Trigger Variations

I'm starting a new thread on this because I don't think this subject is dead yet. I'm looking at the sides of two triggers, one 1940 42 Mauser which is thick, and the other probably Imperial DWM which is thin. This concerns the width of the side, not the front, of the triggers.


I bought a new camera but am still waiting for the ac power cord/battery charger, so no photos. In "Lugers at Random" the M1908 DWM on p.163 and the M1914 Erfurt on p.165 have the slim triggers. The M1934 Mauser 42 on p.279 has the thick trigger. I realize that many photos do not show the trigger clearly, but these do.


Frank Manders wrote, "I looked in my Still Books and it seems that maybe, and I mean maybe the trigger design might have changed in the K to G Date range (1934 - 1935). I is difficult to tell from the photos. I took a peek at my Lugers and my 1933 Sneak, made by Mauser and assembled from mostly DWM parts has a "thin" trigger and both my K-Date and G-Dates have the "thick" trigger. For what it's worth!"


Tom Heller wrote, "There may in fact be minor dimensional differences in the triggers between the different manufacturers, but if you mic them, I doubt that they would be more than a few thousandths. The only triggers that I know of that are much thinner, are on the M1900 luger."


If there was a definite point of change, and if it can be pinpointed when the change in triggers occurred, it might be, for example, a new variation in K date Lugers. At the least it might help to establish whether or not a questionable #74 trigger is original to a #xx74 Luger. OTOH, it may be that this noncritical dimension of the trigger varied back and forth without a specific change point.


Any additional comments?

[Hugh]

original blueprints don't show a figure for that dimension.




http://boards.rennlist.com/upload/trigger2.jpg

[John Sabato]

I think that this is a Non-Critical Dimension as the critical dimensions are those where the trigger must mate with the frame with such precision as to allow the sear/disconnector to function while permitting reasonable repeatability in the trigger function. (Huh?) that means that the trigger travel after the sear/firing pin breakpoint is non-consequential in a combat pistol, and the overall width was probably finished by hand to asthetically please the eye of the grinder/polisher after the critical dimensions were within specifications. Probably done on a hand jig based on the trigger pivot point and then polished.


that's my two engineering cents of speculation


regards, John

German drawings define critical and non-critical dimensions with the number of digits to the right ot the decimal point. The more digits to the right of the decimal the tighter the tolerance (tolerances are defined either on the drawing or via a standard) I have worked with German drawings for a number of years and have not run into a missing or non-defined feature dimension. Some are tough to find and many times they are feature developments, they are defined someplace on the drawing. I doubt that the Germans would leave any dimension open to the manufacturers discretion. If there is a significant dimensional change in the triggers (outside of print tolerance), then there was also print revision.


Best regards,

Rod

The difference between the thick and thin triggers is most noticable near the bottom of the trigger. Hugh's top drawing shows a dimension of 1.9mm at this point. But what is the date of the drawing and what is the period this drawing was in use? There ARE some triggers which do not meet this spec.

[John Sabato]

(see the white rectangle inset) I am sure it is the same print that Hugh has, only I have reversed the image color for better readability. The print appears to give the trigger the shape we are used to seeing on WW2 Lugers, but the profile shape of my 1914 Erfurt Artillery Trigger is much thinner as seen in the photo I have linked below. Click on the link and you will see the 1914 trigger compared with a 1941 Mauser trigger from my byf 41.


Does anyone have any other blueprints other than the dated one I have shown? How do the dimensions compare to the 1913 print?


Please notice that it is not apparent in any of the views of what the dimensions are for the profile of the trigger from the a------b section line to the trigger tip. This is the non-critical area to which I was referring...


regards,


John Sabato



Comparison of 1914 Erfurt Trigger (L) with 1941 Mauser (R)-CLICK HERE
http://boards.rennlist.com/upload/triggerdims.jpg

It seems that they did not make triggers to conform to the 1.9mm dimension at the bottom of the trigger in the drawing until later, maybe much later, maybe as late as WWII.