I Need Help With Another Heavy Rifle~

[cirelaw]

I paid $200 at a gun show in Pa during law school. It has a folding bayonet and some strange letters on the chamber. I don't have a clue! Eric

[danielsand]

It looks like Russian Mosin-Nagant M44. Caliber 7.62X54 (also called 7.62R - R meaning Russian). Ammo is abundant in the States. Judging by the pics (not clear markings), it is Russian, which had much nicer finish than the same weapon produced by Chinese (Type 53), which was ROUGH.

Very handy short rifle (carbine), shooting VERY powerful round. Hope this helps. Search the web for Mosin-Nagant, and you will get plethora of pictures, and information.

If interested in these milsurp weapons, the best thing is to join one of the MANY milsurp forums on the web. BTW,.....when you posted the pic of your gun cabinet, I recognized this one right away, and Thommy of course (not to mention Yugo M48)!

BTW: I don't know when you graduated from law school (I graduated in 1978), but it seems you paid too much. Back in the 80s you could buy one of these for less than 100. Last year I saw a crate full of full size M91s in Las Vegas gun shop, for 140 each (and they were MINT).

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mosin%E2%80%93Nagant

[danielsand]

I just blew up your pic (as much as my computer allows), and it does look like Chicom Type 53! If it is, it's probably nicest looking Type 53 I've seen. Usually they are very rough, and the stocks look like they were covered in THICK shellac (chipped and peeling in MANY places). If this one IS Chicom, it most likely has the stock that's been refinished.

Closeup of the receiver markings would help of course.

[sheepherder]

Didn't the Finns make a copy of the M44 carbine? (Or refurbish the captured Russian carbines). The triangle on the barrel reminds me of a Finn marking...

Edit: The Finns made their rifles/carbine based on the Russian 1891 Mosin Nagant 7.62 design. SAOTW says thet were higher quality than the Russian weapons. Which probably accounts for the relatively high cost of $200 back when Eric was in law school...

[danielsand]

Yes they were made in Finland too (in the US also!). I still can't see the markings clearly, and I am in no way "an expert" on Mosin. The price is irrelevant (cost of a decent dinner for two), it's a NICE carbine, with some serious energy delivered to the target, and very handy for having behind the seat of one's pickup (at least in these mountains), "just in case".

I like Mosin (regardless of the manufacture). I'm still kicking myself for not buying one out of the crate in Vegas last year. And they all had their receivers drilled and tapped for the scope mounts! No scopes present, but that's easy enough. But where do you stop? IF I would to buy every weapon I like (there are VERY few I don't like!!), I'd need a warehouse! I have two gun safes, and they are bursting being overloaded as it is.

BTW,......seems like Eric is pretty confident in his home security system. I would love to have my collection visible in an antique gun cabinet, but when I leave the house, all the stuff is locked into the best safes money can buy (despite a good security system, and three VERY protective BIG dogs, two of which you can see in my avatar).

[Bill_in_VA]

Eric, it looks like your rifle is a Soviet M44, made at the Izhevsk arsenal as evidenced by the arrow-in-the-triangle stamped on the receiver ring. Your photo leaves a little to be desired though. Chinese Type 53 carbines carry Chinese characters, not Cyrillic.
$200 is a pretty typical price for the M44, too. IIRC, most distributors that have these in stock were last asking around $229.

[cirelaw]

Thank You Bill. I graduated Villanova law in 1981 and bought the rifle a year earlier. I then fell in love with the 22 cal trainers and eventually in to lugers. My Walther Sportsmodel pictured below! SWEET!

[danielsand]

Originally Posted by Bill_in_VA

Eric, it looks like your rifle is a Soviet M44, made at the Izhevsk arsenal as evidenced by the arrow-in-the-triangle stamped on the receiver ring. Your photo leaves a little to be desired though. Chinese Type 53 carbines carry Chinese characters, not Cyrillic.
$200 is a pretty typical price for the M44, too. IIRC, most distributors that have these in stock were last asking around $229.

When I blew up the pic, I saw the triangle (but not the arrow). As you probably know, some Chicom weapons (SKS/AK types) also have triangle with a letter for the factory marking. The characters were all blurry in Eric's pic also. 229 seems right in today's pricing, but back in late 70s-80s that was a LOT of money for milsurp.

Izhevsk made weapons are "top tier" of the Russian manufacture, with Tula being second. Great little rifle, regardless of the origin.

[Edward Tinker]

I thought the R stood for 'rimmed'

[cirelaw]

I luv the carbines and the wood~

[danielsand]

Originally Posted by Edward Tinker

I thought the R stood for 'rimmed'

Some people say it stands for "rimmed", some say it's for "Russian". I always called it "7.62 Russian". Does it really matter? As long as we know which weapons to load it in. .303 British is never referred as "rimmed" but as we all know it is rimmed.
Call it what you will. It's a good cartridge (both,...7.62R and .303), but I still prefer 7.92 Mauser.

[sheepherder]

... ...

[cirelaw]

Mosin Markings~~http://www.russian-mosin-nagant.com/...rks/index.html

[danielsand]

Originally Posted by sheepherder

... ...

Not to say it doesn't exist, but I've never heard of M44 carbine in that price range (and I've been buying/shooting/collecting since the early 70s). There was one on the gun show recently, in decent condition, and they wanted $250.- which I thought to be out of line. In the early 90s, I had FFL, and I was buying all kinds of weaponry from distributors like CSI, Birmingham Pistol Parlor, etc. "Pre Internet" times. Times when gun deals came to us in the form of SGN (all black and white, with amusing drawings or soldiers, gear, and weapons).

Eric,......since you are asking about this rifle here (now,....35 years later!), I assume you never fired it? And I must admit,......your questions about M48, and M44 are puzzling for me. Owning a weapon for several decades, and not knowing ANYTHING about it? Really? Or are you just "testing" the forum members on their knowledge regarding military surplus rifles?

I have NEVER owned ANYTHING (tools, machinery, cars, motorcycles, airplanes, boats, guns, watches), that I didn't research in depth, learned everything about them, and then used them, serviced/repaired them, etc.

[tudorbug]

And I like especially the photo of the two German Shepards!

David

[cirelaw]

In between I had a fall in Costa Rica resulting in a nasty subdural hematoma causing loss of upper body strength and coordination making it impossible to safely fire a rifle. I then put away the rifles and moved to lugers. It has been my finest decision ever. I do have a beautiful shooter especially made for me by George Anderson, one of our senior members and mentor to whom I forever gratefull. I will never fire any of my others in my collection as they are all to valuable! Eric

[Curly1]

Finish made rifles, M27,28,39 were based on using captured or purchased Russian receivers.

They then made their own barrels and 2 piece stocks.

They also refurbed Russian captured rifles, 91/30, M38, M44 during the War years with Russia in the late 30's and early 40's. They marked them wit the SA in a square army acceptance mark on the receiver.

The prices have risen from under $100 to over $200 in the past few years.

[cirelaw]

Calibre~Cartridges http://www.sff.net/people/sanders/rrdws3.html

[Sergio Natali]

Originally Posted by cirelaw

Calibre~Cartridges http://www.sff.net/people/sanders/rrdws3.html

What's this?
Where have you put te best pistol round ever made: .45ACP ???




Sergio


(I'm joking)

[Sergio Natali]

Eric,

... still referring to the .45ACP caliber look what I've just found!

As usual from Hickok45 that's a fun treat to watch.
The gun was arsenal refurbished, and even has mismatched grips if you look closely, still it's always a pleasure to watch "our hero".

http://youtu.be/tm-K8QlzTHc