(re)bluing question

Dwight Gruber · 01-31-2002, 10:10 AM

As a new fish in the Luger pond my eye is not yet attuned to the finer points of blueing, and there is a gun for sale locally which may prove instructive. It is a garden variety 1908 commercial, and I am wondering if it has, indeed, been re-blued. The strawed parts have, for certain, which mitigates against the rest of the finish being original (its in the 85--90% range). The proof marks seem sharp and clear (haven't gone at them yet with a magnifying glass), so the gun hasn't been buffed to death--there isn't any obvious buffing at all.

The head-scratcher is that the barrel and toggle are beginning to turn a uniform, deep plum. Is this a characteristic of original finish age, or of a failure during re-blue? The barrel seems to be original, serial numbers match (although I haven't located a number on the breechblock and there is not one on the extractor, although it is stamped 'geladen'), and the underside of the barrel and receiver where they meet are stamped with a shallow line indidating they haven't moved, similar to a stamping on my Model 1900.

So, what does anybody think, re-blue or original? Just for the record asking price is $415, probably firm.

--Dwight

Thor · 01-31-2002, 10:24 AM

Dwight,Plum color is usually a result of a bad salt bluing job which occured on some Mauser Lugers. The one you are speaking of would have been rust blued originally. You might see some brown oxide under the rust blue which would look a little more brown in the sunlight. I think this Luger you are talking about has been salt blued with the original rust bluing removed, but would have to see it in person to be sure. Here is my 1938 S/42 that has a plum finish all over. It is next to my 1939 42 that has a proper salt blue. Did this gun look like this? ~Thor~

http://www.lugerforum.com/owner_gall...plumluger2.jpg

Craig · 01-31-2002, 10:31 AM

Is the coupling link blue? That "S" curved bar that connects the rear toggle link to the mainspring assembly is supposed to be "in the white". Most of the time it isn't disassembled, and is blued when the rest of the pistol is reblued.

Also, the safety bar, that part that appears and disappears as one operates the safety is supposed to be in the white.

The low price would point to something like reblueing having occured, unless it's a private party sale.

IMO,

Craig

Hugh · 01-31-2002, 11:52 AM

Dwight,

That is a reasonable price for a shooter even if it has been reblued. If you don't buy it, email me as I would like to buy it.

Dwight Gruber · 02-01-2002, 04:04 AM

Only the barrel and rear toggle link (and rear toggle pin, now that I think about it).

And the plum was -much- darker--if you saw it by itself, without being adjacent to parts which were truly black, you probably wouldn't think it was plum at all.

--Dwight

Dwight Gruber · 02-01-2002, 04:16 AM

Connecting link is definitely blued. A good tip about that, thenks eversomuch for this extremely valuable piece of information.

I don't recall about the safety bar, I'll check--another valuable nugget of info.

The price doesn't really have much relationship to the gun's condition, the seller doesn't know Lugers, and is very frank about not knowing if it is reblued or not, and not really knowing how to tell. A good educational time is being had by all.

--Dwight

Dwight Gruber · 02-01-2002, 11:06 AM

Hugh, I emailed you but it bounced, please email me directly.

--Dwight

01-31-2002, 10:10 AM	#1
Dwight Gruber User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Portland, Oregon Posts: 3,908 Thanks: 0 Thanked 1,330 Times in 435 Posts	(re)bluing question As a new fish in the Luger pond my eye is not yet attuned to the finer points of blueing, and there is a gun for sale locally which may prove instructive. It is a garden variety 1908 commercial, and I am wondering if it has, indeed, been re-blued. The strawed parts have, for certain, which mitigates against the rest of the finish being original (its in the 85--90% range). The proof marks seem sharp and clear (haven't gone at them yet with a magnifying glass), so the gun hasn't been buffed to death--there isn't any obvious buffing at all. The head-scratcher is that the barrel and toggle are beginning to turn a uniform, deep plum. Is this a characteristic of original finish age, or of a failure during re-blue? The barrel seems to be original, serial numbers match (although I haven't located a number on the breechblock and there is not one on the extractor, although it is stamped 'geladen'), and the underside of the barrel and receiver where they meet are stamped with a shallow line indidating they haven't moved, similar to a stamping on my Model 1900. So, what does anybody think, re-blue or original? Just for the record asking price is $415, probably firm. --Dwight

01-31-2002, 10:24 AM	#2
Thor User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Rio Rancho, New Mexico Posts: 4,583 Thanks: 958 Thanked 971 Times in 277 Posts	Re: (re)bluing question Dwight,Plum color is usually a result of a bad salt bluing job which occured on some Mauser Lugers. The one you are speaking of would have been rust blued originally. You might see some brown oxide under the rust blue which would look a little more brown in the sunlight. I think this Luger you are talking about has been salt blued with the original rust bluing removed, but would have to see it in person to be sure. Here is my 1938 S/42 that has a plum finish all over. It is next to my 1939 42 that has a proper salt blue. Did this gun look like this? ~Thor~ http://www.lugerforum.com/owner_gall...plumluger2.jpg

01-31-2002, 10:31 AM	#3
Craig User Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: Texas Posts: 40 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Re: (re)bluing question Is the coupling link blue? That "S" curved bar that connects the rear toggle link to the mainspring assembly is supposed to be "in the white". Most of the time it isn't disassembled, and is blued when the rest of the pistol is reblued. Also, the safety bar, that part that appears and disappears as one operates the safety is supposed to be in the white. The low price would point to something like reblueing having occured, unless it's a private party sale. IMO, Craig

01-31-2002, 11:52 AM	#4
Hugh RIP Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Southeast Texas Swamp Posts: 2,460 Thanks: 2 Thanked 166 Times in 65 Posts	Re: (re)bluing question Dwight, That is a reasonable price for a shooter even if it has been reblued. If you don't buy it, email me as I would like to buy it.

02-01-2002, 04:04 AM	#5
Dwight Gruber User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Portland, Oregon Posts: 3,908 Thanks: 0 Thanked 1,330 Times in 435 Posts	Re: (re)bluing question Only the barrel and rear toggle link (and rear toggle pin, now that I think about it). And the plum was -much- darker--if you saw it by itself, without being adjacent to parts which were truly black, you probably wouldn't think it was plum at all. --Dwight

02-01-2002, 04:16 AM	#6
Dwight Gruber User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Portland, Oregon Posts: 3,908 Thanks: 0 Thanked 1,330 Times in 435 Posts	Re: (re)bluing question Connecting link is definitely blued. A good tip about that, thenks eversomuch for this extremely valuable piece of information. I don't recall about the safety bar, I'll check--another valuable nugget of info. The price doesn't really have much relationship to the gun's condition, the seller doesn't know Lugers, and is very frank about not knowing if it is reblued or not, and not really knowing how to tell. A good educational time is being had by all. --Dwight

02-01-2002, 11:06 AM	#7
Dwight Gruber User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Portland, Oregon Posts: 3,908 Thanks: 0 Thanked 1,330 Times in 435 Posts	Re: (re)bluing question Hugh, I emailed you but it bounced, please email me directly. --Dwight