Luger ID

I recently came into possession of a luger. I do not know much about lugers except what I have learned over the last 3 days. (Thanks mostly to this forum). The gun has very few markings, but this is the info I have come up with:

Toggle Inscription is DWM. No chamber inscription. Square toggle knobs. No grip safetly, thumb safety only. Safe is down position, marked gesichert when safe, nothing when safe is off. The under side of the 4" barrel is stamped with the crown N, along with the numbers 808 and a small mark which appears to be one lightning bolt S. The toggle also has the crown N and there is an upright crown N on the left side of the receiver. The front of the frame is marked 808 and has that same lightning bolt S, (my wife thinks it looks like a sideways sparrow). The trigger, extractor rear, locking boltand bolt catch are all stamped 08, so it appears the gun is all matching. The grips are wood, and checkered (well defined). The front and rear sights are both fixed, and the gun appears chambered for .30 luger, (9mm will not completely go into the breech). There is a stock lug. I am guessing the strawing is 50% and the bluing is 75%, and appears to be original. It came with 1 magazine, black, w/bakelite(or plastic) bottom, no markings anywhere on the magazine.

The only pitting I see appears to be minor. (on the very end of the barrel and on the top of the extractor.) The two flaws I see are impact marks where it appears someone hit on the disassembly lug to get it back into place, small dents, but I can see them and the side plate has a small gouge where the gun may have been dropped.


I am looking for any additional info and wondering if it should be considered a 'shooter' or a 'collector'. I accepted it in trade to clear a debt, thought it would be nice to shoot. (He owed me about $400.00).

The person I got it from bought it at a pawn shop and paid about $400.00 for it, never fired it. He was told it was a 1908 luger chambered for 9mm. (as shown on the bill of sale) I am in the process of cleaning it, it appears to have been neglected for a quite some time.


I look forward to any info and opinions as to whether I should have just waited for cash for the debt.


Thanks,

Tom.

[Johnny Peppers]

Tom,

From your description it appears that you have a 1920's era commercial Luger. The 808 would be the serial number and the figure you described would be the letter suffix of the serial number. The letter suffix on these pistols began with the letter i and went into the late u or early v range. The caliber is .30 Luger or 7.65mm Luger from your description. The magazine sounds like a later aftermarket magazine, and the original would have been an unmarked wood bottom magazine. You did alright at $400 as I would estimate the value in the $550/650 range.

Well, I never thought about the barrel being neutralized, so thanks for that thought, but happily, there is rifling to be seen from one end of the barrel to the other. However, now I am confused as the caliber could be .30 Luger or 7.65mm Luger... how can I tell which I should be using, or will either work? (or, are they the same?)


Tom.

[BILL]

.30Luger and 7.65mm Luger are the same..

[Thor]

As is 7.65 mm Parabellum

It sounds to me that you may have a 1908 first issue commercial or military. Remove the barrel assembly and look into the "well" a square hole in the frame. There should be a inspectors marking in the shape of a funny "Y". If the the "Y" has a "3" next to it, it is a 1908 first issue military, if the "Y" is there without the "3" it is a 1908 commercial model. Does the action hold open with the magazine in the gun and without a round? These guns were issued without the hold open feature however most of the military versions were returned to the another factory to have it added and the commercials were not altered. Another thing to check is are the proofing are located on the left side of the gun?


Best regards,

Rod

Rod:


Well, I looked into the well, and there is a lightly stamped 'H' and a very deeply stamped 'S', there are no proof marks on the left side of the gun, except the crowned 'N' on the left side of the receiver.


Tom.

[Johnny Peppers]

REB,

You may be absolutely right that Tom's Luger is a 1908 first issue; as I was simply taking a guess with the information supplied by him. However, according to the information given the Luger has a stock lug and is caliber 7.65mm Luger, both of which would rule out a 1908 first issue.

Johnny,


Your correct the stock lug removes it from being 1908 - however I have a 1908 commercial in .30 cal. I have no listing for the well markings he is describing any thoughts on this.


Rod

If this pistol was a 1908 Commerical, in addition to not having a stock lug it would have a five digit numeric serial number without a suffix letter. Sounds more like a 20 commerical to me.