Daughter's New BYF 41

DZelenka · 09-25-2009, 12:37 PM

My daughter recently inherited this Luger from her grandfather (she got to pick first from his collection and has excellent tastes). The pistol is a byf 41 "Black Widow" with all matching numbers and a correct magazine in what I would consider Good+ to VG- condition.

This pistol was a bring back from WWII by my daughter's grandfather's step-father. There is no paperwork with it, but the step-father was a Brigadier General (Army Air Corps) so I doubt he needed any. Interesting man. He was a WWI ace w/ a Distinguished Service Cross from WWI (the mission for which he was awarded the DSC took place on my daughter's birthday). He was also the Chief of Staff of the 9th Air Force during WWII. I am trying to get some sort of solid provenance concerning the pistol, but all I have is family recollection (the General has been dead since the 50s).

Dan

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worldoftone · 09-27-2009, 09:01 AM

Nice!

- WOT

dmilleri · 09-27-2009, 04:52 PM

Dan....nice gun......What is the letter portion of the SN?

Dave

drbuster · 09-27-2009, 07:05 PM

Unfortunately, getting provenance on this Black Widow byf is all but impossible. I would just enjoy it for what it is, a relic of history lived by your family. The story you gave us on this Forum would be provenance enough for me!

DZelenka · 09-28-2009, 11:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dmilleri

Dan....nice gun......What is the letter portion of the SN?

Dave

Where would I find it?

DZelenka · 09-28-2009, 11:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by drbuster

Unfortunately, getting provenance on this Black Widow byf is all but impossible. I would just enjoy it for what it is, a relic of history lived by your family. The story you gave us on this Forum would be provenance enough for me!

I just found out that my ex father-in-law sold all of the General's memorabilia about 5 years ago to a collector. This included all of his medals. Recently, his diary from the war years was found and I have been promised at least a chance to read it (I will probably end up keeping it for my daughter). From what I hear, the diary has information about his interaction with a lot of interesting people. I am looking forward to getting my hands on it.

Dan

spartacus38 · 09-28-2009, 12:50 PM

Hi Dan,

Beautiful 1941 Luger.

From what I can see the condition of the gun is 98%.

Bob

John Sabato · 09-28-2009, 01:42 PM

The serial number on the front of the frame just above the trigger guard, and below the barrel should be 4 digits and a single script alphabetic character which indicates the series of the production the year it was made. This letter is an integral part of the serial number but is often overlooked.

Nice byf41

My favorite WW2 Lugers short of the Krieghoff's of course.

DZelenka · 09-29-2009, 12:29 AM

Something tells me it was an "f". I will check for sure next time I open the safe. I received my new hold open spring from Numrich. The broken one is polished and the new one is black, should I change them or look for a polished one?

So what is one of these things worth?

DavidJayUden · 09-29-2009, 08:29 AM

Ballpark figure: $1500, maybe a bit more to the right guy if everything checks out.
DJU

Frank · 09-30-2009, 11:59 AM

DZelenka, Very nice 41 byf!! But the suffix can't be "f"!!

Please take another look and perhaps photograph the serial number on the front of the frame and post it here!!

DZelenka · 09-30-2009, 03:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Frank

DZelenka, Very nice 41 byf!! But the suffix can't be "f"!!

Please take another look and perhaps photograph the serial number on the front of the frame and post it here!!

Like I said, I was doing it from memory. I will actually look before I post next time.

DZelenka · 09-30-2009, 10:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Frank

DZelenka, Very nice 41 byf!! But the suffix can't be "f"!!

Please take another look and perhaps photograph the serial number on the front of the frame and post it here!!

How about a script "w"?

Frank · 10-01-2009, 09:17 AM

Quote:

How about a script "w"?

That's a possible script letter! Thanks.

