I had a crazy idea, Looking for some input...

mundy928 · 11-12-2015, 08:21 PM

Are your dollar figures based on actual estimates from a manufacturer? If not, a reality check is in order.

Ignoring stocking availability, the cost to purchase every part of a Luger at today's individual retail price would be $966.60 for all parts except the frame. Lugerman's only Frame is $350.

https://www.gunpartscorp.com/Manufac...093.htm?page=1

http://www.lugerman.com/Pages/MainPages/Parts.html

http://www.e-sarcoinc.com/lugerp08.aspx?page=2

Individual retail is always more expensive then package wholesale. usually by a large multiplier. especially in a market where there is no package wholesale.

Here are some examples of 1911 parts kits containing the same types of parts and quantities as required. Many of these kits are from real small time manufacturers
http://www.e-sarcoinc.com/partskits.aspx
http://www.uspatriotarmory.com/1911-...arts_c_79.html
http://aresarmor.com/store/Category/1911

100% Frames
http://www.brownells.com/items/1911-frame-kit.aspx
http://www.1911store.com/sti-1911-fr...tandard-3.aspx
http://www.shootersconnectionstore.c...pian-C490.aspx

Guaranteeing plug-and-play will be an issue.
1911 kits are usually not plug and play either, the good ones however only need a dremel and some other basic tools to smooth out problems. Stuff that can be done on a standard gun hobbist's kitchen table. I think a lot of problems can be solved by using a high quality numbers matching gun as the template for measurement.

The Luger is a very niche market. Mauser/Interarms and the various incarnations of Orimar didn't manage to crack it in any serious way, Norinco built prototypes but decided against production. I don't mean to be negative, but you are swimming against a strong tide. They were trying to make a profit selling a completed collector gun on the retail market with associated overhead, marketing, and liability while trying to keep the cost lower than the real gun 20 years ago. I'm talking about selling a wholesale parts kit, with no advertising or overhead.

You might get serious traction if you make this in cal. .45acp.
There are so few .45 acp versions that I feel there would be way more problems. the idea is to make good shooters to help out the hobby.

Thanks for the input. Negativity is a good thing, that's how I can find out if this is a good or bad idea.

mundy928 · 11-12-2015, 08:33 PM

1. Mauser made new made lugers in the 1970's, and they sold only okay, plus you can still get them new in box for around $1000-$1400 My understanding was that you could still get real surplus Lugers very cheap in the 1970s. valid point however, most people have to do a fair amount of digging to find one and by that time they already discounted buying a luger or bought something else. (i wanted one and couldn't find one for sale at a reasonable price)

2. Mitchel arms (and other names) made them for years in stainless and they have always had issues with mechanically having problems. my understanding (and I could be wrong) is that their build quality was pretty junky for what they cost.

3. Rumours - I have heard rumours of 45 lugers being made at least twice in the last 10 years using CNC, one failed, the other one is still trying.
I had heard he was hand making them for crazy money. I wouldn't even attempt it. it seems like a whole other level of discussion.

4. I know a guy who makes parts, they look very good, but think that the amount would be about double what you state or more. That's valid. This all comes down to economy of scale
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11-12-2015, 08:21 PM	#1
mundy928 User Join Date: Jul 2013 Posts: 7 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Are your dollar figures based on actual estimates from a manufacturer? If not, a reality check is in order. Ignoring stocking availability, the cost to purchase every part of a Luger at today's individual retail price would be $966.60 for all parts except the frame. Lugerman's only Frame is $350. https://www.gunpartscorp.com/Manufac...093.htm?page=1 http://www.lugerman.com/Pages/MainPages/Parts.html http://www.e-sarcoinc.com/lugerp08.aspx?page=2 Individual retail is always more expensive then package wholesale. usually by a large multiplier. especially in a market where there is no package wholesale. Here are some examples of 1911 parts kits containing the same types of parts and quantities as required. Many of these kits are from real small time manufacturers http://www.e-sarcoinc.com/partskits.aspx http://www.uspatriotarmory.com/1911-...arts_c_79.html http://aresarmor.com/store/Category/1911 100% Frames http://www.brownells.com/items/1911-frame-kit.aspx http://www.1911store.com/sti-1911-fr...tandard-3.aspx http://www.shootersconnectionstore.c...pian-C490.aspx Guaranteeing plug-and-play will be an issue. 1911 kits are usually not plug and play either, the good ones however only need a dremel and some other basic tools to smooth out problems. Stuff that can be done on a standard gun hobbist's kitchen table. I think a lot of problems can be solved by using a high quality numbers matching gun as the template for measurement. The Luger is a very niche market. Mauser/Interarms and the various incarnations of Orimar didn't manage to crack it in any serious way, Norinco built prototypes but decided against production. I don't mean to be negative, but you are swimming against a strong tide. They were trying to make a profit selling a completed collector gun on the retail market with associated overhead, marketing, and liability while trying to keep the cost lower than the real gun 20 years ago. I'm talking about selling a wholesale parts kit, with no advertising or overhead. You might get serious traction if you make this in cal. .45acp. There are so few .45 acp versions that I feel there would be way more problems. the idea is to make good shooters to help out the hobby. Thanks for the input. Negativity is a good thing, that's how I can find out if this is a good or bad idea.

11-12-2015, 08:33 PM	#2
mundy928 User Join Date: Jul 2013 Posts: 7 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	1. Mauser made new made lugers in the 1970's, and they sold only okay, plus you can still get them new in box for around $1000-$1400 My understanding was that you could still get real surplus Lugers very cheap in the 1970s. valid point however, most people have to do a fair amount of digging to find one and by that time they already discounted buying a luger or bought something else. (i wanted one and couldn't find one for sale at a reasonable price) 2. Mitchel arms (and other names) made them for years in stainless and they have always had issues with mechanically having problems. my understanding (and I could be wrong) is that their build quality was pretty junky for what they cost. 3. Rumours - I have heard rumours of 45 lugers being made at least twice in the last 10 years using CNC, one failed, the other one is still trying. I had heard he was hand making them for crazy money. I wouldn't even attempt it. it seems like a whole other level of discussion. 4. I know a guy who makes parts, they look very good, but think that the amount would be about double what you state or more. That's valid. This all comes down to economy of scale __________________