Trouble removing the magazine release

DaveinTN · 01-03-2007, 10:24 PM

Since I purchased my first Luger (a 1917 Erfurt) several weeks ago, it and I have been getting more intimately acquainted (mechanically speaking.)

IÃ¢??ve watched the great videos that Chris (aka Shadow) has posted on Youtube and Ã¢??dropshotsÃ¢?Â and have carefully removed, cleaned and re-installed just about every component except the main recoil spring.

As usual there is one part that is giving me a lot of trouble, and thatÃ¢??s the magazine release spring.

As shown in the video, Chris pushes the lower portion of the spring forward out of its slot in the magazine release button towards the trigger area. It appears to slip out with minimal effort.

With my pistol, that isnÃ¢??t the case. The slot in the magazine release button doesnÃ¢??t seem to have anywhere for the spring to slip out. The spring appears to fit into a rectangular (four sided) hole in the side of the button. IÃ¢??ve applied liberal amounts of Liquid Wrench and exerted quite a bit of pressure using the same technique as in the video but with no luck. ThereÃ¢??s a little bit of front to back movement, but nothing similar to what is shown in the video.

Is it possible with some pistols that the spring should slip forward from where itÃ¢??s secured to the frame of the pistol rather than from the button?

Any and all suggestions will be appreciated and attempted.

Dave in TN.

Edward Tinker · 01-03-2007, 10:31 PM

Dave, in the last 5 years I have been really into Lugers, I have never removed this piece. Not sure why you'd want to?

It might be once you get it "loose", it won't be tight...

Kinda the same with a "total" breakdown, I have only done that a couple of times, I just don't take them that far down to "clean" them.

Ed

lugerholsterrepair · 01-03-2007, 10:49 PM

Dave, Jack Hiles was here a week ago and just for fun we took two beater pistols completely apart, including the mainsprings. The mainsprings are easily removed.
The spring you are having trouble with can be either loose or tight. I have seen them both ways. The loose ones are agravating because they can fall out when fireing or handling.
Better to have a tight one. Get a really good light and some magnification. I use one of those cheat 4" magnafiers with a lightbulb attached. Sometimes the mag release button is milled with steep sides. Just wiggle it and look at it closely, keeping in mind..it was put together so it must come apart. The top should move to the right and the bottom slip out of the slot in the mag button to the left. The bottom of the spring is rounded so it should come on out if you hold yer mouth right...I sometimes use a little wood stick girls use to push back their cuticles.
I take down every Luger I aquire cause there is all sorts of junk in the hidden nooks and crannies.
Good Luck, Jerry Burney

Ron Wood · 01-04-2007, 12:11 AM

In my opinion (which doesn't amount to much) the proper way to remove the mag release button spring is from the top, not at the bottom. As Dave is experiencing, sometimes the spring sits too deeply in the release button to come out when pushed to the side. If you look at the top of the spring there is a ridge that sits in a detent in the frame slot. If you press down on the forward edge of the ridge with "a little wood stick" (it needs to be good hard wood like the osage orange that cuticle sticks are made from) so that the ridge clears the detent, then you should be able to push the spring toward the rear of the gun and the spring will slide out of the slot in the frame. It doesn't hurt to clean up the top of the spring and slot with solvent and oil to get as much of the hard gunk out of the way before you try to push it out. Assembly is the reverse...put the bottom of the spring in the release button and slide the top back into the frame slot.

DaveinTN · 01-04-2007, 12:19 AM

Ed & Jerry,

I guess there are two reasons I want to take the pistol apart.

The first is that I want to clean out the 90 years of gunk that has accumulated so that the action won't be hampered if I take it to the range.

(Just to be on the safe side, I just purchased another "hold open" so that the numbered original part won't be subject to possible breakage. I also bought some plastic replacement grips so that the numbered un-chipped grips will stay intact.)

The second reason is that I'm just plain curious. Taking the pistol apart helps me to understand how it works and gives me a sense of the creativity that went into the design and manufacture. However, I don't intend to break the pistol down to every individual part (I may be compulsive but I ain't crazy.)

Your advice about the leaving the magazine spring alone makes a great deal of sense. I'll be leaving it and the breakdown lever spring undisturbed.

Thanks for the input,

Dave in TN.

Ron,

You hit the nail on the head! I looked at the top of the spring with a 10x loupe and it was exactly as you described. If I ever have to replace the spring, I'll use your suggestion.

Dave in TN.

Edward Tinker · 01-04-2007, 12:22 AM

Dave, and I am a chicken, I took a C96 broom apart once and well, it never worked right after I "forced" her back together

Ed

Sieger · 01-04-2007, 12:46 AM

Dave:

It sounds to me like that little flat spring has gotten itself "glued in" with gunk over the years.