Lugerdoc · 10-01-2009, 10:13 AM

It appear to me that your PO8 has been reblued and some of the small parts strawed, that should also be blue, so not really a collector piece, but interesting because of who owned it. TH

DZelenka · 10-01-2009, 10:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lugerdoc

It appear to me that your PO8 has been reblued and some of the small parts strawed, that should also be blue, so not really a collector piece, but interesting because of who owned it. TH

I am trying to see what you are talking about. There is a good bit of oil on the gun in those pictures and the light is giving it a shiny appearance. If by "strawed" you mean the gold color that I have seen on some triggers, there is no gold on this pistol. Give me some things to look for that are tell tale signs of a refinish job.

By the way, I understand that I need to get a hold open catch spring from you. What is the best way to order?

DAn

Lugerdoc · 10-01-2009, 06:26 PM

Dan, Sorry if I was mistaken by the flash making the TD lever, trigger & mag catch appear strawed in your photos. Also the oil gave it an almost over polished appearance. This is why I never purchase guns from a photo: hard to see what's real. I do have new HO springs available @$25 + $3 S&H. Please send check to address below. Thanks, Tom

alvin · 10-01-2009, 08:31 PM

Although covered by oil, this gun still gives a sharp feeling, plus those minor rust dots... my bet is original on those pix. Nice nice byf, and can pay shipping for hand-on viewing now

DZelenka · 10-02-2009, 12:40 AM

I took a good look at the exterior just now. All of the exterior surfaces are black including TD lever, trigger and mag catch. The only exception is the ejector which is a plum color. The oil and the light make finish look shinier than it is. There are several small (smaller than the eagle stamp) rust spots (maybe 6 or 7) some of which involve minute pitting. the back of the grip strap had some handling rust that I removed with an oil soaked rag. You can see the spots if you look closely as they are a shade off of the finish. There is very minor holster wear at the muzzle on both sides (just on the edge). There is also slight finish wear on some of the moving parts. The rifling is sharp. I don't know how to judge finish issues in percent or how to grade a gun so I am pretty conservative about it. However, the more pictures I look at and the more I look at this gun, the better it looks.

Dan

09-25-2009, 12:37 PM	#1
DZelenka User Join Date: Sep 2009 Posts: 15 Thanks: 0 Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post	Daughter's New BYF 41 My daughter recently inherited this Luger from her grandfather (she got to pick first from his collection and has excellent tastes). The pistol is a byf 41 "Black Widow" with all matching numbers and a correct magazine in what I would consider Good+ to VG- condition. This pistol was a bring back from WWII by my daughter's grandfather's step-father. There is no paperwork with it, but the step-father was a Brigadier General (Army Air Corps) so I doubt he needed any. Interesting man. He was a WWI ace w/ a Distinguished Service Cross from WWI (the mission for which he was awarded the DSC took place on my daughter's birthday). He was also the Chief of Staff of the 9th Air Force during WWII. I am trying to get some sort of solid provenance concerning the pistol, but all I have is family recollection (the General has been dead since the 50s). Dan

09-27-2009, 04:52 PM	#3
dmilleri User Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: Livonia, Mi Posts: 18 Thanks: 3 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	41byf Dan....nice gun......What is the letter portion of the SN? Dave

09-28-2009, 01:42 PM	#8
John Sabato Lifer Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: The Capital of the Free World Posts: 10,156 Thanks: 3,003 Thanked 2,308 Times in 1,098 Posts	The serial number on the front of the frame just above the trigger guard, and below the barrel should be 4 digits and a single script alphabetic character which indicates the series of the production the year it was made. This letter is an integral part of the serial number but is often overlooked. Nice byf41 My favorite WW2 Lugers short of the Krieghoff's of course. __________________ regards, -John S "...We hold these truths to be self-evident that ALL men are created EQUAL *and are endowed by their Creator* with certain UNALIENABLE* rights, and among these are life, LIBERTY, and the pursuit of happiness..."*

