Let the “Anyone interested in Tokarev?” thread continue

MJRiggs · 04-09-2012, 06:36 PM

A couple of weeks ago there was an ad for a Chinese Type 54 Tokarev pistol for sale that kicked off a very interesting discussion about bring-backs from the Viet Nam conflict. Even though it was a great discussion it was pointed out that these types of inputs were not appropriate for the For Sale section of the forum.

As the new proud owner of the pictured pistol (Thanks Alvin!!) I’d like to get the discussion inputs going again – so, who has bring-back stories to share.

Since this is my first Tokarev and I’d also love to learn more about it.

The title of the original discussion the For Sale section is “Anyone interested in Tokarev?” If anyone knows how to post a link to the ad in this new thread, or if it’s possible for the moderators to tie the ad comments to this thread I’d appreciate it.

Mike

alvin · 04-09-2012, 06:54 PM

Most "Type 54" pistols that I have seen on U.S. gun market were made in 1966 or 1967.

The gun has three Hanzi "5 4 Type" on top of the slide. Serial starts with year of manufacturing, 14 is 1967 (1954 + 14 - 1 = 1967), 66 is factory code. Before 1980s, there were no "commercial" guns in China. All guns were made for government, or exported (free of charge) to support global revolutionary of proletariat.

Patronen · 04-09-2012, 06:54 PM

Although the book is about Soviet Russian Tokarev's. The book by Fred Datig on the Tokarev TT is informative with regards to the design of the pistol and the pistols designer Fedor V. Tokarev and the pistols Browning influence. Recommended reading for Tokarev owners.

TheRomanhistorian · 04-09-2012, 07:05 PM

What an excellent idea and a nice catch, Mike. I really enjoyed the stories that everyone shared in that thread and I hope they can be given life here, too!

The stories really remind us that these were tools and possessions of real people (much like the artefacts I show to my students) and it's great to keep them passed around for a wide audience.

Curly1 · 04-09-2012, 07:07 PM

Link to aformentioned thread.

http://forum.lugerforum.com/showthread.php?t=27977

alvin · 04-09-2012, 07:30 PM

Back a few years ago, one seller told a story on the advertisement (not this one). His Tokarev was near excellent, but also came with mismatched magazine. His story was that GI found Viet Gong's secret storage and captured hundreds of unissued Tokarevs. For each pistol, they opened the slide and removed the magazine to make sure it's not loaded. Then, the pistol was thrown into a pile and the magazine into another pile.

===

"Type 54" has an elder brother, "Type 51", which is also a Tokarev. It's pretty rare in the U.S. The marking is different, mechanically identical. What I heard was "Type 51" was assembled from Soviet Union supplied parts. After Korean war, Chinese was able to setup machinaries and tools to make it, and the gun was redesignated as "Type 54".

Edward Tinker · 04-09-2012, 08:39 PM

Not to try and sell my books, but I have two bring back books out (paperback) and about to send the third to Brad Simpson for publication

I look for those with as much provenance as possible......

MJRiggs · 04-10-2012, 01:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Curly1

Link to aformentioned thread.

http://forum.lugerforum.com/showthread.php?t=27977

Gary,

How did you get the link to the orginal thread? I tried to do it but could not figure out how to reference the other thread.

Mike

Curly1 · 04-10-2012, 04:01 PM

Mike you would go to the other thread then do a right mouse click copy of th Http in the address window of your browser then go to this thread and right click paste it.

alvin · 04-11-2012, 06:18 AM

I had not shot this pistol while it's in my collection. Just saw a video showing shooting a Type 54 in range recently. Enjoy!

video:
http://v.youku.com/v_show/id_XMzc1OTc1NTYw.html

the guns:

MJRiggs · 04-11-2012, 11:15 AM

For some reason my computer only shows the forum address but not the thread number in the brower window.

Mike

SIGP2101 · 04-11-2012, 03:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MJRiggs

For some reason my computer only shows the forum address but not the thread number in the brower window.

Mike

What is the browser u r using?

In IE just right click inside the very thread you want to reference, than click on the 'Properties'. Copy address (URL) and paste where you want it. I can't do this in Firefox.

MJRiggs · 04-11-2012, 03:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SIGP2101

What is the browser u r using?

In IE just right click inside the very thread you want to reference, than click on the 'Properties'. Copy address (URL) and paste where you want it. I can't do this in Firefox.

Thanks SIGP2101,

That worked just fine. I was looking in the URL window at the top of IE.

Mike

MJRiggs · 05-11-2012, 01:48 PM

Alvin,

I took the pistol to the range last week and fired two magazines worth of ammo. Everything worked just fine, and the pistol was very accurate with a smooth trigger. I’d never fired a 7.62x25 before and I found the recoil to be pretty close to a 9mm round but with a much brighter flash.

Now my challenge is to get it as clean as it was when you sold it to me.

