Cartridges are too short - Page 2

Puretexan · 07-05-2017, 12:43 PM

Man this is a hard room to play. Have to be perfect on your posts. Folks remember if I knew all of this , I wouldn't be posting questions! But thanks to those who help instead of make you look stupid.

DonVoigt · 07-05-2017, 01:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Puretexan

Man this is a hard room to play. Have to be perfect on your posts. Folks remember if I knew all of this , I wouldn't be posting questions! But thanks to those who help instead of make you look stupid.

Sometimes you got to get it right-
bullets are the little things that go out the barrel-
Cartridges are where the OAL matters.

Though some "bullets" may be or are too short to reload in the .30 luger.

Lighten up- bullets matter to reloaders- cartridges to a way bigger audience- which is why I suggested the change.

Not to make you look stupid.

DavidJayUden · 07-05-2017, 01:13 PM

The more posts a thread gets, the more likely it is to run off the rails and end up in the weeds.
We all come away feeling whooped every now and then, but we keep coming back to collectively learn more.
Part of the fun, I guess.
dju

Chickenthief · 07-05-2017, 02:20 PM

Dont even get a Limey started on this!
He would call the cartridge for a bullet and a bullet for a bullet head.

If you involve journalists all standards are off.

And then there is the good old:

Edward Tinker · 07-05-2017, 03:07 PM

I have been waiting a long time to use this picture

4 Scale · 07-06-2017, 08:50 PM

I have a 1906 .30 Luger pistol that is finicky re: ammo, it won't reliably chamber. 30 Luger Fiocchi but does reliably chamber Prvi. In comparing OAL, Prvi is longer than Fiocchi. As I can find no other physical difference between the rounds I have concluded that Fiocchi OAL is too short for that particular Luger.

Fiocchi chambers just fine in my three other Lugers chambered for .30 Luger. So, I conclude most Lugers chambered in .30 Luger can tolerate shorter ammo (as Dwight explains in post #11) but if a FTF (nose-high jam) is encountered, it is worth testing longer ammo in that pistol.

Puretexan · 07-07-2017, 02:55 AM

There was a guy on youtube that was having the same problem with a 45 magazine.
He noticed when he loaded several rounds in, that the top round would wiggle up and
down at the front. He solved it with a stronger spring in the magazine. maybe that is
the answer to Luger problems.

DonVoigt · 07-07-2017, 11:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Puretexan

There was a guy on youtube that was having the same problem with a 45 magazine.
He noticed when he loaded several rounds in, that the top round would wiggle up and
down at the front. He solved it with a stronger spring in the magazine. maybe that is
the answer to Luger problems.

That is correct, Tex,- a weak spring causes all sorts of problems.

Wolf offers "extra 10% power" round springs and new zig-zag springs for the later mags.

GT also has springs, and when he works on/ re-works a mag it most of the time gets a new spring.

A really weak spring won't raise a cartridge fast enough to chamber, nor will it operate the hold open.

Major Tom · 07-07-2017, 09:30 AM

I have found the Hornady 124gr. 9mm mimics the truncated nose of the original round. I'm away from my reloading room, but, I think the Hornady bullet is lettered HTX or ?, it is a hollow point.

cirelaw · 07-07-2017, 02:24 PM

Do gun ranges make more money selling ammo or collecting brass?

ithacaartist · 07-07-2017, 04:12 PM

Eric,

A retail markup for ammo might be around 25% Scrap brass can be sold for around $1.50 per pound. I think the answer would generally be the ammo sales.

DavidJayUden · 07-07-2017, 05:10 PM

My guess would be that salvage brass sales would be behind ammo sales, target sales, range time and firearm rental/sales. However the price of pick-up brass goes up sharply once sorted by caliber.
dju

cirelaw · 07-07-2017, 08:12 PM

http://rangereport.org/clean-up-on-discarded-ammo/

Puretexan · 07-07-2017, 09:48 PM

My indoor range doesn't want you to pickup your brass. I have a friend that machines
brass quite a bit. Probably 30% of his business is turning brass rings for pressure washers. He has an immense brass left over amount. The price jumps up and down
just like gold.

