it is not normal - than barrel is replacement. If the barrel was replaced than other parts as well do not match on this one.

[Ron Wood]

Originally Posted by SIGP2101

Why does this one has artillery notch on the slide? Is that normal for Erfurt Lugers?
If it is not normal - than barrel is replacement. If the barrel was replaced than other parts as well do not match on this one.

Joe,
After 1914 all Erfurt Lugers were manufactured with the notch on the receiver regardless of barrel length. Even though Erfurt only produced the LP08 in 1914, once they set up the production line to cut the notch they never went back to a standard receiver.

[Douglas Jr.]

Originally Posted by Ron Wood

Joe,
After 1914 all Erfurt Lugers were manufactured with the notch on the receiver regardless of barrel length. Even though Erfurt only produced the LP08 in 1914, once they set up the production line to cut the notch they never went back to a standard receiver.

Ron,

I bet it was a mistake while typing: this feature was introduced by Erfurt in mid or late 1916. There are 1916 dated Erfurts without the rear sight latch...

Best wishes,
Douglas

[Norme]

Hi Douglas, I think both you and Ron are correct. Once Erfurt switched their machinery over to notched receivers they kept making them that way until the end of production in 1918. However, they evidently had a lot of un-notched receivers in stock, and a lot of them show up dated 1916 (there were no 1915 dated Erfurts produced). Regards, Norm