Mike

04-09-2012, 06:36 PM	#1
MJRiggs User Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: SE Virginia Posts: 47 Thanks: 0 Thanked 2 Times in 2 Posts	Let the “Anyone interested in Tokarev?” thread continue A couple of weeks ago there was an ad for a Chinese Type 54 Tokarev pistol for sale that kicked off a very interesting discussion about bring-backs from the Viet Nam conflict. Even though it was a great discussion it was pointed out that these types of inputs were not appropriate for the For Sale section of the forum. As the new proud owner of the pictured pistol (Thanks Alvin!!) I’d like to get the discussion inputs going again – so, who has bring-back stories to share. Since this is my first Tokarev and I’d also love to learn more about it. The title of the original discussion the For Sale section is “Anyone interested in Tokarev?” If anyone knows how to post a link to the ad in this new thread, or if it’s possible for the moderators to tie the ad comments to this thread I’d appreciate it. Mike Attached Images

04-09-2012, 06:54 PM	#3
Patronen User Join Date: Jun 2010 Posts: 312 Thanks: 335 Thanked 93 Times in 70 Posts	Although the book is about Soviet Russian Tokarev's. The book by Fred Datig on the Tokarev TT is informative with regards to the design of the pistol and the pistols designer Fedor V. Tokarev and the pistols Browning influence. Recommended reading for Tokarev owners. __________________ Dave

04-09-2012, 07:05 PM	#4
TheRomanhistorian User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Seattle, WA Posts: 301 Thanks: 170 Thanked 88 Times in 64 Posts	What an excellent idea and a nice catch, Mike. I really enjoyed the stories that everyone shared in that thread and I hope they can be given life here, too! The stories really remind us that these were tools and possessions of real people (much like the artefacts I show to my students) and it's great to keep them passed around for a wide audience. __________________ Michael Nos morituri te salutant - Supposed saying of the gladiators to the emperor ('We, who are about to die, salute you.') 'We are the lantern bearers, my friend; for us to keep something burning, to carry what light we can forward into the darkness and the wind' - From Rosemary Sutcliff's The Lantern Bearers

04-09-2012, 07:07 PM	#5
Curly1 User Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: Upstate New York Posts: 1,247 Thanks: 125 Thanked 717 Times in 374 Posts	Link to aformentioned thread. http://forum.lugerforum.com/showthread.php?t=27977 __________________ Laugh hard and often. Gary

04-09-2012, 08:39 PM	#7
Edward Tinker Super Moderator Eternal Lifer LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: North of Spokane, WA Posts: 15,966 Thanks: 2,066 Thanked 4,595 Times in 2,116 Posts	Not to try and sell my books, but I have two bring back books out (paperback) and about to send the third to Brad Simpson for publication I look for those with as much provenance as possible...... __________________ Edward Tinker ************ Co-Author of Police Lugers - Co-Author of Simson Lugers Author of Veteran Bring Backs Vol I, Vol II, Vol III and Vol IV

04-09-2012, 06:54 PM	#2
alvin User Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: US Posts: 3,843 Thanks: 132 Thanked 729 Times in 438 Posts	Most "Type 54" pistols that I have seen on U.S. gun market were made in 1966 or 1967. The gun has three Hanzi "5 4 Type" on top of the slide. Serial starts with year of manufacturing, 14 is 1967 (1954 + 14 - 1 = 1967), 66 is factory code. Before 1980s, there were no "commercial" guns in China. All guns were made for government, or exported (free of charge) to support global revolutionary of proletariat.

04-09-2012, 07:30 PM	#6
alvin User Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: US Posts: 3,843 Thanks: 132 Thanked 729 Times in 438 Posts	Back a few years ago, one seller told a story on the advertisement (not this one). His Tokarev was near excellent, but also came with mismatched magazine. His story was that GI found Viet Gong's secret storage and captured hundreds of unissued Tokarevs. For each pistol, they opened the slide and removed the magazine to make sure it's not loaded. Then, the pistol was thrown into a pile and the magazine into another pile. === "Type 54" has an elder brother, "Type 51", which is also a Tokarev. It's pretty rare in the U.S. The marking is different, mechanically identical. What I heard was "Type 51" was assembled from Soviet Union supplied parts. After Korean war, Chinese was able to setup machinaries and tools to make it, and the gun was redesignated as "Type 54".

04-10-2012, 04:01 PM	#9
Curly1 User Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: Upstate New York Posts: 1,247 Thanks: 125 Thanked 717 Times in 374 Posts	Mike you would go to the other thread then do a right mouse click copy of th Http in the address window of your browser then go to this thread and right click paste it. __________________ Laugh hard and often. Gary

04-11-2012, 06:18 AM	#10
alvin User Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: US Posts: 3,843 Thanks: 132 Thanked 729 Times in 438 Posts	I had not shot this pistol while it's in my collection. Just saw a video showing shooting a Type 54 in range recently. Enjoy! video: http://v.youku.com/v_show/id_XMzc1OTc1NTYw.html the guns: Attached Thumbnails

04-11-2012, 11:15 AM	#11
MJRiggs User Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: SE Virginia Posts: 47 Thanks: 0 Thanked 2 Times in 2 Posts	For some reason my computer only shows the forum address but not the thread number in the brower window. Mike

05-11-2012, 01:48 PM	#14
MJRiggs User Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: SE Virginia Posts: 47 Thanks: 0 Thanked 2 Times in 2 Posts	Alvin, I took the pistol to the range last week and fired two magazines worth of ammo. Everything worked just fine, and the pistol was very accurate with a smooth trigger. I’d never fired a 7.62x25 before and I found the recoil to be pretty close to a 9mm round but with a much brighter flash. Now my challenge is to get it as clean as it was when you sold it to me. Mike

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