DonVoigt · 07-07-2017, 10:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Puretexan

My indoor range doesn't want you to pickup your brass. I have a friend that machines
brass quite a bit. Probably 30% of his business is turning brass rings for pressure washers. He has an immense brass left over amount. The price jumps up and down
just like gold.

Price for "yellow brass" scrap this month- so far- range $1.24 to $2.20 per lb.

cirelaw · 07-07-2017, 11:23 PM

What happens to all the toxic lead?

DavidJayUden · 07-08-2017, 09:25 AM

RE: toxic lead, At trap and skeet ranges we have lead re-claimers who strip the soil, sift it, and sell the used shot back (to me) for about 3/4-4/5 the price of new. I've shot reclaimed shot for years and years.
I suspect that the indoor ranges have a similar program.
dju

DonVoigt · 07-08-2017, 10:48 AM

Lead- we have thoroughly hijacked Paul's original thread.

Just remember, lead is only "toxic" if you eat it, drink it, breathe the fumes if it is molten- or if you get shot with a lead "bullet".

Better not to get me started on those "toxic" chemicals, like table salt, water, oxygen, and on and on; least of all those "extremely toxic" chemicals we choose to call "medicines"!

Puretexan · 07-08-2017, 12:36 PM

Don I think we got about all we could out of Cartridges, so might as well change a
little.
By the way I went into Walmart and asked the guy where the Cartridges were.
He said ...over by the printers. Then I asked where the bullets were and he said they are in Sporting Goods.

rhuff · 07-08-2017, 04:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Puretexan

Don I think we got about all we could out of Cartridges, so might as well change a
little.
By the way I went into Walmart and asked the guy where the Cartridges were.
He said ...over by the printers. Then I asked where the bullets were and he said they are in Sporting Goods.

Well you are in Texas, after all.....

07-07-2017, 09:30 AM	#9
Major Tom User Join Date: Jan 2017 Location: S.E. Iowa Posts: 484 Thanks: 533 Thanked 229 Times in 125 Posts	I have found the Hornady 124gr. 9mm mimics the truncated nose of the original round. I'm away from my reloading room, but, I think the Hornady bullet is lettered HTX or ?, it is a hollow point. __________________ I Build Custom Pistol Boxes

07-08-2017, 10:48 AM	#18
DonVoigt User Join Date: Apr 2015 Location: near Charlotte NC Posts: 4,681 Thanks: 1,443 Thanked 4,356 Times in 2,041 Posts	Lead- we have thoroughly hijacked Paul's original thread. Just remember, lead is only "toxic" if you eat it, drink it, breathe the fumes if it is molten- or if you get shot with a lead "bullet". Better not to get me started on those "toxic" chemicals, like table salt, water, oxygen, and on and on; least of all those "extremely toxic" chemicals we choose to call "medicines"! __________________ 03man(Don Voigt); Luger student and collector. Looking for DWM side plate: 69 ; Dreyse 1907 pistol K.S. Gendarmerie

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07-05-2017, 12:43 PM	#1
Puretexan User Join Date: May 2017 Location: Pearland Texas Posts: 176 Thanks: 11 Thanked 70 Times in 36 Posts	Man this is a hard room to play. Have to be perfect on your posts. Folks remember if I knew all of this , I wouldn't be posting questions! But thanks to those who help instead of make you look stupid.

