Germany Beats Italy

Citizen C · 06-12-2006, 12:04 AM

Wait, you didn't think this was about soccer, did you? Psshaw!

Last Wednesday I started the summer pistol league at a local indoor range. The summer league is an informal "any gun and caliber" deal where you ostensibly compete against yourself and work on your technique.

I decided to compete in the "self defense" category, where you can use both hands instead of the one-handed bullseye stance so long as you use a pistol with fixed sights. My weapon of choice was the Mauser Parabellum Luger in 9mm. I did okay, but I wondered if my Beretta might give me more of an accuracy edge next Wednesday night. Today I went to test the theory.

Ammunition was Magtech 115 grain FMJ.

I determined that I needed to use a 1 o'clock hold with the Luger at 50 feet after coloring in the aiming point that you see above. These shots were all made by single loading, one at a time manually. I wanted to see where the customary "flyer" would land. The bullet hole through the aiming point is an anomaly.

Once that was settled, I started turning in some good targets. Well, for me anyway, considering the distance and the sights.

I next unleashed a veritable fusilade of 9mm Death at 50 feet!

So, what could the Beretta do? The pride of Italy? The issue pistol of our proud nation?

Not too impressive. Of course, I have to take the blame for some of this since I'm the operator. Still, the single-action trigger of the Beretta wasn't even in the same building with the Luger. Stacky, stagey, creepy. You get to what you think is the final bit of resistance before it breaks and fires...but it always seemed to have a little bit more to go.

The Luger's trigger is smooth all the way through, but without the "modern" trigger feel of that last bit of resistance after take-up that lets you know the gun is about to go off. The Luger suprises you.

These are two seperate groups from the Beretta at half the distance, 25 feet. The five iron-sighted shots at the bottom are not impressive. Then I turned on the Crimson Trace laser grip and put some tight clusters at the 11 o'clock on the target. Still, these shots were not delivered any faster than I could with iron sights (perhaps even slower).

Luger and Beretta at 25 feet. See for yourself.

Ergonomically, the Luger has the better feeling grip and angle. It is the better "pointing" pistol. The wide grip of the Beretta just doesn't compare.

Luger has the better trigger. It had better! The darn thing cost as much as two Berettas!

Operation: The recoiling toggle lock of the Luger is quick and snappy. Teutonically efficient and tight. I had one failure to feed from a magazine with a weak spring. I'm going to replace it with a Wolff spring.

In contrast, the Beretta just wasn't as smart. It seemed like I could actually feel the recoil spring compressing from recoil. It seemed to operate slower. I had one failure to eject from the Beretta, but admittedly, I cannot remember the last time I cleaned the Beretta!

Of course, the Beretta has amenities such as magazine capacity and double-action carry. Certainly the better "battlefield" pistol. But neither pistol was designed as a target pistol.

Coolness factor:

The Luger shares the Ultimate Coolness of Handguns stage with the M1911 and the SAA. Nothing else really comes close to that coolness. The Luger makes you want to wear a monocle and fly around in red tri-planes or prowl the streets of Shanghai circa-1935 looking over your shoulder for hitmen from the local triad.

The Beretta has that "1980s" coolness thing going for it. "Lethal Weapon", "Die Hard", etc. The pistol is the poster boy for "spray and pray" gunfighting technique. Makes for entertaining movies.

But not for great scores on the target range. Looks like I'm sticking with the Luger on Wednesday nights.

A few gratuitous cheesecake photos...

Ron Wood · 06-12-2006, 12:12 AM

Quote:

The Luger shares the Ultimate Coolness of Handguns stage with the M1911 and the SAA. Nothing else really comes close to that coolness.

Amen!!! My favorite handguns, bar none.

Fabian23 · 06-12-2006, 03:24 AM

I would add the Webley Mk VI to that list, makes you want to wear a monocle and a pith helmet to go and shout at colonials ;D

Citizen C · 06-12-2006, 08:24 PM

Okay, I'll let the Webley in, but I'm shutting the door after that.

Browning Hi-Powers, P-38s, the S&W M1917, the Tokarev, and the Colt Python have to stay at slighty inferior lodgings.

Ron Smith · 06-12-2006, 10:33 PM

Fabian,

Sorry, I can't think of anything that would want to make me wear a pith helmet. Short of standing under a flock of Pelicans.

Ron Smith · 06-13-2006, 09:34 AM

I should have said. "Make me want to wear a pith helmet." Long day...

Tac,
The Pelican is the only animal in the world that expells more than they consume.

