Match Magazines and Holster

J. L. Lyon · 12-23-2003, 01:08 AM

I recently acquired a DWM Luger made in 1916, serial number 8565k. It has been overstamped 1920. I came with two magazines, both aluminum bottomed, with the magazine body blued on one the other left bright. The one magazine has the serial number 8565 but the letter is o not k so I know it's a mismatch. It also has the number 1 above the serial number. The second magazine has the number 8565 without a suffix letter stamped on the base, and the number 2 above it. Is the second one also a mismatch? I assume the 1 and 2 indicate the primary and spare magazine?

It also came with the loading tool with matching serial number without suffix stamped on the shaft and on the opposite side and a small crown over an unreadable letter. Is this correct for the pistol?

It came with a holster which is dated 1932. I'm not able to read the maker's name, but there is a sunburst under the year. The serial number without the suffix letter has been stamped on the back of the holster to the right of the year. Is this correct? I'm assuming this would have been a pistol issued to the Reichwehr. Is this correct?

Edward Tinker · 12-23-2003, 02:50 AM

Actually, I am inclined to beleive it is a Weimar police, or at least some of it is?

Does your luger have a sear safety such as this?

see the "bar" at the top of the picture

[

Normal army magazines are a serial number and nothing and the spare is a serial number and a plus sign. Police are marked with a 1, 2 or a 3 (on rare occassions a I or a II). Sometimes holsters are marked with the serial number, but I have see it more with weimar police, but then that is what I collect.

Your complete rig sounds very nice!

Ed

J. L. Lyon · 12-23-2003, 11:33 AM

The sear/safety looks exactly like the one in your picture. Thanks for the posting and the information. I bought the outfit from the grandson of the man who broght it back from Europe. His grandson believed he served as a combat infantryman.

John Sabato · 12-23-2003, 11:37 AM

Makes me wonder about the relationship between the grandson and his grandfather... If I were lucky enough to have received a war trophy that had been brought back by my grandfather, it would never leave my possession... until I was no longer breathing and I would make sure that some decendent who cared about not only history, but family history would be the heir to it... but that's just me.

I can't imagine turning a family heirloom into a fast buck, that once it was gone, there would be nothing to show for it...

Edward Tinker · 12-23-2003, 01:41 PM

Joseph, then we can say this about your luger:

It is an Imperial DWM that was reworked during the Weimar era for the police, it appears you have a complete matching rig!

I would love to see detailed photos of it? Can you scan it in on a scanner or take digital photos?

If you do a search, you will see several 1916 / 1920's on the forum from previous postings. Just as an aside, the 1920 is a reichwehr property marking and not really a date.

Ed

policeluger · 12-23-2003, 03:19 PM

The loading tool with the SN on the back is most correct....and a very good find.

J. L. Lyon · 12-23-2003, 08:38 PM

What is the purpose of the piece of metal attached to the barrel extension that the sear slides into. I've not seen this on any other Luger.

The pistol also has a second piece of metal added to the left side of the frame. It is anchored in a separate hole just behind the the hole for the trigger pivot pin, then runs across the frame, makes a U and then is fitted in a slot on the left side smooth plate. The slot is visible when you look at the left side of the pistol. Any comments would be appreciated on this one.

policeluger · 12-23-2003, 11:00 PM

1. the small band of spring steel you refer too is a magazine safety, a police device/order. It keeps the gun from firing a round in the chamber with the the gun disassembled into the top and bottom units, why?? really didn't need it. Sort of a safety device should there be a round in the chamber and the top part of the gun taken of the frame. You know on the Luger you can fire with the barrel/reciever unit while apart/off of the frame
2. The second item is a trigger safety, sound like yours, along with most trigger safetys encountered, is cut. It would have a double fold of the safety behind the trigger. It was too keep the gun from firing with the mag out of the gun...hope it is all not clear or just about a clear as mud???

Ron Wood · 12-24-2003, 12:02 AM

Your Luger has been fitted with a "magazine safety", or as policeluger identified it, a "trigger safety". The purpose of this device was to prevent the weapon from being fired by blocking the trigger from being pulled when the magazine was removed but a live round was in the chamber. A totally cumbersome concept that was quickly abandoned. Nearly every Luger so equipped was modified by cutting off the portion of the device that went behind the trigger to block it when the magazine was removed, as policeluger explained, or by removing the device entirely. Here is a picture of both safety devices.

12-23-2003, 01:08 AM	#1
J. L. Lyon User Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Salt Lake City Posts: 24 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Match Magazines and Holster I recently acquired a DWM Luger made in 1916, serial number 8565k. It has been overstamped 1920. I came with two magazines, both aluminum bottomed, with the magazine body blued on one the other left bright. The one magazine has the serial number 8565 but the letter is o not k so I know it's a mismatch. It also has the number 1 above the serial number. The second magazine has the number 8565 without a suffix letter stamped on the base, and the number 2 above it. Is the second one also a mismatch? I assume the 1 and 2 indicate the primary and spare magazine? It also came with the loading tool with matching serial number without suffix stamped on the shaft and on the opposite side and a small crown over an unreadable letter. Is this correct for the pistol? It came with a holster which is dated 1932. I'm not able to read the maker's name, but there is a sunburst under the year. The serial number without the suffix letter has been stamped on the back of the holster to the right of the year. Is this correct? I'm assuming this would have been a pistol issued to the Reichwehr. Is this correct? __________________ J.L.Lyon