07-05-2017, 01:13 PM	#3
DavidJayUden Patron LugerForum Patron Join Date: Nov 2008 Posts: 4,047 Thanks: 578 Thanked 1,414 Times in 887 Posts	The more posts a thread gets, the more likely it is to run off the rails and end up in the weeds. We all come away feeling whooped every now and then, but we keep coming back to collectively learn more. Part of the fun, I guess. dju

07-05-2017, 02:20 PM	#4
Chickenthief User Join Date: Dec 2016 Location: Denmark Posts: 135 Thanks: 0 Thanked 131 Times in 48 Posts	Dont even get a Limey started on this! He would call the cartridge for a bullet and a bullet for a bullet head. If you involve journalists all standards are off. And then there is the good old:

07-06-2017, 08:50 PM	#6
4 Scale User Join Date: Nov 2014 Posts: 544 Thanks: 194 Thanked 490 Times in 251 Posts	I have a 1906 .30 Luger pistol that is finicky re: ammo, it won't reliably chamber. 30 Luger Fiocchi but does reliably chamber Prvi. In comparing OAL, Prvi is longer than Fiocchi. As I can find no other physical difference between the rounds I have concluded that Fiocchi OAL is too short for that particular Luger. Fiocchi chambers just fine in my three other Lugers chambered for .30 Luger. So, I conclude most Lugers chambered in .30 Luger can tolerate shorter ammo (as Dwight explains in post #11) but if a FTF (nose-high jam) is encountered, it is worth testing longer ammo in that pistol.

07-07-2017, 02:55 AM	#7
Puretexan User Join Date: May 2017 Location: Pearland Texas Posts: 176 Thanks: 11 Thanked 70 Times in 36 Posts	There was a guy on youtube that was having the same problem with a 45 magazine. He noticed when he loaded several rounds in, that the top round would wiggle up and down at the front. He solved it with a stronger spring in the magazine. maybe that is the answer to Luger problems.

07-07-2017, 04:12 PM	#11
ithacaartist Twice a Lifer Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Mar 2011 Location: Atop the highest hill in Schuyler County NY Posts: 3,401 Thanks: 7,558 Thanked 2,643 Times in 1,393 Posts	Eric, A retail markup for ammo might be around 25% Scrap brass can be sold for around $1.50 per pound. I think the answer would generally be the ammo sales. __________________ "... Liberty is the seed and soil, the air and light, the dew and rain of progress, love and joy."-- Robert Greene Ingersoll 1894

07-07-2017, 05:10 PM	#12
DavidJayUden Patron LugerForum Patron Join Date: Nov 2008 Posts: 4,047 Thanks: 578 Thanked 1,414 Times in 887 Posts	My guess would be that salvage brass sales would be behind ammo sales, target sales, range time and firearm rental/sales. However the price of pick-up brass goes up sharply once sorted by caliber. dju

07-07-2017, 09:48 PM	#14
Puretexan User Join Date: May 2017 Location: Pearland Texas Posts: 176 Thanks: 11 Thanked 70 Times in 36 Posts	My indoor range doesn't want you to pickup your brass. I have a friend that machines brass quite a bit. Probably 30% of his business is turning brass rings for pressure washers. He has an immense brass left over amount. The price jumps up and down just like gold.

07-07-2017, 11:23 PM	#16
cirelaw Lifer Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: PORT ST LUCIE, FLORIDA Posts: 12,216 Thanks: 6,209 Thanked 4,138 Times in 2,176 Posts	What happens to all the toxic lead?

07-08-2017, 09:25 AM	#17
DavidJayUden Patron LugerForum Patron Join Date: Nov 2008 Posts: 4,047 Thanks: 578 Thanked 1,414 Times in 887 Posts	RE: toxic lead, At trap and skeet ranges we have lead re-claimers who strip the soil, sift it, and sell the used shot back (to me) for about 3/4-4/5 the price of new. I've shot reclaimed shot for years and years. I suspect that the indoor ranges have a similar program. dju

07-08-2017, 12:36 PM	#19
Puretexan User Join Date: May 2017 Location: Pearland Texas Posts: 176 Thanks: 11 Thanked 70 Times in 36 Posts	Don I think we got about all we could out of Cartridges, so might as well change a little. By the way I went into Walmart and asked the guy where the Cartridges were. He said ...over by the printers. Then I asked where the bullets were and he said they are in Sporting Goods.