Luger Target Trigger Modification

[Blastattack]

Originally Posted by Michael Zeleny

Making a Luger trigger mimic that of an M1911 is a fool's errand. In effect, this method eliminates the first stage of the trigger action that was designed and built in a two stage pattern. It is an unsafe procedure that cannot be recommended under any circumstances.

I challenge that statement. What evidence do you have to support any of that?

I would hardly qualify the Luger as having a "two stage" trigger. A proper two stage trigger divides the total pull between the two stages, requiring a greater and longer pull in the first stage, and requiring a shorter but much lighter (not to mention crisp) pull in the second. The Luger's pull consists of taking the slack out f the mechanism, which takes a couple ounces, and then the full 7-8lbs in the last bit of movement. I also fail to see how such modifications are unsafe when done properly. If the instructions are followed to a T and the user does not over adjust the trigger to break on a hair, the pistol should work perfectly fine and be 100% safe. I'm sure Herbert Werle does a very similar procedure to this, and he seems to enjoy a very good reputation, both here and abroad.

[Michael Zeleny]

Originally Posted by Blastattack

I challenge that statement. What evidence do you have to support any of that?

I would hardly qualify the Luger as having a "two stage" trigger. A proper two stage trigger divides the total pull between the two stages, requiring a greater and longer pull in the first stage, and requiring a shorter but much lighter (not to mention crisp) pull in the second. The Luger's pull consists of taking the slack out f the mechanism, which takes a couple ounces, and then the full 7-8lbs in the last bit of movement. I also fail to see how such modifications are unsafe when done properly. If the instructions are followed to a T and the user does not over adjust the trigger to break on a hair, the pistol should work perfectly fine and be 100% safe. I'm sure Herbert Werle does a very similar procedure to this, and he seems to enjoy a very good reputation, both here and abroad.

Please Google "Druckpunkt Parabellum".

[Blastattack]

Originally Posted by Michael Zeleny

Please Google "Druckpunkt Parabellum".

I'm not sure I understand. Clearly the Swiss devised a method to improve the trigger pull of their Lugers. I cannot and will not argue the effectiveness and relative merits of their modification. However, that does not explain why the method described in the article is inherently wrong or dangerous. It simply seems like another way to skin a cat. If done properly, with great care and attention, as well as the proper tools, I cannot see how it would be any less effective than what the Swiss devised.

[Michael Zeleny]

Originally Posted by Blastattack

I'm not sure I understand. Clearly the Swiss devised a method to improve the trigger pull of their Lugers. I cannot and will not argue the effectiveness and relative merits of their modification. However, that does not explain why the method described in the article is inherently wrong or dangerous. It simply seems like another way to skin a cat. If done properly, with great care and attention, as well as the proper tools, I cannot see how it would be any less effective than what the Swiss devised.

Both DWM and W+F Parabellum factory manuals identify the trigger pull as possessed of a Druckpunkt, i.e. two staged. We could go on to talk sear engagement geometry, but I'm quite happy to rest my case on this appeal to the bona fide supreme Luger authority. The distinct stages are especially noticeable on Swiss M1929 Lugers.

[Blastattack]

Originally Posted by Michael Zeleny

Both DWM and W+F Parabellum factory manuals identify the trigger pull as possessed of a Druckpunkt, i.e. two staged. We could go on to talk sear engagement geometry, but I'm quite happy to rest my case on this appeal to the bona fide supreme Luger authority. The distinct stages are especially noticeable on Swiss M1929 Lugers.

I'm just saying that in my limited experience with Luger the trigger has not resembled anything close to a two stage pull. Maybe it was and I just didn't feel it, I don't know. It just felt heavy, period. Regardless, you have not even attempted to defend your original statement that "It is an unsafe procedure that cannot be recommended under any circumstances". How is it unsafe and why would you not recommend it? If properly executed by a competent machinist, what specific procedure renders the modifications unsafe?As to the elimination of the first stage; so what? Just because something is or was designed as such, does not make it right or better than anything else. Why can't a well tuned Luger trigger emulate that of a well tuned 1911? Unless you plan on illustrating why these modifications are dangerous, I see no reason for you to bother mentioning it.

I'm more than happy to listen to a counter argument, but arguing something based on status quo simply does not fly.

[Michael Zeleny]

Originally Posted by Blastattack

Why can't a well tuned Luger trigger emulate that of a well tuned 1911?

Because a striker fired pistol requires a broader safety margin in sear engagement, than a hammer fired one.

[G.T.]

take up isn't undesirable or critical, and as mentioned earlier, probably only a few ounces... probalby need not be addressed for any purpose?? Over travel is probably not wanted.. especially excessive.. I'm pretty sure most lugers don't suffer from this anyway.. most of the ones i have had broke clean at the far end of the trigger travel anyway... But, that being said... Pull weight reduction is probably important, and also a crisp sear break, which probably will require some part modification. ...???... That's where one needs to dwell... two distinct stages are necessary in a Luger.. Not really a two stage trigger... ,,, Want to spend some time, it can be done.. Probably as good as any in a one off situation.. Hard to beat the 1911 in this arena. But, I happen to like Lugers.....Best to all, til...lat'r...GT