WTK Info on the Walther Olympia

[minigun]

Hello,
Picked this one up this weekend at a gunshow and was wondering if anyone here has knowledge of it. I'd say the gun is around 98-99% (darn near new looking). It came with one mag, no box. My questions are:

What are they usually trading for?

What year was this made? It has the "crown N" stamps, so I'd say before WWII, but what year? I've been told 1926 and 1936....

Is the mag number supposed to match the gun's number? Mine does not, but has a three digit number to it.

Thanks in advance

[waltherguy]

Fantastic Gun.. My guess is early 30's... I'll dig out some walther books tonight to find out some more info for ya... Congrats on a great pistol!

[Imperial Arms]

Hello Minigun,

Some Walther collectors name this Olympia pistol the M1925 or M1934. I also have one in my collection, and the value is about $2,000 with a matching magazine. The wood base magazine is suppose to have the same serial number as the pistol. Your pistol is in excellent condition.

I prefer to collect the M1936 Olympia which was available with different types of frame weights and 'butterfly' weights. You can preview some of these M1936 pistols on my web site www.imperial-arms.com.

Well done,
Albert

[waltherguy]

What Albert Said... All these Olympia's.. wowsers.. Albert wasn't the M1936 designed specifically for the Berlin Olympics?

[minigun]

Whoa! Thanks for the help and nice pics. How do I tell which one this particular gun is, M1925 or M1934?

I had a feeling that the mag had to match the gun. With a mis-match mag, what is the value? My mag does not have a wood base, it's a "permanant fixed metal base".

Imperial Arms-Do you actually own a Mauser Hsv 9mm? I've never seen one. Thanks

[Imperial Arms]

Sorry Minigun, I made a mistake regarding the magazine - it has a thin metal bottom and it is suppose to have a serial number. Sometime we collectors have a blackout! I reckon that the value of your M1925 pistol with a mismatched magazine is about $1,200-$1,400.

I have seen your type of Olympia pistol advertised in catalogs before 1934, and it was also used by the German team in the 1932 Olympic Games held in LA, therefore, I guess the correct model would be a M1925.

The M1936 Olympia rapid-fire pistol which first appeared in the 1936 Berlin Olympic games had round barrels, and sometime around mid to late 1937 the Walther firm introduced the Sport and Funfkampf model having a 'butterfly' frame weight and barrel weight. This model was marketed until about 1941, and I assume production was stopped shortly after the start of WWII. The Olympia 'Jaeger' model with a short barrel was marketed by Walther as the "firearm of choice for hunters". It is to long to explain how the Olympia Jaeger received its name, but Warren Buxton in his upcoming book on the subject of Olympia target pistols and the Model 1-9 pistols will give an excellent explanation to the readers. I am contributing plenty of information and images to his book regarding the Olympia pistols. I hope that this his book will generate new interest for collectors who wish to gain knowledge on the very popular sport of target shooting in Germany and Europe during the 1930's. If you take a look at past German culture, you will observe that target/sport shooting was a very professional and social sport in Germany. Why only collect pistols of war? What about those prestigious sport pistols such as the Walther Olympia pistols or the Anschutz M210 Free Pistol - those were the the cream of the crop of German sporting firearms having the highest level of workmanship and craftmanship - a piece of art with elegance and style.

In fact, the Olympia 'Jaeger' model is probably more desirable than the Sport models even though their value is still slightly less. An ordinary hunter could not afford a 'Jaeger' model because it was expensive - it was a pistol for the aristocratic hunters.

Minigun, I do not own a Mauser HSv in caliber 9 mm because they are extremely rare and very expensive. I have only examined three HSv test pistols in my hand, and an HSv pistol in very fine condition would probably fetch $40k-$45k. Quite shocking when a commercial HSc is worth about $600-$1,200!!