After removing the grip, the proper way to remove it is to slide the bottom of the little devil forward, out of the little slot in the mag release catch.

You might try this process with the mag release pressed in all of the way, then with the mag release extended all of the way out.

I do remember having to use a little brass punch to "help" a stiffened flat spring out of that slot in the mag release years ago. Gunk and a little rust on the bottom of the spring were the problem.

After you finally get the flat spring out, the mag release will drop out of its position. Then, carefully clean the slot in the release with whatever solvent you have in your gun cleaning case (soaking overnight may be necessary).

Sieger

Hugh · 01-06-2007, 01:47 AM

I agree with Ron, remove the top first, and when putting back in, put the bottom in first. I have found that new replacement springs are usually too long and the bottom has to be filed down slightly for the release to work smoothly.

Lugerdoc · 01-06-2007, 09:56 AM

I agree with Ron & Hugh, that the mag catch spring should be removed from the top. If you can remove it from the bottom, it is probably too loose. TH

DaveinTN · 01-08-2007, 01:18 AM

Guys,

I couldn't resist the temptation!

I gave the area in the frame where the top of the spring is secured a good soak with Liquid Wrench. Then I got a popsicle stick from my vast collection of stuff left over from being a Cub Scout den leader.

All it took was a bit of pressure downward and to the rear and out it came.....

After cleaning out a little more crud, the whole assembly went back together just as easily as it came apart.

Thanks again for all the good advice!

Dave in TN.

shadow · 01-08-2007, 08:04 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Lugerdoc
I agree with Ron & Hugh, that the mag catch spring should be removed from the top. If you can remove it from the bottom, it is probably too loose. TH

I will re-shoot the detail strip video to reflect this change.
I guess my spring is too loose because it comes right out.

I am currently finishing up incorporating comments from Tom Heller, and making an additional cleaning video at his recommendation.

Thanks,

Chris

DaveinTN · 01-08-2007, 09:35 AM

Chris,

I want to state again that I've found your videos extremely helpful as I've gotten to know the various components of my Luger.

I'm sure many other forum members along with myself appreciate all the time and work you've put into making the videos.

Many thanks!

Dave in TN.

Ron Wood · 01-08-2007, 09:57 AM

Chris,
I tried to respond to your PM but your inbox is full. If you empty it out a bit I will try again later.
Ron

lugerholsterrepair · 01-08-2007, 10:55 AM

Dave, Ron Wood is indeed correct..Who would really question the wisdom of a guy that old?
I spent two hours taking apart and cleaning several Lugers this weekend and went to great lengths to discover the best way to take this spring out.

This spring has a slot and an indent milled into the frame where it inserts at the top. The slot is milled fron front to back along the side and the flat side of the spring fits in it. It appears to be deeper at the rear and this is where the spring should be removed. Push back and to the rear. Also for re assembly, lay the bottom into the slot in the mag release, press it into the rear of the milled slot and push forward untill the raised portion of the spring fits into the indent.
Jerry Burney

Alx · 02-18-2007, 12:59 AM

'Sorry, those of you who watched that Luger "armorer's course" video but did not catch the post I made a long time ago, concerning the gunsmiths mistaken method of damaging the magazine catch spring by trying to knock it out of the magazine catch before sliding it out of the frame above. If you watch the video closely, you can see the gunsmith examining the spring immediately after removing it and remarking how it is messed up, but not aware it was himself that just did it. It is kind of funny, once you see what actually happens.

01-03-2007, 10:24 PM	#1
DaveinTN User Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Tennessee Posts: 186 Thanks: 3 Thanked 15 Times in 11 Posts	Trouble removing the magazine release Since I purchased my first Luger (a 1917 Erfurt) several weeks ago, it and I have been getting more intimately acquainted (mechanically speaking.) IÃ¢??ve watched the great videos that Chris (aka Shadow) has posted on Youtube and Ã¢??dropshotsÃ¢?Â and have carefully removed, cleaned and re-installed just about every component except the main recoil spring. As usual there is one part that is giving me a lot of trouble, and thatÃ¢??s the magazine release spring. As shown in the video, Chris pushes the lower portion of the spring forward out of its slot in the magazine release button towards the trigger area. It appears to slip out with minimal effort. With my pistol, that isnÃ¢??t the case. The slot in the magazine release button doesnÃ¢??t seem to have anywhere for the spring to slip out. The spring appears to fit into a rectangular (four sided) hole in the side of the button. IÃ¢??ve applied liberal amounts of Liquid Wrench and exerted quite a bit of pressure using the same technique as in the video but with no luck. ThereÃ¢??s a little bit of front to back movement, but nothing similar to what is shown in the video. Is it possible with some pistols that the spring should slip forward from where itÃ¢??s secured to the frame of the pistol rather than from the button? Any and all suggestions will be appreciated and attempted. Dave in TN.

