WWII Grenades

MarkC · 01-08-2003, 07:46 PM

Guys,

I had trouble uploading these photo's so I just put in a link. My knowledge of WaA markings is lacking on German stuff but I found this metal box at a gun show. The dealer was selling the grenades out of the box and he accepted my offer for the box and remaining grenades. (Grenades are not live)

The acceptance stamp is WaA85 and the writing says:

30 El-handgranaten39

Heeresmunition
Gesamtgewicht 18.7

Any thoughts?

http://www.p38guns.com/Grenade.htm

Thanks!

Mark

Roadkill · 01-08-2003, 08:54 PM

Here's a couple of references on the grenades:
(great buy)

The most famous german hand grenade is probably the Stielhandgranate 24 ("stick hand grenade"), often referred to as the stick grenade or the potato masher by allied soldiers. The grenade's time fuse was activated by unscrewing the bottom and pulling the AbreisszÃ?Â¼nder ("rip detonator") safety cord. It weighed 480g, had an overall length of 35.6cm and had a warhead with a length of 7.5 cm and a diameter of 6cm that contained 165g of explosives (different explosives were used over the course of the war).
The German grenades in service during World War II relied on blast rather than fragmentation for their effect. The two basic types were the Stielhandgranate (handle hand grenade) stick grenade - often called a potato masher and practically unchanged since World War I - and the smaller, round Eihandgranate (egg hand grenade).

The Stielhandgranate 24 (StiGr 24) consisted of a hollow wooden handle attached to a thin sheet-metal head that contained the high-explosive bursting charge. These grenades used friction ignition, a mechanism widely used in German grenades but rarely by other nations. A cord ran from the head through the hollow handle and out the bottom, where a porcelain bead kept it in place behind a metal cap. To use the grenade, a soldier had to unscrew the metal cap, pull on the bead, and throw. When pulled, the cord would draw a roughened steel pin through a sensitive chemical in the head that would then ignite and set off the detonator.

Because blast, or concussive, effect isnÃ¢??t as lethal over as big a range as shrapnel is, Germany kept moving to larger grenades. The StiGr 39 was essentially a heavier StiGr 24 with more explosive. After 1942, the StiGr 24 could have its anti-personnel effect enhanced by the manual addition of Splitterringe (shrapnel rings), a grooved fragmentation sleeve clipped over the head of the grenade, but these never saw much use.

While Allied fragmentation grenades were more deadly over a wider area, the German Stielhandgranate could be thrown farther, thanks to the leverage the handle provided.

A later variation, the StiGr 43, had the detonator relocated to the top of the grenade head. This not only simplified manufacture but also enabled the grenade to be thrown without the stick or used as mines or booby traps. For specialized demolition charges or anti-tank work, six StiGr 43 grenade heads could be secured round a seventh in a configuration known as a Geballte Ladung (clenched charge).

Specifications
Diameter
60 mm (2.36 in)

Length
356 mm (14.02 in)

Weight
480 g (1.06 lb)

Filling
TNT

Filling weight
165 g

Delay
4-5 sec

Can't find anything on the WaA85.

rk

Roadkill · 01-08-2003, 09:40 PM

Found these though.
Maybe the same:

Hugo Schneider A.G., Lampenfabrik, Leipzig O 5, Sachsen (wa) : (Gewehr-Sprenggranate : 1944)
(rifle grenades)

wa: Hasag, Hugo Schneider AG, Abteilung Lampenfabrik, Leipzig. Found on ammunition headstamps and cannon shell cases

rk

MarkC · 01-08-2003, 09:53 PM

Thanks RK,

I think this item is unique. What is the German language over the eagle? I think it is original because of the eagle with the (oak leaf?) cluster, it just looked right. The German grenades also had a metal collar that fit over the concusion grenade to make shrapnel? These grenades fit your description... wooden handle with a screw off top and a porcelain disk on a string.

I have more hope that this is a real item... the metal box is sand color and the grenades have an e/s on the top. Any more thoughts are appreciated.

Mark

Edward Tinker · 01-08-2003, 10:10 PM

Pretty cool Mark.

If you place a picture on the server at www.Lugerforum.com , it is sometimes easier doing it like that rather than the htm, but if we can see it, then you've done a good job!

JuergenG · 01-09-2003, 04:05 AM

Mark,
translations from the photos are:
1 (Grenade Head) "Vor Gebrauch Sprengkapsel einsetzen" = "Insert detonator capsule befor use"

3 (Stamp) "unreadable...stelle" = "....Department"
"Feldpostnummer" = Field Post Office & number

4 "Heeresmunition" = "Army Ammunition"

I can't find WaA 85.
The Text "30 Ei-Handgranaten" seems to belong to a different granade packaging as it means "pineapple style (egg-)hand granades".
"Gesamtgewicht" stands for "total gross weight".
Juergen

01-08-2003, 07:46 PM	#1
MarkC User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Boston, MA Posts: 482 Thanks: 1 Thanked 126 Times in 29 Posts	WWII Grenades Guys, I had trouble uploading these photo's so I just put in a link. My knowledge of WaA markings is lacking on German stuff but I found this metal box at a gun show. The dealer was selling the grenades out of the box and he accepted my offer for the box and remaining grenades. (Grenades are not live) The acceptance stamp is WaA85 and the writing says: 30 El-handgranaten39 Heeresmunition Gesamtgewicht 18.7 Any thoughts? http://www.p38guns.com/Grenade.htm Thanks! Mark