Happy hunting,
Albert

[Imperial Arms]

Hello Tacfoley,

What a shameful story that it ended up being destroyed. You should have tried to offer it on a forum, and I would have probably bought it from you. It is very rare to find an M1936 Olympia in its original case/box in near mint condition. After a long wait, I was able to acquire last month a M1936 Olympia Funfkampf pistol from Sweden (with its original M. Widforss receipt) which is probably the only complete set known to exist as of this time - I specialize in the M1936 Olympia, and that is the only complete matching set which I know. Does it make mine more valuable - I would say about double!!

Like most everything else, I reckon that the Olympia pistols will start to appreciate quickly as a few factors 'kick in'. It was a famous target (and hunters) pistol of the highest quality, and I hope that more collectors will develop an interest in this pistol.

Bulls-eye,
Albert

[waltherguy]

Wow just incredible Albert.. I knew very little about these amazing guns.. thanks for sharing the info!

[pipeman45]

Tac. I know from your words here that you love your country and have served her with honor. That you would never do anything to disrespect her.
BUT. If I were you. I would have a list of her public officials that I would love to take a wizz on!!!
All for the public good.

[minigun]

Tac, that is just an awful story. Man I feel for you and your countrymen. I mean I just have no words at all to express on your Country's gun situation. Just thinking about all that just makes me want to vomit.

Imperial Arms-Thanks for the info. That helped 100% more than I used to know about these (which was almost nothing). I bought it because I collect German/Swiss guns and this is something I just didn't have, so I grabbed her. I really didn't even care if I was paying a little too much or not, I just wanted to get the collection going in another direction besides the military end. I hear Buxton is really collecting these as I hear he thinks these will be the next thing to skyrocket in value. What will kick these into that kind of upward dollar movement? They are neat and all, but what will be the driving force? Supply and demand or something else....

So the pistol I have is an M1925 then? What was it used for in the sporting world-only target shooting or was it in the Olympic games at one point? The pic that was provided, what is the little "key" in the box?

-Kelly

[Imperial Arms]

Hello Kelly,

I shall try to answer your question as to what factor(s) may 'kick' the value of Walther Olympia pistols towards an upward direction. Do not misunderstand me when I explain this point, but in the US, most collectors are attracted by the visual characteristics/features of a pistol and not necessarily other factors such as the history and culture of the country where they were made. For example, what causes a PPK Political Leader pistol to fetch ten times the price as compared to a commercial PPK pistol? - simple answer - the NSDAP Swastika Eagle on the grips! How many collectors stretch their knowledge to include knowledge regarding the operations and regulations of the NSDAP?

The Olympia pistol does not contain a symbol or feature which will cause the same reaction/impulse with collectors, however, there could be other indirect forces which will drive up the price of these elegant pistols. In my prediction, when Warren Buxton publishes his next book, it will not only depict the different models/variations of the Olympia pistols, but it will also explain how and where they were used in national and international sporting events (as well as with hunters and forest wardens who used the Jaeger model) which made these pistols famous. Unfortunately, this fame was never really exposed in our generation, and when these cultural activities and events are highlighted in Buxton's book, it will probably boost dramatically the value of these pistols. When collecting pre-war German firearms, it is also important to have a perception and understanding of the 'Old Germany' during the second and third reich, and the social and national 'environments' in where these pistols used. Believe it or not, I am a German national, and I still have plenty to learn about the history of my country! The Allies beat the Germans during the war, but they did not beat the spirt of Germany (nor their guns)!

Not only am I fascinated by the looks of the Olympia pistol, but I am also interested by the 'environment' and sporting events in where it was used. It was an impressive view to see the classy meetings of sport shooters and hunters in their stylish jackets and hats with plums. Do we see this today? Sadly, no - it has changed to jeans, T-shirts and caps - This tradition has nearly disappeared and it can only be experienced by the rich. Maybe 'when the clock is turned back' with the release of a comprehensive book providing more information, it will be a driving force in the demand and value of these pistols. Without research and knowledge, nothing is gained.

I hope my general explain answers some of your questions.

Cheers,
Albert

NB: Your M1925 Olympia was mainly a target shooting pistol, and it was used in the 1932 Olympic Games. The key is a weight key to loosen and tighten the bolts of the barrel weight and 'butterfly' weight.

