Commercial???? Navy board stock

[steve426]

I recently stumbled upon this item along with the other items I posted in the new collectors area and have been try to do some research on it. The mid range serial number with an "a" suffix seems to by consistent with some of the other navy stocks I have found but the "Germany" stamp confused me. I could not find any info about commercial navy stocks (it would probably help if I had the proper books ), until I found this the other night.

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You can expect to pay between $38-4500 & up for a stock; a nice holster will run $15-2000. A correct mag pouch, if you can find one, will be $5-700; straps, if original will be $400 up. Rarer stuff, like commercial stocks, will go up proportionately.

And $18,400 for an original first issue full rig, is, in my opinion, a bargain.

I have a "spare" holster and stock, if there is such a thing as a spare. Contact me via private e-mail if you have any interest.

Tom A
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I did see that Tom (if this was Tom Armstrong) passed away last summer and my thoughts and prayers go out so his family and friends, it is very obvious that he was loved and respected by many members and collectors in the community. I will continue to enjoy reading his posts.
After finding this I do see that there is such an animal as a "commercial navy board stock".
Any thoughts on rarity, age, value, misc. info, etc.

Thanks Steve

[steve426]

Missed a picture

[George Anderson]

Your stock is a commercial only in that it was unissued and subsequently exported to the US after 1918. It is actually a Navy stock acceptence stamped and originally intended for naval issue.

Based on illustrations in pre 1914 commercial navy Luger manuals, the true commercial navy stocks would have lacked the steel property disc and serial number on the iron.

[John Sabato]

You should also be made aware that your stock can only be legally attached to a original Navy Luger.

Attachment to any other kind of Luger would constitute making a Short Barreled Rifle in the eyes of the BATFE and would be a federal felony.

This prohibiition would include attching your stock to an Artillery model Luger which is also designed for use with a stock, and is legal only with an ARTILLERY shoulder stock.

Conversely, attaching an artillery model shoulder stock to a Navy Luger would also be a violation.

Just because a Luger has a stock lug, doesn't mean that you can legally attach a stock.

Just be careful.

[lugerholsterrepair]

Steve, Do you have any photo's of the stock iron serial number & suffix?

Thanks,

[steve426]

John

Thanks for the info and the warning....This information was actually the first couple of posts I found when I start reading about the stock.

Jerry

Here are some more pics with the serial number and suffix.

Anymore information anyone can give me on this item will be greatly appreciated.

Thanks Steve

[lugerholsterrepair]

Steve, Thanks for the photo's! It's looking like a nice original Imperial era Navy stock. Looks unmolested too..If this were offered to me I would be all over it. One of the original Navy stocks I have has GERMANY stamped in the stock block well.
Do you have a chance to pick it up?
Jerry Burney

[steve426]

Yep, already got it! I picked it up when I bought the other items that I still have questions about. you can see those in my post at the New Collectors area "I finally found some luger items" and if I told the story about how I got them and the price I would probably make some of you cry. I'm still interested in finding out the history about it, maybe manufacture date, when maybe it was stamped with the Germany and so on. And of course what you all think it may be worth in this condition.

Steve

[lugerholsterrepair]

Steve,
manufacture date Likely mid 1917..later than that the Imperial Navy went to the type 2 for the land based Naval units in Flanders.These were without stocks. The Germany marking indicates ww1 surplus sold to the US in the mid 20's.
At any rate some time after 1918 as George says. I say mid 20's because it took some time for Germany to settle down to a viable exporting economy and establish importers in the USA such as Pacific Arms. They then tried to sell anything available if import catalogs are any indicator.
Establishing a value is a little difficult. Tom Armstrong's valuation is really too strong on the date he made it...That was in a very strong economy. This economy is getting worse by the day and I see genuine Luger bargains pop up more and more. Cash is king so to speak and many collectors are having difficulty selling at all.
If I were given the opportunity I would buy this stock immediately for $2000. There is a guy I know of who has a really poor example for around $4500. Only someone who knows nothing about Navy stocks would even consider it.
Another guy I know of has one for $2500-2800 I forget but it's an outright fake. He knows it but is waiting for a cash cow I guess. Several people have bought it and returned it. I can't understand people sometimes...I guess it's all about the money.
So if the economy is as bad as I think I would guess your stock might bring $2500-3500. Might not too..I just saw a very respectable pigskin Luger holster that no one bid $350 on and a couple years back it would have brought $650 easy.
So who knows?
Jerry Burney

[spartacus38]

Steve and all,

I have an almost identical Navy stock---same steel disc with same Crown/M with number:

8598 no suffix on iron, and Germany marked on butt.

I also have a 1906 Navy commercial rig with matching numbered stock with no disc.

The iron is numbered to gun with #6469.Four digit 1906 Navy commercials are rare.

Sorry no pictures.

Spartacus38@charter.net

Bob Young

Navy stocks are so rare I am not sure of current value.

I was told my matching navy stock adds 50% of the gun's value to the value of the rig.

[steve426]

Thanks Jerry

Your answers are very complete and you have explainations for your answers...I couldn't ask for anything more, your time and expertise is much appreciated.

Steve

[spartacus38]

Steve and all,

Another one to add:

Navy stock I believe for a 1908 Navy # 7461 B on iron with steel disc marked M.A. over 699

and Crown over M.There is a large Crown M to the left of the disc in wood also.

Bob

[spartacus38]

Steve and all,

Lastly I have a rare Weimar Navy stock(with disc) with holster and a one of a kind shoulder strap

assembly with a previously unknown Navy cleaning rod. Also a mag pouch.Stock was an Artillery stock originally.

Bob

[steve426]

Sounds like you have a nice collection....you should try and get some photos up for all to see.

Steve

[spartacus38]

Steve,
Did you come up with a value of your Navy stock?
Bob

[steve426]

Bob
Jerry did a very nice job of answering some of my questions, but I'm always open to more input and opinions. I do have some more queations if anyone can help.
1. How many suffix's were used on the navy stocks? I've only seen and heard of no suffix and "a" suffix.(based on the few I've seen)
2. Date when thay got to 4705a.
3. Do all stocks have a matching luger to go with it originally?
4. Is it most likely the luger was unused during the war also and went to the US with a stamp, along with the stock?
5. How does my stock rate as far as condition compared to others people have seen?

Thanks Steve

[spartacus38]

Steve,What are your questions?
Bob

[steve426]

Sorry I fat fingered my keyboard and had to go back and edit the questions in.

[Norme]

Hi Steve, Some answers:
1/ No suffix, a and b.
2/ 4075a was used twice, In 1912 give or take a year or two, and then again in1917/18.
3/ All numbered ones, yes.
4/ No. In 1917 the Navy fought a ground war in Flanders. They were issued Lugers in belt mounted holsters without stocks. Luger #4075a went to war, it's matching stock stayed home.
5/ Better than most.
Regards, Norm

[steve426]

Thanks Norm

I noticed that you have #4075a instead of #4705a listed....does it make any difference in you answer?

Steve