Help requested for Lugers ID

Dwight Gruber · 07-27-2007, 08:04 PM

Actually, there is another Martz gun out of South America, a trashed frame that was once a Luger carbine conversion. It may have been discussed on this Forum quite a few months ago.

If I remember correctly--I can't find a reference right now--the MSJR (is it MSTR?) signifies a modification patented by John Martz by which an open toggle closes when a loaded magazine is inserted into the gun.

On the short barrelled Luger, check to see if the grip is as long as a standard Luger grip. Martz has made a number of "baby Lugers" with short barrels and shortened grips and magazines which only hold 5 or 6 rounds.

The Martz .45 conversions are made up of two frames cut in half so that they separate front-to-back. They are cut unequally, so that when the appropriate halves are welded back together the grip is lengthened to accomodate the increased length of the .45 ACP cartridge. The toggle pieces are lengthened similarly, as is the receiver extension. New breechblocks are made from scratch.

John Martz alters Lugers to other calibers and configurations, and makes standard P-38 and P-38 Carbines in .45 ACP as well. Can't tell you anything about the P-38s.

In near-mint condition the Martz Baby Luger (if that is what it is) might sell for more than $3,000 and the .45 might sell for more than $5,000 in the U.S.

--Dwight

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07-27-2007, 08:04 PM	#4
Dwight Gruber User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Portland, Oregon Posts: 3,908 Thanks: 0 Thanked 1,330 Times in 435 Posts	Actually, there is another Martz gun out of South America, a trashed frame that was once a Luger carbine conversion. It may have been discussed on this Forum quite a few months ago. If I remember correctly--I can't find a reference right now--the MSJR (is it MSTR?) signifies a modification patented by John Martz by which an open toggle closes when a loaded magazine is inserted into the gun. On the short barrelled Luger, check to see if the grip is as long as a standard Luger grip. Martz has made a number of "baby Lugers" with short barrels and shortened grips and magazines which only hold 5 or 6 rounds. The Martz .45 conversions are made up of two frames cut in half so that they separate front-to-back. They are cut unequally, so that when the appropriate halves are welded back together the grip is lengthened to accomodate the increased length of the .45 ACP cartridge. The toggle pieces are lengthened similarly, as is the receiver extension. New breechblocks are made from scratch. John Martz alters Lugers to other calibers and configurations, and makes standard P-38 and P-38 Carbines in .45 ACP as well. Can't tell you anything about the P-38s. In near-mint condition the Martz Baby Luger (if that is what it is) might sell for more than $3,000 and the .45 might sell for more than $5,000 in the U.S. --Dwight