06-12-2006, 12:04 AM	#1
Citizen C New User Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Columbus, OH Posts: 4 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Germany Beats Italy Wait, you didn't think this was about soccer, did you? Psshaw! Last Wednesday I started the summer pistol league at a local indoor range. The summer league is an informal "any gun and caliber" deal where you ostensibly compete against yourself and work on your technique. I decided to compete in the "self defense" category, where you can use both hands instead of the one-handed bullseye stance so long as you use a pistol with fixed sights. My weapon of choice was the Mauser Parabellum Luger in 9mm. I did okay, but I wondered if my Beretta might give me more of an accuracy edge next Wednesday night. Today I went to test the theory. Ammunition was Magtech 115 grain FMJ. I determined that I needed to use a 1 o'clock hold with the Luger at 50 feet after coloring in the aiming point that you see above. These shots were all made by single loading, one at a time manually. I wanted to see where the customary "flyer" would land. The bullet hole through the aiming point is an anomaly. Once that was settled, I started turning in some good targets. Well, for me anyway, considering the distance and the sights. I next unleashed a veritable fusilade of 9mm Death at 50 feet! So, what could the Beretta do? The pride of Italy? The issue pistol of our proud nation? Not too impressive. Of course, I have to take the blame for some of this since I'm the operator. Still, the single-action trigger of the Beretta wasn't even in the same building with the Luger. Stacky, stagey, creepy. You get to what you think is the final bit of resistance before it breaks and fires...but it always seemed to have a little bit more to go. The Luger's trigger is smooth all the way through, but without the "modern" trigger feel of that last bit of resistance after take-up that lets you know the gun is about to go off. The Luger suprises you. These are two seperate groups from the Beretta at half the distance, 25 feet. The five iron-sighted shots at the bottom are not impressive. Then I turned on the Crimson Trace laser grip and put some tight clusters at the 11 o'clock on the target. Still, these shots were not delivered any faster than I could with iron sights (perhaps even slower). Luger and Beretta at 25 feet. See for yourself. Ergonomically, the Luger has the better feeling grip and angle. It is the better "pointing" pistol. The wide grip of the Beretta just doesn't compare. Luger has the better trigger. It had better! The darn thing cost as much as two Berettas! Operation: The recoiling toggle lock of the Luger is quick and snappy. Teutonically efficient and tight. I had one failure to feed from a magazine with a weak spring. I'm going to replace it with a Wolff spring. In contrast, the Beretta just wasn't as smart. It seemed like I could actually feel the recoil spring compressing from recoil. It seemed to operate slower. I had one failure to eject from the Beretta, but admittedly, I cannot remember the last time I cleaned the Beretta! Of course, the Beretta has amenities such as magazine capacity and double-action carry. Certainly the better "battlefield" pistol. But neither pistol was designed as a target pistol. Coolness factor: The Luger shares the Ultimate Coolness of Handguns stage with the M1911 and the SAA. Nothing else really comes close to that coolness. The Luger makes you want to wear a monocle and fly around in red tri-planes or prowl the streets of Shanghai circa-1935 looking over your shoulder for hitmen from the local triad. The Beretta has that "1980s" coolness thing going for it. "Lethal Weapon", "Die Hard", etc. The pistol is the poster boy for "spray and pray" gunfighting technique. Makes for entertaining movies. But not for great scores on the target range. Looks like I'm sticking with the Luger on Wednesday nights. A few gratuitous cheesecake photos...

06-12-2006, 10:33 PM	#5
Ron Smith User Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Orygun Posts: 4,243 Thanks: 118 Thanked 245 Times in 150 Posts	Fabian, Sorry, I can't think of anything that would want to make me wear a pith helmet. Short of standing under a flock of Pelicans. __________________ I Still Need DWM side plate #49... if anyone runs across a nice one. What ~Rudyard Kipling~ said...

06-13-2006, 09:34 AM	#6
Ron Smith User Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Orygun Posts: 4,243 Thanks: 118 Thanked 245 Times in 150 Posts	I should have said. "Make me want to wear a pith helmet." Long day... Tac, The Pelican is the only animal in the world that expells more than they consume. __________________ I Still Need DWM side plate #49... if anyone runs across a nice one. What ~Rudyard Kipling~ said...

06-12-2006, 03:24 AM	#3
Fabian23 User Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: Canton Bern Posts: 68 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	I would add the Webley Mk VI to that list, makes you want to wear a monocle and a pith helmet to go and shout at colonials ;D

06-12-2006, 08:24 PM	#4
Citizen C New User Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Columbus, OH Posts: 4 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Okay, I'll let the Webley in, but I'm shutting the door after that. Browning Hi-Powers, P-38s, the S&W M1917, the Tokarev, and the Colt Python have to stay at slighty inferior lodgings.