Detail Questions for the Experts

I notice there is a fat trigger and a slim trigger. The slim one seems to be used on Erfurt Lugers and on DWM 1908 Lugers and earlier. 1914 DWM Lugers and later, and Mauser Lugers seem to use the fat trigger. Is that correct so far and is there anything else to be known about triggers, such as the reason for the change?


I notice that firing pins are both fluted and unfluted, and I would guess the unfluted to be the earlier design. I suppose the grooves are to relieve gas pressure. When was this design change made?


I have Lugers at Random, Luger Tips, and Luger Handbook but none mention triggers or firing pins. I should probably get Sills' books but I just got those other three and my Luger book budget is used up for a while.

[Herb]

In Harry Jone's book, Luger Variations, pages 23 and 24 he describes the 'fat' trigger guard as being used on the 'old style luger' and the narrow trigger guard being used on the 'new' model. From that I would suppose that in 1908 when the 'new' model was introduced is the year that this change took place. Still looking for firing pin info.

[John Sabato]

There are four Luger e-books that cost only $5.95 each that you download and read on your computer... Certainly not budget busters and well worth the money and definitely enjoyable reading...Great illustrations...


-regards,


John

[Herb]

Correction to my last reply, the 'new' model Luger was intorduced in 1906 NOT in 1908 which is the year the military officially adoped the design, resulting in the P-08 designation.

[tracyp]

According to Harry Jone's book, Luger Variations the grooves in the firing pin were added in the 1930's. It was done to prevent the firing pin from getting clogged up, which would stop it from firing.

[Herb]

tracyp, good find, I missed that. I wish I could remember all that I have read, good thing I kept the books, just wish I could find them all, LOL

I can not state this as fact but I do believe it is accurate and has been discussed on this forum perhaps two years ago. The firing pins started being machined with the flutes in about the mid-1920's (this could have been between about 1925 and 1929)don't know exact year but I believe it was before the 1930's.

I do know that many Lugers (esp.Police reworks) were retrofitted during this period (1925-early 30's) by having their original FP machined with the flutes....some also may have had new grooved FP interchanged and re-numbered...but I have seen many (maybe 10) with the original WWI FP's that were grooved us an up-grade.


The main reason I have understood for the flutes is to bleed gas from a punctured primer that would blow back thru the breech block FP hole and slam the FP hard into the FP retainer...often breaking the rear of the breech block. The flutes would channel this gas off and not allow the FP to function as a piston on the retainer.


I would suppose that faster lock time and less chance of "crud" cushining the fall would be added benifits.

Thanks for all the the replies and info.


I guess I did not make myself clear about the fat and slim triggers. I am not referring to the width of the trigger or trigger guard, but to the area and shape of the side of the trigger. I am looking at two Luger triggers. One came from a 1940 42 Mauser and is an original part - it is fat. The other came from a 1914 Erfurt but is mismatched and I think is DWM - it is slim. There is an easily noticeable difference in the front to back dimension of the side of the triggers, especially near the bottom. Photos often do not show the trigger clearly because of the lighting but the slim one seems to show up in photos on DWM Lugers prior to the 1914 model and on Erfurt Lugers including the 1914 model. This was what I was asking about.

Bill, There may in fact be minor dimentional differences in the triggers between the different manufacturers, but if you mic them, I doubt that they would be more than a few thousanths. The only triggers that I know of that are much thinner, are on the M1900 luger. Tom h.