how to spot a fake luger tool

welder6131 · 03-10-2005, 07:44 AM

I just recently purchased an Imperial loading tool and upon inspecting the marking on the tool is doesn't quite match up to the one on my luger. The "D" appears to be correct, but the crown doesn't have the same exact features as far as lines going through the crown compared to the one on my luger. Rather than that eveything looks to be correct... ie the finish (slightly pitted with 30%? finish) and quality. Fakes are becoming so common its hard to tell real from fake.

I know pictures always help, but I couldn't get good quality pics that would be of any service to your opinions. Your input is appriciated....thanks!

Semper-Fi
Josh

Luke · 03-10-2005, 08:35 AM

Josh-

I have also been looking for a couple of Imperial loading tools, but I am very much afraid of those offered on eBay. Some of them look exactly like the repros I bought from Sarco . . . . excellent tools, but not authentic Imperial era.

If you have a flatbed scanner you can create very good digital images of loading tools. Scan at 800 - 1200dpi and size to suit after you have the image stored.
The image below was created on my Epson scanner at 1200dpi and sized for the forum afterwards. The titles were added by using Adobe Photoshop.

Luke

Edward Tinker · 03-10-2005, 01:06 PM

Josh, keep in mind that dies for stamps would not be exactly the same either. As dies got worn out, got broken etc., they would look different, plus I do not believe all tools were made by DWM and Erfurt, maybe accepted by them, but I don't believe made just by them...

Ed

welder6131 · 03-10-2005, 04:35 PM

Hmmmm...that's a good point Ed. That kind of re-assures me about the tool I purchased. Thanks for the good tips!

Luke I'm a little behind the times I don't have a scanner, but I'm probably going to have to get one eventually...thanks for the good info also!

Josh

pisto · 03-11-2005, 08:49 AM

Welder,
a picture would be nice, I have bought recently a loading tool Bing/NÃ?Â¼rnberg, I hope now that this one is correct!?

grapppa · 03-23-2005, 07:50 PM

I measured by 2 loading tools one likely authentic, one I had no idea. The authentic is from a 1916 rig I bought; Erfurt proofed measured 2.59 mm. The questionable one measured 2.28mm. Both have the same characteristics of yours visually and dimensionally. Can we assume that repros are thinner than authentics?

Luke · 03-23-2005, 08:55 PM

Hello grapppa -

I wish I could answer your question. Unfortunately, except for the dimensional specifications provided in the Luger blueprints which John Sabato is offering, I have not seen any other quantitative criteria for determining authenticity.

The blueprint from John Sabato indicates that the thickness was specified as 2.5mm with no tolerance provided.

Luke

03-10-2005, 07:44 AM	#1
welder6131 User Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: apg, Maryland Posts: 13 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	how to spot a fake luger tool I just recently purchased an Imperial loading tool and upon inspecting the marking on the tool is doesn't quite match up to the one on my luger. The "D" appears to be correct, but the crown doesn't have the same exact features as far as lines going through the crown compared to the one on my luger. Rather than that eveything looks to be correct... ie the finish (slightly pitted with 30%? finish) and quality. Fakes are becoming so common its hard to tell real from fake. I know pictures always help, but I couldn't get good quality pics that would be of any service to your opinions. Your input is appriciated....thanks! Semper-Fi Josh __________________ "We've been looking for the enemy for several days now.....were surrounded! This simplifies the problem of getting to these people and killing them!" Quote Lewis B. Puller (Chesty Puller USMC)

03-10-2005, 08:35 AM	#2
Luke User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: NC - USA Posts: 1,239 Thanks: 0 Thanked 19 Times in 7 Posts	Josh- I have also been looking for a couple of Imperial loading tools, but I am very much afraid of those offered on eBay. Some of them look exactly like the repros I bought from Sarco . . . . excellent tools, but not authentic Imperial era. If you have a flatbed scanner you can create very good digital images of loading tools. Scan at 800 - 1200dpi and size to suit after you have the image stored. The image below was created on my Epson scanner at 1200dpi and sized for the forum afterwards. The titles were added by using Adobe Photoshop. Luke __________________ "Peace, if possible; truth, at any cost." . . . Martin Luther

03-10-2005, 04:35 PM	#4
welder6131 User Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: apg, Maryland Posts: 13 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Hmmmm...that's a good point Ed. That kind of re-assures me about the tool I purchased. Thanks for the good tips! Luke I'm a little behind the times I don't have a scanner, but I'm probably going to have to get one eventually...thanks for the good info also! Josh __________________ "We've been looking for the enemy for several days now.....were surrounded! This simplifies the problem of getting to these people and killing them!" Quote Lewis B. Puller (Chesty Puller USMC)

03-23-2005, 08:55 PM	#7
Luke User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: NC - USA Posts: 1,239 Thanks: 0 Thanked 19 Times in 7 Posts	Hello grapppa - I wish I could answer your question. Unfortunately, except for the dimensional specifications provided in the Luger blueprints which John Sabato is offering, I have not seen any other quantitative criteria for determining authenticity. The blueprint from John Sabato indicates that the thickness was specified as 2.5mm with no tolerance provided. Luke __________________ "Peace, if possible; truth, at any cost." . . . Martin Luther

03-10-2005, 01:06 PM	#3
Edward Tinker Super Moderator Eternal Lifer LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: North of Spokane, WA Posts: 15,962 Thanks: 2,063 Thanked 4,592 Times in 2,114 Posts	Josh, keep in mind that dies for stamps would not be exactly the same either. As dies got worn out, got broken etc., they would look different, plus I do not believe all tools were made by DWM and Erfurt, maybe accepted by them, but I don't believe made just by them... Ed

03-11-2005, 08:49 AM	#5
pisto User Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Germany Posts: 228 Thanks: 1 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Welder, a picture would be nice, I have bought recently a loading tool Bing/NÃ?Â¼rnberg, I hope now that this one is correct!?

03-23-2005, 07:50 PM	#6
grapppa User Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Hillsborough, NJ Posts: 150 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	I measured by 2 loading tools one likely authentic, one I had no idea. The authentic is from a 1916 rig I bought; Erfurt proofed measured 2.59 mm. The questionable one measured 2.28mm. Both have the same characteristics of yours visually and dimensionally. Can we assume that repros are thinner than authentics?