[myky]

I too just bought a cased one from an estate last week. I was reasearching mine and I believe yours to be a 1932 model, by what Rankin has in his book. I tried to post a pic of mine but it was to large for the format. My question was, is my case original, as I've never seen a case. My gun is 99% + and has the capture papers to go with it. It can bee seen on my web site www.relicsofthereichs.com. Can somebody who has seen an original box take a look at mine ? I can be contacted at myky@ctesc.net. thanks guys..... !

[var99]

Mike,

Original boxes were cardboard like Albert's example. There were presentation cases, but they were of the leather covered, fitted , cloth lined interior variety, see RIA auction april 2004, lot # 3332.

Vince

[Imperial Arms]

Hello Mike,

The case for your M1936 Walther Sport Olympia pistol is a variation of a retailer/dealer case. Cases were offered in different styles such as German style, French style (normally pebble leather covered), and Finnish style (mainly made of wood). Olympia Sport pistols with original Walther cardboard boxes are rare, but I have encountered a larger quantity of the Jaeger model with original Walther boxes. The majority of these Jaeger models have come out from Sweden. Mauritz Widforsee was the main importer/dealer of Walther pistols in Sweden and many hunters and sport shooters admired the high quality and accuracy of Walther Olympia pistols.

Your pistol is in excellent condition and it is unfortunate that it does not have the barrel and 'butterfly' weight. The weights cost about $200 each if they can be found.

Cheers,
Albert

[myky]

Albert, thanks so much for your reply. I felt like it wasn't a Walther box, that's why I went to the Forum. But, I thought, it wasn't modern day made due to it's method of construction. Then,I presume, the four screw holes in the lid is where the retailer's name plate was ? Again, thanks for your input.
Mike

[Imperial Arms]

Hello Mike,

The wooden case with your Olympia pistol was probably made in the period 1938-1940. I suppose that the plate on the lid had the name of the owner and not necessarily the name of the dealer. With regards to Olympia pistols, the only dealer sticker I have noticed (in the inside of the lid) was from the Swiss dealer Glaser. Oddly, I have not noticed dealers stickers such as from Widforsee or A. F. Stoeger (who also sold the Olympia pistol in 1939, according to their company catalog).

It is my theory the Olympia pistol production stopped in 1939 or early 1940 at the beginning of WWII. Even though I have two Olympia pistols with original dealer receipts dated 1940 and 1941, these two pistols were probably produced in 1938 and delivered at later dates to the dealers.

I hope this information is helpful to you.

Cheers,
Albert

[myky]

Albert, again thanks ! I will copy this and it with the pistol for the next owner. Very informative !! Will you be in Lauzanne in Dec. ?

[var99]

HI Albert,

You mentioned that the pebble grained leather covered cases, were retailer cases, but I'm pretty sure I have seen period Walther literature listing these "Luxusetui" cases as options. In fact Walther Ulm brought them back in the 60's ( they are listed in the back of the PP & PPK manual as accessories) and they are nearly identical in design?

Vince

[Imperial Arms]

Hello Vince,

It is possible that you are correct regarding fitted 'Luxusetui' cases for an Olympia pistol with pebble grain leather cover as an option from the Walther firm, but I have not seen it listed in a piece of Walther literature. I have read the availability of extra magazines, and I would also need to check some of my period dealer catalogs. If you can be more specific where you read this information, I might be able to find it.

Thanks,
Albert

[var99]

HI Albert,

While I was in living in Germany back in the 80's, a collector I knew had a lot of Walther & Mauser ephemera, and it was in either a vintage brochure or in an ad, I can't recall exactly. I did notice that in the April 2004 Rock Island auction (lot 3332) the presentation Olympia given by Fritz Walther to his son, is in one of these cases. It would seem unlikly that he would give it to him in a retailer case since it would be right from the factory?

On a different point, you mentioned that you thought that Walther stopped making the Olympias in '39 or 40, but Kersten in the "Walther, a German legend" states that they ceased production in 1944. I have no additional info either way, was just curious why you thought so.

Finally, I have been wondering where Buxton is with his book, do you know when it will be published?

thanks

Vince