01-08-2003, 10:10 PM	#5
Edward Tinker Super Moderator Eternal Lifer LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: North of Spokane, WA Posts: 15,966 Thanks: 2,066 Thanked 4,595 Times in 2,116 Posts	Pretty cool Mark. If you place a picture on the server at www.Lugerforum.com , it is sometimes easier doing it like that rather than the htm, but if we can see it, then you've done a good job! __________________ Edward Tinker ************ Co-Author of Police Lugers - Co-Author of Simson Lugers Author of Veteran Bring Backs Vol I, Vol II, Vol III and Vol IV

01-08-2003, 08:54 PM	#2
Roadkill User Join Date: Jun 2002 Posts: 1,634 Thanks: 1 Thanked 28 Times in 17 Posts	Here's a couple of references on the grenades: (great buy) The most famous german hand grenade is probably the Stielhandgranate 24 ("stick hand grenade"), often referred to as the stick grenade or the potato masher by allied soldiers. The grenade's time fuse was activated by unscrewing the bottom and pulling the AbreisszÃ?Â¼nder ("rip detonator") safety cord. It weighed 480g, had an overall length of 35.6cm and had a warhead with a length of 7.5 cm and a diameter of 6cm that contained 165g of explosives (different explosives were used over the course of the war). The German grenades in service during World War II relied on blast rather than fragmentation for their effect. The two basic types were the Stielhandgranate (handle hand grenade) stick grenade - often called a potato masher and practically unchanged since World War I - and the smaller, round Eihandgranate (egg hand grenade). The Stielhandgranate 24 (StiGr 24) consisted of a hollow wooden handle attached to a thin sheet-metal head that contained the high-explosive bursting charge. These grenades used friction ignition, a mechanism widely used in German grenades but rarely by other nations. A cord ran from the head through the hollow handle and out the bottom, where a porcelain bead kept it in place behind a metal cap. To use the grenade, a soldier had to unscrew the metal cap, pull on the bead, and throw. When pulled, the cord would draw a roughened steel pin through a sensitive chemical in the head that would then ignite and set off the detonator. Because blast, or concussive, effect isnÃ¢??t as lethal over as big a range as shrapnel is, Germany kept moving to larger grenades. The StiGr 39 was essentially a heavier StiGr 24 with more explosive. After 1942, the StiGr 24 could have its anti-personnel effect enhanced by the manual addition of Splitterringe (shrapnel rings), a grooved fragmentation sleeve clipped over the head of the grenade, but these never saw much use. While Allied fragmentation grenades were more deadly over a wider area, the German Stielhandgranate could be thrown farther, thanks to the leverage the handle provided. A later variation, the StiGr 43, had the detonator relocated to the top of the grenade head. This not only simplified manufacture but also enabled the grenade to be thrown without the stick or used as mines or booby traps. For specialized demolition charges or anti-tank work, six StiGr 43 grenade heads could be secured round a seventh in a configuration known as a Geballte Ladung (clenched charge). Specifications Diameter 60 mm (2.36 in) Length 356 mm (14.02 in) Weight 480 g (1.06 lb) Filling TNT Filling weight 165 g Delay 4-5 sec Can't find anything on the WaA85. rk

01-08-2003, 09:40 PM	#3
Roadkill User Join Date: Jun 2002 Posts: 1,634 Thanks: 1 Thanked 28 Times in 17 Posts	Found these though. Maybe the same: Hugo Schneider A.G., Lampenfabrik, Leipzig O 5, Sachsen (wa) : (Gewehr-Sprenggranate : 1944) (rifle grenades) wa: Hasag, Hugo Schneider AG, Abteilung Lampenfabrik, Leipzig. Found on ammunition headstamps and cannon shell cases rk

01-08-2003, 09:53 PM	#4
MarkC User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Boston, MA Posts: 482 Thanks: 1 Thanked 126 Times in 29 Posts	Thanks RK, I think this item is unique. What is the German language over the eagle? I think it is original because of the eagle with the (oak leaf?) cluster, it just looked right. The German grenades also had a metal collar that fit over the concusion grenade to make shrapnel? These grenades fit your description... wooden handle with a screw off top and a porcelain disk on a string. I have more hope that this is a real item... the metal box is sand color and the grenades have an e/s on the top. Any more thoughts are appreciated. Mark

01-09-2003, 04:05 AM	#6
JuergenG User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Germany Posts: 155 Thanks: 3 Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post	Mark, translations from the photos are: 1 (Grenade Head) "Vor Gebrauch Sprengkapsel einsetzen" = "Insert detonator capsule befor use" 3 (Stamp) "unreadable...stelle" = "....Department" "Feldpostnummer" = Field Post Office & number 4 "Heeresmunition" = "Army Ammunition" I can't find WaA 85. The Text "30 Ei-Handgranaten" seems to belong to a different granade packaging as it means "pineapple style (egg-)hand granades". "Gesamtgewicht" stands for "total gross weight". Juergen