10-01-2009, 10:13 AM	#15
Lugerdoc Patron LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: POB 398 St.Charles,MO. 63302 Posts: 5,089 Thanks: 6 Thanked 737 Times in 484 Posts	It appear to me that your PO8 has been reblued and some of the small parts strawed, that should also be blue, so not really a collector piece, but interesting because of who owned it. TH __________________ Tom Heller POB 398 ST.Charles, MO. 63302 Tel 636-447-3006 lugerdoc@charter.net

10-01-2009, 06:26 PM	#17
Lugerdoc Patron LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: POB 398 St.Charles,MO. 63302 Posts: 5,089 Thanks: 6 Thanked 737 Times in 484 Posts	Dan, Sorry if I was mistaken by the flash making the TD lever, trigger & mag catch appear strawed in your photos. Also the oil gave it an almost over polished appearance. This is why I never purchase guns from a photo: hard to see what's real. I do have new HO springs available @$25 + $3 S&H. Please send check to address below. Thanks, Tom __________________ Tom Heller POB 398 ST.Charles, MO. 63302 Tel 636-447-3006 lugerdoc@charter.net

09-27-2009, 09:01 AM	#2
worldoftone User Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: San Antonio, TX Posts: 81 Thanks: 0 Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post	Nice! - WOT

09-27-2009, 07:05 PM	#4
drbuster User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: San Mateo, California Posts: 1,432 Thanks: 2 Thanked 71 Times in 56 Posts	Unfortunately, getting provenance on this Black Widow byf is all but impossible. I would just enjoy it for what it is, a relic of history lived by your family. The story you gave us on this Forum would be provenance enough for me!

09-28-2009, 12:50 PM	#7
spartacus38 Patron LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: South Lake Tahoe,CA. Posts: 695 Thanks: 0 Thanked 70 Times in 56 Posts	Hi Dan, Beautiful 1941 Luger. From what I can see the condition of the gun is 98%. Bob

09-29-2009, 12:29 AM	#9
DZelenka User Join Date: Sep 2009 Posts: 15 Thanks: 0 Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post	Something tells me it was an "f". I will check for sure next time I open the safe. I received my new hold open spring from Numrich. The broken one is polished and the new one is black, should I change them or look for a polished one? So what is one of these things worth?

09-29-2009, 08:29 AM	#10
DavidJayUden Patron LugerForum Patron Join Date: Nov 2008 Posts: 4,047 Thanks: 578 Thanked 1,414 Times in 887 Posts	Ballpark figure: $1500, maybe a bit more to the right guy if everything checks out. DJU

09-30-2009, 11:59 AM	#11
Frank RIP Patron LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Hot & Dry PHX, AZ Posts: 2,078 Thanks: 24 Thanked 164 Times in 87 Posts	DZelenka, Very nice 41 byf!! But the suffix can't be "f"!! Please take another look and perhaps photograph the serial number on the front of the frame and post it here!!

10-01-2009, 08:31 PM	#18
alvin User Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: US Posts: 3,843 Thanks: 132 Thanked 729 Times in 438 Posts	Although covered by oil, this gun still gives a sharp feeling, plus those minor rust dots... my bet is original on those pix. Nice nice byf, and can pay shipping for hand-on viewing now

10-02-2009, 12:40 AM	#19
DZelenka User Join Date: Sep 2009 Posts: 15 Thanks: 0 Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post	I took a good look at the exterior just now. All of the exterior surfaces are black including TD lever, trigger and mag catch. The only exception is the ejector which is a plum color. The oil and the light make finish look shinier than it is. There are several small (smaller than the eagle stamp) rust spots (maybe 6 or 7) some of which involve minute pitting. the back of the grip strap had some handling rust that I removed with an oil soaked rag. You can see the spots if you look closely as they are a shade off of the finish. There is very minor holster wear at the muzzle on both sides (just on the edge). There is also slight finish wear on some of the moving parts. The rifling is sharp. I don't know how to judge finish issues in percent or how to grade a gun so I am pretty conservative about it. However, the more pictures I look at and the more I look at this gun, the better it looks. Dan