01-03-2007, 10:49 PM	#3
lugerholsterrepair Moderator Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Arizona/Colorado Posts: 7,775 Thanks: 4,995 Thanked 3,133 Times in 1,439 Posts	Dave, Jack Hiles was here a week ago and just for fun we took two beater pistols completely apart, including the mainsprings. The mainsprings are easily removed. The spring you are having trouble with can be either loose or tight. I have seen them both ways. The loose ones are agravating because they can fall out when fireing or handling. Better to have a tight one. Get a really good light and some magnification. I use one of those cheat 4" magnafiers with a lightbulb attached. Sometimes the mag release button is milled with steep sides. Just wiggle it and look at it closely, keeping in mind..it was put together so it must come apart. The top should move to the right and the bottom slip out of the slot in the mag button to the left. The bottom of the spring is rounded so it should come on out if you hold yer mouth right...I sometimes use a little wood stick girls use to push back their cuticles. I take down every Luger I aquire cause there is all sorts of junk in the hidden nooks and crannies. Good Luck, Jerry Burney __________________ Jerry Burney 11491 S. Guadalupe Drive Yuma AZ 85367-6182 lugerholsterrepair@earthlink.net 928 342-7583 (CO & AZ) Year Round 719 207-3331 (cell) "For those who Fight For It, Life has a flavor the protected will never know."

01-04-2007, 12:11 AM	#4
Ron Wood Moderator 2010 LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Santa Teresa New Mexico just outside of the West Texas town of El Paso Posts: 7,035 Thanks: 1,106 Thanked 5,242 Times in 1,719 Posts	In my opinion (which doesn't amount to much) the proper way to remove the mag release button spring is from the top, not at the bottom. As Dave is experiencing, sometimes the spring sits too deeply in the release button to come out when pushed to the side. If you look at the top of the spring there is a ridge that sits in a detent in the frame slot. If you press down on the forward edge of the ridge with "a little wood stick" (it needs to be good hard wood like the osage orange that cuticle sticks are made from) so that the ridge clears the detent, then you should be able to push the spring toward the rear of the gun and the spring will slide out of the slot in the frame. It doesn't hurt to clean up the top of the spring and slot with solvent and oil to get as much of the hard gunk out of the way before you try to push it out. Assembly is the reverse...put the bottom of the spring in the release button and slide the top back into the frame slot. __________________ If it's made after 1918...it's a reproduction

01-04-2007, 12:22 AM	#6
Edward Tinker Super Moderator Eternal Lifer LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: North of Spokane, WA Posts: 15,960 Thanks: 2,062 Thanked 4,591 Times in 2,114 Posts	Dave, and I am a chicken, I took a C96 broom apart once and well, it never worked right after I "forced" her back together Ed __________________ Edward Tinker ************ Co-Author of Police Lugers - Co-Author of Simson Lugers Author of Veteran Bring Backs Vol I, Vol II, Vol III and Vol IV

01-04-2007, 12:46 AM	#7
Sieger User Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: New York, NY Posts: 1,579 Thanks: 2,142 Thanked 401 Times in 250 Posts	Mag Release Spring Dave: It sounds to me like that little flat spring has gotten itself "glued in" with gunk over the years. After removing the grip, the proper way to remove it is to slide the bottom of the little devil forward, out of the little slot in the mag release catch. You might try this process with the mag release pressed in all of the way, then with the mag release extended all of the way out. I do remember having to use a little brass punch to "help" a stiffened flat spring out of that slot in the mag release years ago. Gunk and a little rust on the bottom of the spring were the problem. After you finally get the flat spring out, the mag release will drop out of its position. Then, carefully clean the slot in the release with whatever solvent you have in your gun cleaning case (soaking overnight may be necessary). Sieger

01-03-2007, 10:31 PM	#2
Edward Tinker Super Moderator Eternal Lifer LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: North of Spokane, WA Posts: 15,960 Thanks: 2,062 Thanked 4,591 Times in 2,114 Posts	Dave, in the last 5 years I have been really into Lugers, I have never removed this piece. Not sure why you'd want to? It might be once you get it "loose", it won't be tight... Kinda the same with a "total" breakdown, I have only done that a couple of times, I just don't take them that far down to "clean" them. Ed

