1900 AE commercial/test prices

[sschultz]

Some of you may have seen the 1900 Test piece that I have listed in the classifieds at what I (and others on the forum) consider to be a reasonable price.

However, someone insists that there is no price difference between commercial models and test pieces. Is this true?

I would really like to know publicly, what people think about this. Am I way out of touch here? Remember, we are talking about ORIGINAL finshed pieces here.

Thanks for the time. -stuart

[Heinz]

Well Schultz, if you decide to sell that test Luger for say 1200, like a commercial, I think I will come up with it.

American Eagle Lugers were fairly popular in the early period. I think Walter notes 5000 plus were imported to the states by 1904. I will check on those numbers. The 1000 test Lugers have a noted history and saw hard use. I would expect them to command a premium.

But then, I'd probably shoot one, so I will defer to expert collectors.

regards, Heinz

[Heinz]

Wow, was I off. Walter (The Luger Story) says about 12,000 total old pattern for the 7.65 US Commercial from 1900 to 1907. Walter gives the test model a "rarity index (RI) of 12 and the commercial a RI of 10. For comparison a WW1 P08 has an RI of 2, a 1936 Krieghoff an RI of 12. Jan Still states Bannerman bought 770 from the US Government and Still had reports of 161 American Eagle Test Lugers (1900) when he published the book (1991?)

[MauserLugers]

Hi,
Condition is a very important factor to consider. Some 1900 commercials are worth more and some less depending on their conditon, and what condition the test eagle you are using to compare it to. The test eagles are seldom ever found in mint condition, so their value is also based on condition with the prime examples commanding a large premium.

[sschultz]

Thanks for the comments guys. True, condition is everything. But the scenario is a comparison of a commercial vs. a test eagle, both in the same condition. Will price be the same? -stuart

[wterrell]

The question is whether your test pistol, in its condition and finish is worth what you are asking.

[Edward Tinker]

So no one can give poor sschultz an answer?

[img]frown.gif[/img]

I thought this would be a simple matter of those that have purchased or looked at both?

An equal commercial and test the same amount? That is hard to believe, most tests were abused and used, they were test pieces, while commericals were made in a much large number and usually not used in such a manner.

So?

[MauserLugers]

Hi,
If you are comparing equal conditions it would be my opinion that the test eagles would have a higher value.

[Ron Wood]

The survival rate on Test Eagles is surprisingly high. I have recorded 266 reported serial numbers, which includes 32 "out of range" pieces which have the characteristics of Test Eagles. So that is the pool we are drawing from. The production ratio of commercial to test American Eagles is somewhat over 10 to 1. If we assume roughly the same survival rate for commercials, that would give nearly 3000 pieces to choose from. Granted this is really blue sky estimating, but I would strongly contend that given a commercial AE and Test AE in identical condition the Test piece should command a significant premium over the commercial. Particularly at the over 90% condition levels, I will go out on a limb and say that 25% to 30% more should not be out of the question. That's my zwei pfennigs. <img src="graemlins/soapbox.gif" border="0" alt="[soapbox]" />

[Lugerdoc]

There seems to be a bit of confusion here regarding the term M1900 Commerical, with unmarked chamber, which are scarce in the US and the M1900 American Eagles, which are fairly common. The Blue Book of Gun Values, gives values (for 80% finish, like test shown) of $1,750 for the true non-AE commerical, $1,000 for the AE, and 40% more ($1400) for the test AE. Since the test eagle shown, is a bit outside of the accepted range, I think that the prior statements, that it is worth about the same as a non-AE commerical, is accurate. Tom H.

[Ron Wood]

Good point Tom. Non-AE Commercials are scarce and expensive. Glad you brought that difference into the discussion.

[Heinz]

Tom H, thank you for that important observation.

[Jan C Still]

[Kyrie]

Hi Folks!

Just thought Iâ??d my own thoughts and experiences to Janâ??s.

Collectors generally, and not just Luger collectors, are funny animals. They will typically choose â??interestingâ?� pieces over more rare pieces, and â??interestingâ?� usually means some kind of markings. With C96â??s a VD&L marked Slabside Large Ring will command a premium over the same pistol in better condition without the marketerâ??s stamp.

Moreover, how long it takes to sell a collector grade firearm is largely determined by how many potential buyers there are. A Red Nine C96, in mint condition with matching rig will sell in a few months when priced at market. But a same condition Six Shot can take years to sell if priced at market. The difference is the Red Nine interests C96 collectors, Imperial German military collectors, and Great War collectors. The Six Shot interests only C96 collectors. The smaller market Six Shot is worth about twice what the Red Nine is worth, but could take several times as long to sell as it could take that long to connect with an advanced C96 collector.

Warm regards,

Kyrie