1908 comm

Fern · 01-15-2003, 10:50 AM

Hello everybody...
I am new at this so please excuse my ignorance.
I am trying to determine the value of my acquired Luger. It was sold to me by a reputable dealer (Martin B. Retting) in Culver city, CA in 1989 as a 1908 comm .30 luger. Serial # 81385 with "85" visible in rear, trigger plate and trigger.
Walnut checkered stock with lug; safety (gesichert) inscribed; crown over "N" on chamber; inside chamber a circled "N" ; toggle shows DWM logo; blueing 75/80%; barrel about 4"; I am not sure on how to look for "straw" but I do not see any patterns on trigger area...
This is all I can think of...
I will now attempt to upload some pictures.

Thank you .

Fern

http://boards.rennlist.com/lfupload/13.jpg

RockinWR · 01-15-2003, 11:21 PM

Fern,
* Strawed ejector too - assembled to the right side of the Receiver.
* Jan Still's 1993 Vol. V, Weimar & Early Nazi Lugers, book states s/n's in the 74,845-92,000 range, bearing the characteristics & markings of the Luger pictured above, were produced in 1919-1921 from new and, occasionally, surplused parts.
* This example, by s/n interpolation, would have been produced approximately the 3rd Qtr. of 1920 based on Jan's post 1989 information.
* IMO, the stock lug's presence and the high 5 digit commercial S/N precludes this example from being a "1908 Commercial" variation.
* Traditionally (inaccurately per Jan) known as the 1923 DWM Commercial. However, this is how most gun value books will list this example.
* Does this piece bear all matching S/N'd parts?? Commercial style S/N placement implies a hidden location for many. In addition to the 4 you've mentioned (Frame, trigger, side plate, & rear toggle), the barrel (5 digit-rear underside), takedown lever(last 2-underneath), breech block(last 2-left side/top), forward toggle(last 2-underneath the middle link of the 3 in the toggle train), extractor(last 2-underneath), & grips (last 2-inside both) normally are numbered. Unless broken at some time, the extractor is rarely changed. Value varies accordingly.
* Generally well made, sold to whomever had the $'s in the lean 20's, & finished better than the contemporary Police/Military models; although, not up to pre-WWI Commercials. Is yours marked "Germany"??
* While not recommending you shoot a collectable, I found my Dad's shooter in 7.65mm accurate & a pleasure to fire.
Respectfully,
WR

Fern · 01-16-2003, 09:50 AM

Dear RockinWR, Thanks for the info.
About the year, I found it in my original receipt...also, the "crown above N" is listed in this site's "Markings" as "German commercial proof. Found on some commercial Lugers of the 1906-1914 era. A few Lugers manufactured by Krieghoff have a similiar but small proof." (Proof 1; item #4).
You are right as also the barrel and take down lever show the last two digits; for the other parts, I will have to wait until I find enough confidence to go to the next level of disassembly.
I am glad that you mentioned about shooting it as I was reluctant to admit that I went trough a few boxes as I was captivated by the accuracy and the general pleasure that it gives to use such a wonderful piece of machinery.
I know that this is not recommended and I probably wont' do it again but it was great while it lasted...
Thank you for your prompt reply
Fern

Ron Wood · 01-16-2003, 10:48 AM

Fern,
It appears in your photos that the "crown above N" proof is actually Proof 3; Item #28 - "28. German "Nitro" commercial proof. Found on Lugers produced after 1920. Receiver proof is upright". This is consistent with the serial number range and RockinWR's identification.
Ron

Fern · 01-16-2003, 11:11 AM

Hi Ron....
I had not noticed this marking until you mentioned it...I am now thoroghlly confused!
Can you or anybody else help me determine what I have? (year, value, etc).
I am grateful for any feedback...
Fern

Ron Wood · 01-16-2003, 11:55 AM

You have a 1920 Commercial. From the photos it appears to be in nice condition, but without seeing the actual gun, it is difficult to determine a value. Its approximate value probably is in the $700 to $900 range.

Pete Ebbink · 01-16-2003, 12:34 PM

Hello Fern,

If you go to our entry site at www.lugerforum.com, you will see a menu selection for "Technical" information, in which there is a decent description to disassemble/re-assemble a luger.

Not sure when you shot those rounds through this pistol that you got in 1989, but a good cleaning after a day at the range is always a good idea.

If you need additional help, you might let us know, generally, where in California you live. We have several Luger Forum memebers that live in CA-state and you might find one person close by to help you in person if you need more help.

Regards,

Pete... <img border="0" alt="[typing]" title="" src="graemlins/yltype.gif" />

Fern · 01-16-2003, 02:57 PM

Thanks for your help Pete...
The last time I shot it was 5-6 years ago; I always made sure that I cleaned and oiled it after use...
I live near LAX in Los Angeles
Fern

Fern · 01-16-2003, 03:00 PM

Thanks Ron...
Fern

Lugerdoc · 01-17-2003, 09:47 AM

Fern, I believe that Harry Jones's family still have a shop open in the Alpine Village, just south of you off the Harbor Freeway. If his son is in, he can certainly give you plenty of info on your luger. Another couple of shops with knowlegable folks are Lorin Relin at Red Star Collectable and Martin Redding, just accross the street from each other in Studio City. Tom H.

