New member w/ byf 41

Pelorat · 01-15-2003, 11:26 PM

Hallo all! I'm relatively new to all this, but here's what I have:

Serial: 9617, no suffix, all matching ##
Toggle: byf
Chamber: 41
Toggle Knob: Squared/Knurled (rough & checkered, I'm assuming that's the same thing)
Grip Safety: Not present
Stock lug: Present
Caliber: 9mm
Grip type: Walnut, checkered, no border, no insignia, no markings on inner surface
Thumb Safety: Safe rear, smooth, 'Gesichert'
Markings: #47 on the list (eagle/135, stick eagle/135 (almost worn off), eagle/swastika) right side chamber, eagle/swastika on barrel, 8.83 under barrel
Barrel length: ~4" (no ruler handy)
Extractor markings: 'Geladen', faint eagle/circle near toggle joint
Sights: fixed (milled?) rear, adjustable front.. uh.. (\ with ridges (no idea how to describe that, as I know there are several different types)
Magazine: 1, extruded, bakelite base, fxo, eagle/37, no serial

Condition: worn bluing (maybe 80-85, guesstimate), regular pitting on right side, scratches on left side, some chipping of blue - looks like it was dropped at least twice.
Bore: shiny, clean, light pitting around breech.

The holster is an original P38, beat to crap with various Nazi markings (it's put up, no access to it right now)

I paid $700 for it. From what I can tell it's a real 'bring-back', but with no papers or ID or anything else. It shoots very nicely - had some issues with ejection failures and toggle hold-back till I cleaned out the hold-open latch and stopped limp-wristing it.

Basic question is - should I keep on shooting it regularly (I did get replacement grips) or drop it in a safe? And can anyone fill in the year of make or any other nifty info like that?

And if I got taken for a 'benjamin ride' on the price, break it to me gently, willya? =)

ToggleTop · 01-15-2003, 11:58 PM

Hello Pelorat,
I believe the 41-byf's with the E/135 receiver proofing are somewhat scarce, as most were proofed E/655. Take care of it and for $700, no you did not get hurt. Wish I owned it! Pictures would be nice. Oh, it was made in 1941, that is what the 41 over the chamber indicates.

Frank · 01-16-2003, 12:25 AM

Hello Todd and welcome. Toggletop gave you a short and sweet version.

There are three varieties of the byf 41 with respect to the acceptance marks. The most common has two E/655 marks, then two E/135 marks and finally a mixed bag E/655 and E/135. Some have estimated that there are about 4000 byf 41 Lugers that are not of the two E/655 variety. So you can judge the rariety yourself. It is a very desirable Luger to own. Your pistol was very likely made in January of 1942 with a left over 1941 receiver.

As far as price goes, you did just fine.

As far as shooting it, you will run the risk of breaking a numbered piece and then the value will drop to a shooter grade and you could lose some bucks. It is your Luger, so the choice is up to you.

Pelorat · 01-16-2003, 07:33 AM

Cool, thanks a lot, guys! I think it might end up on my 'seldom-shot' list after all. I knew about the parts breakage lowering the value, but didn't realise it was a less common variety.

Think I'll try to get one of those chromed Frankenlugers to shoot..

Frank · 01-16-2003, 09:35 AM

Todd, there are several experts for the Chrome Frankenluger on this Forum. Hugh, Edward, Pete just to name a few. Be sure to get those mother of pearl grips. They seem to make it shoot a lot better. If you can't hit anything with it, maybe the glare from the chrome plating will scare the attacker away!! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="wink.gif" />

Silvereagle29 · 01-29-2003, 02:44 AM

Actually one of the comments is nearly correct as far as acceptance marks are concerned. Most of the 41-byf Lugers were marked with a SE-655 SE-655 acceptance during the n through z production. During the no suffix block the SE-135 inspector came upon the scene. Consequently, the transition fron the SE-655 inspector to the SE-135 acceptance started with the SE-655 and SE-135 acceptance (rare gun). By the end of the no suffix block all 41-byf pistol had the SE-135 SE-135 acceptance marks. At least that is what I have been told. These pistols had 122 code magazines until the end of the - p - block. By June of 1941 any combination of fxo magazine ands walnut/plastic grips was the order of the day. the 41-byf pistol production came to an end in the - b - block of the 42-byf production. Somebody told me that 1000b was the highest know 41-byf.
H

Pelorat · 01-29-2003, 09:11 AM

Neat, thanks for the info, Silvereagle.