01-04-2007, 12:19 AM	#5
DaveinTN User Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Tennessee Posts: 186 Thanks: 3 Thanked 15 Times in 11 Posts	Ed & Jerry, I guess there are two reasons I want to take the pistol apart. The first is that I want to clean out the 90 years of gunk that has accumulated so that the action won't be hampered if I take it to the range. (Just to be on the safe side, I just purchased another "hold open" so that the numbered original part won't be subject to possible breakage. I also bought some plastic replacement grips so that the numbered un-chipped grips will stay intact.) The second reason is that I'm just plain curious. Taking the pistol apart helps me to understand how it works and gives me a sense of the creativity that went into the design and manufacture. However, I don't intend to break the pistol down to every individual part (I may be compulsive but I ain't crazy.) Your advice about the leaving the magazine spring alone makes a great deal of sense. I'll be leaving it and the breakdown lever spring undisturbed. Thanks for the input, Dave in TN. Ron, You hit the nail on the head! I looked at the top of the spring with a 10x loupe and it was exactly as you described. If I ever have to replace the spring, I'll use your suggestion. Dave in TN.

01-06-2007, 01:47 AM	#8
Hugh RIP Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Southeast Texas Swamp Posts: 2,460 Thanks: 2 Thanked 166 Times in 65 Posts	I agree with Ron, remove the top first, and when putting back in, put the bottom in first. I have found that new replacement springs are usually too long and the bottom has to be filed down slightly for the release to work smoothly. __________________ *TRUMP FOR PREZ IN '20!*

01-06-2007, 09:56 AM	#9
Lugerdoc Patron LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: POB 398 St.Charles,MO. 63302 Posts: 5,089 Thanks: 6 Thanked 737 Times in 484 Posts	I agree with Ron & Hugh, that the mag catch spring should be removed from the top. If you can remove it from the bottom, it is probably too loose. TH __________________ Tom Heller POB 398 ST.Charles, MO. 63302 Tel 636-447-3006 lugerdoc@charter.net

01-08-2007, 01:18 AM	#10
DaveinTN User Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Tennessee Posts: 186 Thanks: 3 Thanked 15 Times in 11 Posts	Guys, I couldn't resist the temptation! I gave the area in the frame where the top of the spring is secured a good soak with Liquid Wrench. Then I got a popsicle stick from my vast collection of stuff left over from being a Cub Scout den leader. All it took was a bit of pressure downward and to the rear and out it came..... After cleaning out a little more crud, the whole assembly went back together just as easily as it came apart. Thanks again for all the good advice! Dave in TN.

01-08-2007, 09:35 AM	#12
DaveinTN User Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Tennessee Posts: 186 Thanks: 3 Thanked 15 Times in 11 Posts	Chris, I want to state again that I've found your videos extremely helpful as I've gotten to know the various components of my Luger. I'm sure many other forum members along with myself appreciate all the time and work you've put into making the videos. Many thanks! Dave in TN.

01-08-2007, 09:57 AM	#13
Ron Wood Moderator 2010 LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Santa Teresa New Mexico just outside of the West Texas town of El Paso Posts: 7,035 Thanks: 1,106 Thanked 5,242 Times in 1,719 Posts	Chris, I tried to respond to your PM but your inbox is full. If you empty it out a bit I will try again later. Ron __________________ If it's made after 1918...it's a reproduction

01-08-2007, 10:55 AM	#14
lugerholsterrepair Moderator Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Arizona/Colorado Posts: 7,775 Thanks: 4,995 Thanked 3,133 Times in 1,439 Posts	Dave, Ron Wood is indeed correct..Who would really question the wisdom of a guy that old? I spent two hours taking apart and cleaning several Lugers this weekend and went to great lengths to discover the best way to take this spring out. This spring has a slot and an indent milled into the frame where it inserts at the top. The slot is milled fron front to back along the side and the flat side of the spring fits in it. It appears to be deeper at the rear and this is where the spring should be removed. Push back and to the rear. Also for re assembly, lay the bottom into the slot in the mag release, press it into the rear of the milled slot and push forward untill the raised portion of the spring fits into the indent. Jerry Burney __________________ Jerry Burney 11491 S. Guadalupe Drive Yuma AZ 85367-6182 lugerholsterrepair@earthlink.net 928 342-7583 (CO & AZ) Year Round 719 207-3331 (cell) "For those who Fight For It, Life has a flavor the protected will never know."

02-18-2007, 12:59 AM	#15
Alx User Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Nashville, Tennessee area Posts: 263 Thanks: 5 Thanked 3 Times in 3 Posts	'Sorry, those of you who watched that Luger "armorer's course" video but did not catch the post I made a long time ago, concerning the gunsmiths mistaken method of damaging the magazine catch spring by trying to knock it out of the magazine catch before sliding it out of the frame above. If you watch the video closely, you can see the gunsmith examining the spring immediately after removing it and remarking how it is messed up, but not aware it was himself that just did it. It is kind of funny, once you see what actually happens.