Better question, are these original "Black Widow" grips?

Wespe · 11-21-2007, 10:59 AM

Pretty new to Lugers here and just signed up to this board yesterday. anyways, I purchases a 42 BYF Luger a while ago, and I was told the grips on it are possibly repros, so I would like to buy some real ones to replace them if they can be found anywhere. If any of you guys have any leads, let me know! Thanks

zinfull · 11-21-2007, 12:07 PM

The first thing is to see if they are repos. Please post good pics. EBay has some but it is a jungle and you may be buying repos agaian.

Jerry

Wespe · 11-21-2007, 09:13 PM

I'll try to get some pics posted this weekend.

rttwlrby · 11-23-2007, 03:11 PM

I have extra real bakelight P.08 grips......$ 185.00 plus shipping.

contact me if you are interested.

Wespe · 11-23-2007, 07:59 PM

Pics available, I am not sure what they should look like on the inside, but they appear to be poorly made to me.

Pete Ebbink · 11-24-2007, 01:06 PM

The bakelite of real BW grips "clack" when you tap them together...sort of like the sound of Spanish castanetas,

Some of the more modern plastics used on repros do not have that unique "clacking' sound; their sound being more muted and "dull" in resonance.

These repros will also get a bit pliable when you warm them up in a glass of hot water. The Bakelite ones do not.

Your seems to fit really well, which is a promising sign.

Can you attach your grip screws into the threaded holes in the back of each grip ?

Can you post close up of the "islands" on the inside surface of the left grip...so we can see the machining pattern or swirls on the island ?

There is also a very informative discussion about these black and brown grips over on Jan Still's Gun Boards. Here is the link to that discussion with lots of photos :

http://luger.gunboards.com/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=1497

Here is a photo of a pair of grips that I believe are real...showing the islands :

Wespe · 11-24-2007, 02:25 PM

Thanks for th ehelp. The grip screws do thread ibnto the holes on the inside of the grips. When I knock them together they sound like wood, like drum sticks almost. The thing is I don't see any milling marks, and there are pores you can see, like they were cast. You can see that in the pic where I am holding up the grip. I am a novice when it comes to Lugers, so I am just starting to learn about them.

Wespe · 11-28-2007, 05:55 PM

Anybody?

rttwlrby · 11-28-2007, 06:14 PM

they look original, as are the ones i offered you, and i did send you pics to your mailbox, as you requested, and have not heard from you.
regards...

John Sabato · 11-29-2007, 11:15 AM

Sorry to disagree, but without much better photographs, IMHO I cannot offer an opinion that these grips are genuine original bakelite of the type issued during 1939-1942.

The interior surfaces are not what I expect to see on genuine grips... and the border around the checkering appears to be too wide to be genunine... I believe they are reproductions... quite possibly cast from a set of genuine grips. This does not mean that they are not very serviceable grips, especially if they fit well... but it does mean that they are not worth what a pair of genuine grips brings in today's collector market.

11-21-2007, 10:59 AM	#1
Wespe User Join Date: Nov 2007 Posts: 6 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Better question, are these original "Black Widow" grips? Pretty new to Lugers here and just signed up to this board yesterday. anyways, I purchases a 42 BYF Luger a while ago, and I was told the grips on it are possibly repros, so I would like to buy some real ones to replace them if they can be found anywhere. If any of you guys have any leads, let me know! Thanks

11-28-2007, 06:14 PM	#9
rttwlrby User Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: California Posts: 45 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Bakelite Grips... they look original, as are the ones i offered you, and i did send you pics to your mailbox, as you requested, and have not heard from you. regards...

11-29-2007, 11:15 AM	#10
John Sabato Lifer Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: The Capital of the Free World Posts: 10,156 Thanks: 3,003 Thanked 2,308 Times in 1,098 Posts	Sorry to disagree, but without much better photographs, IMHO I cannot offer an opinion that these grips are genuine original bakelite of the type issued during 1939-1942. The interior surfaces are not what I expect to see on genuine grips... and the border around the checkering appears to be too wide to be genunine... I believe they are reproductions... quite possibly cast from a set of genuine grips. This does not mean that they are not very serviceable grips, especially if they fit well... but it does mean that they are not worth what a pair of genuine grips brings in today's collector market. __________________ regards, -John S "...We hold these truths to be self-evident that ALL men are created EQUAL *and are endowed by their Creator* with certain UNALIENABLE* rights, and among these are life, LIBERTY, and the pursuit of happiness..."*

11-21-2007, 12:07 PM	#2
zinfull Lifer Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Sonoma County CA Posts: 244 Thanks: 5 Thanked 34 Times in 17 Posts	The first thing is to see if they are repos. Please post good pics. EBay has some but it is a jungle and you may be buying repos agaian. Jerry

11-21-2007, 09:13 PM	#3
Wespe User Join Date: Nov 2007 Posts: 6 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	I'll try to get some pics posted this weekend.

11-23-2007, 03:11 PM	#4
rttwlrby User Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: California Posts: 45 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	I have extra real bakelight P.08 grips......$ 185.00 plus shipping. contact me if you are interested.

11-23-2007, 07:59 PM	#5
Wespe User Join Date: Nov 2007 Posts: 6 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Pics available, I am not sure what they should look like on the inside, but they appear to be poorly made to me.

11-24-2007, 01:06 PM	#6
Pete Ebbink User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: The USA Posts: 5,919 Thanks: 0 Thanked 6 Times in 4 Posts	The bakelite of real BW grips "clack" when you tap them together...sort of like the sound of Spanish castanetas, Some of the more modern plastics used on repros do not have that unique "clacking' sound; their sound being more muted and "dull" in resonance. These repros will also get a bit pliable when you warm them up in a glass of hot water. The Bakelite ones do not. Your seems to fit really well, which is a promising sign. Can you attach your grip screws into the threaded holes in the back of each grip ? Can you post close up of the "islands" on the inside surface of the left grip...so we can see the machining pattern or swirls on the island ? There is also a very informative discussion about these black and brown grips over on Jan Still's Gun Boards. Here is the link to that discussion with lots of photos : http://luger.gunboards.com/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=1497 Here is a photo of a pair of grips that I believe are real...showing the islands :

11-24-2007, 02:25 PM	#7
Wespe User Join Date: Nov 2007 Posts: 6 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Thanks for th ehelp. The grip screws do thread ibnto the holes on the inside of the grips. When I knock them together they sound like wood, like drum sticks almost. The thing is I don't see any milling marks, and there are pores you can see, like they were cast. You can see that in the pic where I am holding up the grip. I am a novice when it comes to Lugers, so I am just starting to learn about them.

11-28-2007, 05:55 PM	#8
Wespe User Join Date: Nov 2007 Posts: 6 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Anybody?