So, the serials with suffixes are older than the ones without? Seems backwards to me, but there it is =)

01-15-2003, 11:26 PM	#1
Pelorat User Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: North Charleston, SC Posts: 31 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	New member w/ byf 41 Hallo all! I'm relatively new to all this, but here's what I have: Serial: 9617, no suffix, all matching ## Toggle: byf Chamber: 41 Toggle Knob: Squared/Knurled (rough & checkered, I'm assuming that's the same thing) Grip Safety: Not present Stock lug: Present Caliber: 9mm Grip type: Walnut, checkered, no border, no insignia, no markings on inner surface Thumb Safety: Safe rear, smooth, 'Gesichert' Markings: #47 on the list (eagle/135, stick eagle/135 (almost worn off), eagle/swastika) right side chamber, eagle/swastika on barrel, 8.83 under barrel Barrel length: ~4" (no ruler handy) Extractor markings: 'Geladen', faint eagle/circle near toggle joint Sights: fixed (milled?) rear, adjustable front.. uh.. (\ with ridges (no idea how to describe that, as I know there are several different types) Magazine: 1, extruded, bakelite base, fxo, eagle/37, no serial Condition: worn bluing (maybe 80-85, guesstimate), regular pitting on right side, scratches on left side, some chipping of blue - looks like it was dropped at least twice. Bore: shiny, clean, light pitting around breech. The holster is an original P38, beat to crap with various Nazi markings (it's put up, no access to it right now) I paid $700 for it. From what I can tell it's a real 'bring-back', but with no papers or ID or anything else. It shoots very nicely - had some issues with ejection failures and toggle hold-back till I cleaned out the hold-open latch and stopped limp-wristing it. Basic question is - should I keep on shooting it regularly (I did get replacement grips) or drop it in a safe? And can anyone fill in the year of make or any other nifty info like that? And if I got taken for a 'benjamin ride' on the price, break it to me gently, willya? =)

01-15-2003, 11:58 PM	#2
ToggleTop User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: TN Posts: 297 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Hello Pelorat, I believe the 41-byf's with the E/135 receiver proofing are somewhat scarce, as most were proofed E/655. Take care of it and for $700, no you did not get hurt. Wish I owned it! Pictures would be nice. Oh, it was made in 1941, that is what the 41 over the chamber indicates. __________________ *********************** ToggleTop************* JustHappenToLoveLugers *************************

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01-16-2003, 12:25 AM	#3
Frank RIP Patron LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Hot & Dry PHX, AZ Posts: 2,078 Thanks: 24 Thanked 165 Times in 87 Posts	Hello Todd and welcome. Toggletop gave you a short and sweet version. There are three varieties of the byf 41 with respect to the acceptance marks. The most common has two E/655 marks, then two E/135 marks and finally a mixed bag E/655 and E/135. Some have estimated that there are about 4000 byf 41 Lugers that are not of the two E/655 variety. So you can judge the rariety yourself. It is a very desirable Luger to own. Your pistol was very likely made in January of 1942 with a left over 1941 receiver. As far as price goes, you did just fine. As far as shooting it, you will run the risk of breaking a numbered piece and then the value will drop to a shooter grade and you could lose some bucks. It is your Luger, so the choice is up to you.

01-16-2003, 07:33 AM	#4
Pelorat User Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: North Charleston, SC Posts: 31 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Cool, thanks a lot, guys! I think it might end up on my 'seldom-shot' list after all. I knew about the parts breakage lowering the value, but didn't realise it was a less common variety. Think I'll try to get one of those chromed Frankenlugers to shoot..

01-16-2003, 09:35 AM	#5
Frank RIP Patron LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Hot & Dry PHX, AZ Posts: 2,078 Thanks: 24 Thanked 165 Times in 87 Posts	Todd, there are several experts for the Chrome Frankenluger on this Forum. Hugh, Edward, Pete just to name a few. Be sure to get those mother of pearl grips. They seem to make it shoot a lot better. If you can't hit anything with it, maybe the glare from the chrome plating will scare the attacker away!! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="wink.gif" />

01-29-2003, 02:44 AM	#6
Silvereagle29 User Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Washington State Posts: 105 Thanks: 0 Thanked 4 Times in 4 Posts	Actually one of the comments is nearly correct as far as acceptance marks are concerned. Most of the 41-byf Lugers were marked with a SE-655 SE-655 acceptance during the n through z production. During the no suffix block the SE-135 inspector came upon the scene. Consequently, the transition fron the SE-655 inspector to the SE-135 acceptance started with the SE-655 and SE-135 acceptance (rare gun). By the end of the no suffix block all 41-byf pistol had the SE-135 SE-135 acceptance marks. At least that is what I have been told. These pistols had 122 code magazines until the end of the - p - block. By June of 1941 any combination of fxo magazine ands walnut/plastic grips was the order of the day. the 41-byf pistol production came to an end in the - b - block of the 42-byf production. Somebody told me that 1000b was the highest know 41-byf. H

01-29-2003, 09:11 AM	#7
Pelorat User Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: North Charleston, SC Posts: 31 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Neat, thanks for the info, Silvereagle. So, the serials with suffixes are older than the ones without? Seems backwards to me, but there it is =)