How were they made?

[David Jackson]

I do not know how the Lugers, Parabellums, P08s and other were made.

Would someone knowledgeable care to explain?

Thanks in advance.

David J.

Many of the parts were forged, and then machined by various methods in jigs and other tooling specially made just for repeatedly doing one operation.


For example, the barrels were forged, turned on a lathe, and bored... The front sight band was made by a broaching operation, similar to pushing cookie mix thru a form, or to drawing a shaped file over the metal. The threads were cut,as was the chambering and extractor cut and the front sight dovetail. The front of the barrel was turned to a smooth radius. Somewhere in here the barrel would be heat treated and tempered. Then the piece would be gaged as to its fit and so forth and proofed or rejected. (the order of the process was probably different that what I have offered here, but the basic steps would be similar)


Tooling of that period was basic, but not primitive. Along with milling machines, drills, and broaches, a common tool was the shaper. The shaper was used extensively in making the small slots that we find throughout the Luger and until the late 1800's was the only machine tool capable of producing a true flat plane surface and is basically a reciprocating ram that carried a cutting tool, back and forth over or through a work piece.


I believe someone wrote that there were over 700 machining operations per finished Luger.


Others can undoubtly add to (and correct) this brief attempt, but i hope it helps some...FGR

[ViggoG]

A slight correction FGR , Most of the machining was done on special designed and constructed machines that performed a series of machining operations on a single setup .

By the use of this type of machining process they were able to maintain a closer relationship of the numerous surfaces on the individual parts of the firearm.which resulted in the fine Weapon that we now admire !


These Machines were moved and changed hands several times during the production life of the Luger and when these machines were finally worn out and retired the mass manufacture of these fine weapons effectively ended .


Production of the modern "Luger" is done on much different machines at a much less quanity and using many short cut methods that have brought about much controversy which you can trace back by searching the key words "stainless steel , ss steel , ss stl , ect .


Have fun !!!


ViggoG

[G.T.]

Hi Viggo! I am more incline to think that they (Luger parts) were made on dedicated standard machine tools with multi position fixtures....if they would have had multiaxis capability, the number of operations would have been cut dramitically, also steel technology then, was primitive by todays standards. The carbides and ceramics of today allow longer runs and multioperations. The Germans were masters at tool making and precision work, and I think units like the Luger gave them lots of practice, especially sharpening tools! The Luger is a beautiful pistol, but it is one of the worst examples in the world of efficient mass production! Plus the accuracy of holes slots and reliefs, points to stationary fixtures rather then movement or axis change....I think it may have been 700 machine operations, followed by as many hand operations...or more! till.....later.....G.T.

[ViggoG]

Hi GT ;


Sorry if I gave the impression that these specialized machine tools even approached the freedom of multi axis capability . Such was never intended . That would have put the Germans 60 yrs ahead of the world .


However they did have combination drilling , boring , broaching , and milling machines with preset contouring capabilities , with indexing fixtures , and multi spindle lathes with rifle broaches , chamber reaming capability , and various applications of these capabilities were combined in machines that approached our own pre WW-II capabilities and may have been superior to our own in many ways .


There is reason that Henry Ford may have taken some of his Inovations in mass production from the Germans .


It is certainly known that prior to WW-II the German Messerschmidt Fighter was Far Superior to our best aircraft , In having an unheard of interchangability of parts and at the National Air Races over here they demonstrated the ability to land the aircraft , change the engine and return to flight in less than Six Minutes . his capability we never wqere able to equal . Much to my own disapointment .


ViggoG

We tend to forget that the Luger production continued for more than 40 years. During that time, it went from an unproven design to one of the most common firearms of its era. During the same period, machinery design and tooling improved greatly, driven by two wars and an ever changing labor market.


It is unrealistic to think that the original tooling and machines were in continuous use during the entire production run. The First Lugers were most probably made with movable jigs and fixtures on machines driven by leather belts. After all, no company would commit the funds necessary to make dedicated machinery for an unproven and evolving design, and labor costs were cheap. And as GT noted, the Germans were masters at producing precision tooling. Undoubtedly, improvements in equipment, and increased orders, were translated into improved production techniques and a greater use of dedicated machines...


Regardless, The luger remains as artistry in metal and one of the most precise mass-produced firearms ever made.

[G.T.]

Hi ViggoG, Your examples are good!I would have to agree that their machines were probably more sophisticated then I give them credit for....especially in the area of aircraft production...it is incredable how complex an eighteen cylinder radial, or a V 12 aircraft engine is from that era! Neat stuff.....till...later...G.T.

[David Jackson]

I guess the next question involves the frame. Was it a forging which got finished or was it whittled out of a solid block of metal?

Kind of interesting that I can't find more info in any of my Luger books; or perhaps I don't know where to look.

[ViggoG]

[ViggoG]

I'm sorry to report ;

Patrick is tied up in other matters which he cannot leave and HÃ?Â¥kan reports that information on machines and tooling related to Luger production are so scarce that he cannot remember ever seeing any photos along this line , However he said that he will contact the most knowledgable expert on Lugers in The European area to see what is known on this line .


Till then ,


ViggoG