12-23-2003, 02:50 AM	#2
Edward Tinker Super Moderator Eternal Lifer LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: North of Spokane, WA Posts: 15,974 Thanks: 2,072 Thanked 4,607 Times in 2,123 Posts	Actually, I am inclined to beleive it is a Weimar police, or at least some of it is? Does your luger have a sear safety such as this? see the "bar" at the top of the picture [ Normal army magazines are a serial number and nothing and the spare is a serial number and a plus sign. Police are marked with a 1, 2 or a 3 (on rare occassions a I or a II). Sometimes holsters are marked with the serial number, but I have see it more with weimar police, but then that is what I collect. Your complete rig sounds very nice! Ed __________________ Edward Tinker ************ Co-Author of Police Lugers - Co-Author of Simson Lugers Author of Veteran Bring Backs Vol I, Vol II, Vol III and Vol IV

12-23-2003, 11:33 AM	#3
J. L. Lyon User Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Salt Lake City Posts: 24 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	The sear/safety looks exactly like the one in your picture. Thanks for the posting and the information. I bought the outfit from the grandson of the man who broght it back from Europe. His grandson believed he served as a combat infantryman. __________________ J.L.Lyon

12-23-2003, 11:37 AM	#4
John Sabato Lifer Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: The Capital of the Free World Posts: 10,156 Thanks: 3,003 Thanked 2,309 Times in 1,098 Posts	Makes me wonder about the relationship between the grandson and his grandfather... If I were lucky enough to have received a war trophy that had been brought back by my grandfather, it would never leave my possession... until I was no longer breathing and I would make sure that some decendent who cared about not only history, but family history would be the heir to it... but that's just me. I can't imagine turning a family heirloom into a fast buck, that once it was gone, there would be nothing to show for it... __________________ regards, -John S "...We hold these truths to be self-evident that ALL men are created EQUAL *and are endowed by their Creator* with certain UNALIENABLE* rights, and among these are life, LIBERTY, and the pursuit of happiness..."*

12-23-2003, 01:41 PM	#5
Edward Tinker Super Moderator Eternal Lifer LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: North of Spokane, WA Posts: 15,974 Thanks: 2,072 Thanked 4,607 Times in 2,123 Posts	Joseph, then we can say this about your luger: It is an Imperial DWM that was reworked during the Weimar era for the police, it appears you have a complete matching rig! I would love to see detailed photos of it? Can you scan it in on a scanner or take digital photos? If you do a search, you will see several 1916 / 1920's on the forum from previous postings. Just as an aside, the 1920 is a reichwehr property marking and not really a date. Ed __________________ Edward Tinker ************ Co-Author of Police Lugers - Co-Author of Simson Lugers Author of Veteran Bring Backs Vol I, Vol II, Vol III and Vol IV

12-23-2003, 03:19 PM	#6
policeluger RIP Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Ca. Posts: 2,141 Thanks: 8 Thanked 89 Times in 54 Posts	The loading tool with the SN on the back is most correct....and a very good find.

12-23-2003, 08:38 PM	#7
J. L. Lyon User Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Salt Lake City Posts: 24 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	What is the purpose of the piece of metal attached to the barrel extension that the sear slides into. I've not seen this on any other Luger. The pistol also has a second piece of metal added to the left side of the frame. It is anchored in a separate hole just behind the the hole for the trigger pivot pin, then runs across the frame, makes a U and then is fitted in a slot on the left side smooth plate. The slot is visible when you look at the left side of the pistol. Any comments would be appreciated on this one. __________________ J.L.Lyon

12-23-2003, 11:00 PM	#8
policeluger RIP Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Ca. Posts: 2,141 Thanks: 8 Thanked 89 Times in 54 Posts	1. the small band of spring steel you refer too is a magazine safety, a police device/order. It keeps the gun from firing a round in the chamber with the the gun disassembled into the top and bottom units, why?? really didn't need it. Sort of a safety device should there be a round in the chamber and the top part of the gun taken of the frame. You know on the Luger you can fire with the barrel/reciever unit while apart/off of the frame 2. The second item is a trigger safety, sound like yours, along with most trigger safetys encountered, is cut. It would have a double fold of the safety behind the trigger. It was too keep the gun from firing with the mag out of the gun...hope it is all not clear or just about a clear as mud???

12-24-2003, 12:02 AM	#9
Ron Wood Moderator 2010 LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Santa Teresa New Mexico just outside of the West Texas town of El Paso Posts: 7,051 Thanks: 1,119 Thanked 5,286 Times in 1,728 Posts	Your Luger has been fitted with a "magazine safety", or as policeluger identified it, a "trigger safety". The purpose of this device was to prevent the weapon from being fired by blocking the trigger from being pulled when the magazine was removed but a live round was in the chamber. A totally cumbersome concept that was quickly abandoned. Nearly every Luger so equipped was modified by cutting off the portion of the device that went behind the trigger to block it when the magazine was removed, as policeluger explained, or by removing the device entirely. Here is a picture of both safety devices. __________________ If it's made after 1918...it's a reproduction