Homeowner goes to prison after showing deadly weapon!

[Jasta2]

Many people here in New Hampshire have learned that what we thought to be a home owners rights to protect his private property are wrong. A local homeowner, after many times asking/telling a unwanted female tresspasser on his very well posted land to leave, he went inside and returned with a firearm insisting on the tresspasser to leave. At this point she did, but filed charges against him for criminal threating with a deadly weapon. After turning down a plea deal, found guilty and after a three year fight over what he thought were his rights to protect his home/property the New Hampshire Surpreme Court upheld the guilty finding. Now a well respected local family man with children, is a felon and starting his 3 year prison term for doing what he thought was his right. There is quite a outcry about this around here to get this overturned. There is even a website about this story. The moral is be careful about what you might 'think' is your right!
Oh, no charges were ever filed for the female treepassing!!

Note to moderator, please remove this post if you feel it is not proper for this forum.
Bill

[alanint]

Thank god I live in Florida where the Castle Doctrine was recently passed. I would have the right to run this person off at gunpoint here...

[Curss]

Amen to the Castle Doctrine. As a fellow Floridian, it saddens me to hear about other states having issues about self defense.

By the way, love the part about the trespasser not getting charged. The privilege of equal rights SHOULD come with the burden of EQUAL responsibility!!!

[lew1]

We don't need to get into the question of equal rights as that does not involve lugers.

[jonnyc]

Well, before this gets locked, let me add...according to your post the gentleman retreated then returned armed. That's not legal. He became the aggressor, his land or not. I don't believe even the Florida "Castle Doc" would allow that.

[suum cuique]

maybe he should have taken a picture of this person...

Here's the recommended camera:





just kidding...



seems like he overreacted a little bit if he threatened her with a gun if she was just trespassing his property and there was no real threat or harm outgoing from this woman, especially if he knows her doing this some times before. (Like taking a short cut)
Bill, just keep in mind that acts like this are the best fuel for the anti-gun-media machine to run their campaign against legal gun owners.

[lugerholsterrepair]

Most places it's called brandishing a weapon and it's illegal. Force can be met with equal force..a good thing to remember. He could have been much smarter to call the cops.

Jerry Burney

[rivieraranch]

Writing as an attorney, the use of deadly force is an extremely complicated issue.

If you fire a bullet you are legally responsible, to the state if same has been discharged unlawfully, and civilly if damages result from negligently discharging a firearm.

In Florida there is a minimum mandatory sentence for assault with a firearm. This statute was tested on appeal. The facts were that during an auto repair dispute an elderly lady pulled an unloaded gun on an auto repairman. Despite the gun being unloaded, her conviction for the minimum mandatory sentence was upheld.

If you pull a gun you better be able to show that you were legitimately in fear for your life. If not, nobody has any business pulling a gun.

[lugerholsterrepair]

I agree with Jim..pulling out a weapon has consequences. If you carry or believe you might ever have occasion to need a weapon ...it might be wise to take a concealed carry class. We don't need one to legally carry concealed here in AZ thanks to our Republican Govenor Jan Brewer...BUT these classes can refresh our memories about what to do and what NOT to do.

Even if you are not convicted in a case it could bankrupt you. Best to use your head and not get charged with a crime.

Jerry Burney

[WG dog]

Here's a link. Don't really know the facts, but it sounds like the guy left the safety of his home and used a firearm to threaten a woman who was lost and not doing anything harmful or threatening.

http://thetruthaboutguns.com/2010/12...ers-up-in-arms

Reminds me of a mean 90+ year old neighbor who would run out of her house and scream at little kids walking on the sidewalk if they stepped on her grass.

[Jasta2]

Agreed, the guy should have called the police/911 first before geting his gun. As for the website link, this is one of the sites. If you search WARDBIRD.COM there are many news stories this. I live next to the town in which this happened and never knew the fellow,but working in a hardware store as I do part time, there looks to be 'other sides' to what exactly happened. Who is correct, only the two know, but as shown the courts decided that. I too have learned much from these news accounts.
Thank to Jerry and Jim on this forum I also now know about what not to do!
Thanks,Bill

[lugerholsterrepair]

I have the Scottish idea that most anyone may walk on the many acres Ellie and I have in Colorado as long as they are there to enjoy nature without harming it in any way. We allow it and incourage it. We don't allow hunters or Christmas tree cutters or the like but I prefer to talk to people who arrive on our properties with a courteous demeanor. Being polite has always worked for me when it comes to visitors.

I read the link to the news and the following comments. I guess it depends on whose story you believe...
The fellow made a huge tactical error..he reached out and touched the tar baby called the justice system.

Interesting comments on the link.

Jerry Burney

[drbuster]

I think that the problem here is that this poor man presented a firearm on his land thinking that his castle doctrine pertained. I believe his castle doctrine would have applied if the woman had been in his house (the castle), thus allowing him to threaten deadly force. Of course, he had to fear for his life in some way.

[lew1]

I have a country home and a city home.

The country home is really rural. If someone tells you to get off their property - you either leave immediately else you will be shot or the dogs set on you.

If the property is posted, do not ignore the signs unless the people who posted the signs know and like you.

The sheriff would not intervene in any of the above instances.

[lugerholsterrepair]

The country home is really rural. If someone tells you to get off their property - you either leave immediately else you will be shot or the dogs set on you.

Charlie, I would be VERY carefull writing statements advocating murder. Should you ever be involved in such an incident written statements like this could come back to haunt you.

Most trespassing signs say stay out under penalty of law.... not penalty of death.

Shooting someone for trespassing on your rural property could get you the same residencial address as Ward Bird.

You had also better check with the local Sheriff. He might not be as lenient as you believe.

Jerry Burney

[lew1]

The road on which the property is located is about 2 miles long and dead ends.

In summer of 2008, around 2 AM three teenagers (age determined later) went up the road shooting up people's mail boxes and cars.

They were from a different part of the county and did not realize that it was a dead end road. So they had to come back out - past all of the houses. They only made it about 2/3 of the way.

I wish to note that I was not there when this occured - but I saw the car and the interior. It's a wonder they made it as far as they did.

Nothing came of it. The only time there could be problems if you have previously upset the sheriff or are affecting the sheriff's various enterprises.

This is Eastern Kentucky.

Here is a recent link to a different activity there. Every several years the FBI comes in and investigates.

http://www.kentucky.com/2010/12/10/1...-fraud-in.html


just so you know, I am only tolerated there because I married a girl from there (plus I have 3 brother-in-laws there).

[Thor]

Step one contact the police and have them deal with it.
Step two, only present a weapon if you are threatened with deadly force.
Always descalate if possible. No body that I know of wants to hurt anyone unless it looks like someone is going to hurt you first and your family. A safe retreat is not in our nature but is adviseable if possible. Getting photographic evidence that they are trespassing would be good to have when you ask the assistance of the local LEO.

[rivieraranch]

Imagine an angry email or a post somewhere that is printed on enlarged poster board and shown to a jury.

That is what you have to consider before writing anything.

Email and posts are like herpes; they are forever.

[Curss]

I do believe Mr. Thor has it set right.