Fern · 01-20-2003, 02:10 PM

Hello Lugerdoc...
Thanks for the info...
Martin Retting is the dealer where I purchased the pistol originally and identified it as a 1908!
Fern

01-15-2003, 10:50 AM	#1
Fern User Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: California Posts: 6 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	1908 comm Hello everybody... I am new at this so please excuse my ignorance. I am trying to determine the value of my acquired Luger. It was sold to me by a reputable dealer (Martin B. Retting) in Culver city, CA in 1989 as a 1908 comm .30 luger. Serial # 81385 with "85" visible in rear, trigger plate and trigger. Walnut checkered stock with lug; safety (gesichert) inscribed; crown over "N" on chamber; inside chamber a circled "N" ; toggle shows DWM logo; blueing 75/80%; barrel about 4"; I am not sure on how to look for "straw" but I do not see any patterns on trigger area... This is all I can think of... I will now attempt to upload some pictures. Thank you . Fern http://boards.rennlist.com/lfupload/13.jpg

01-16-2003, 11:55 AM	#6
Ron Wood Moderator 2010 LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Santa Teresa New Mexico just outside of the West Texas town of El Paso Posts: 6,988 Thanks: 1,067 Thanked 5,099 Times in 1,676 Posts	You have a 1920 Commercial. From the photos it appears to be in nice condition, but without seeing the actual gun, it is difficult to determine a value. Its approximate value probably is in the $700 to $900 range. __________________ If it's made after 1918...it's a reproduction

01-17-2003, 09:47 AM	#10
Lugerdoc Patron LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: POB 398 St.Charles,MO. 63302 Posts: 5,089 Thanks: 6 Thanked 736 Times in 483 Posts	Fern, I believe that Harry Jones's family still have a shop open in the Alpine Village, just south of you off the Harbor Freeway. If his son is in, he can certainly give you plenty of info on your luger. Another couple of shops with knowlegable folks are Lorin Relin at Red Star Collectable and Martin Redding, just accross the street from each other in Studio City. Tom H. __________________ Tom Heller POB 398 ST.Charles, MO. 63302 Tel 636-447-3006 lugerdoc@charter.net

01-15-2003, 11:21 PM	#2
RockinWR User Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: D/FW, Tx Posts: 279 Thanks: 109 Thanked 31 Times in 16 Posts	Fern, * Strawed ejector too - assembled to the right side of the Receiver. * Jan Still's 1993 Vol. V, Weimar & Early Nazi Lugers, book states s/n's in the 74,845-92,000 range, bearing the characteristics & markings of the Luger pictured above, were produced in 1919-1921 from new and, occasionally, surplused parts. * This example, by s/n interpolation, would have been produced approximately the 3rd Qtr. of 1920 based on Jan's post 1989 information. * IMO, the stock lug's presence and the high 5 digit commercial S/N precludes this example from being a "1908 Commercial" variation. * Traditionally (inaccurately per Jan) known as the 1923 DWM Commercial. However, this is how most gun value books will list this example. * Does this piece bear all matching S/N'd parts?? Commercial style S/N placement implies a hidden location for many. In addition to the 4 you've mentioned (Frame, trigger, side plate, & rear toggle), the barrel (5 digit-rear underside), takedown lever(last 2-underneath), breech block(last 2-left side/top), forward toggle(last 2-underneath the middle link of the 3 in the toggle train), extractor(last 2-underneath), & grips (last 2-inside both) normally are numbered. Unless broken at some time, the extractor is rarely changed. Value varies accordingly. * Generally well made, sold to whomever had the $'s in the lean 20's, & finished better than the contemporary Police/Military models; although, not up to pre-WWI Commercials. Is yours marked "Germany"?? * While not recommending you shoot a collectable, I found my Dad's shooter in 7.65mm accurate & a pleasure to fire. Respectfully, WR

01-16-2003, 09:50 AM	#3
Fern User Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: California Posts: 6 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Dear RockinWR, Thanks for the info. About the year, I found it in my original receipt...also, the "crown above N" is listed in this site's "Markings" as "German commercial proof. Found on some commercial Lugers of the 1906-1914 era. A few Lugers manufactured by Krieghoff have a similiar but small proof." (Proof 1; item #4). You are right as also the barrel and take down lever show the last two digits; for the other parts, I will have to wait until I find enough confidence to go to the next level of disassembly. I am glad that you mentioned about shooting it as I was reluctant to admit that I went trough a few boxes as I was captivated by the accuracy and the general pleasure that it gives to use such a wonderful piece of machinery. I know that this is not recommended and I probably wont' do it again but it was great while it lasted... Thank you for your prompt reply Fern

01-16-2003, 10:48 AM	#4
Ron Wood Moderator 2010 LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Santa Teresa New Mexico just outside of the West Texas town of El Paso Posts: 6,988 Thanks: 1,067 Thanked 5,099 Times in 1,676 Posts	Fern, It appears in your photos that the "crown above N" proof is actually Proof 3; Item #28 - "28. German "Nitro" commercial proof. Found on Lugers produced after 1920. Receiver proof is upright". This is consistent with the serial number range and RockinWR's identification. Ron __________________ If it's made after 1918...it's a reproduction

01-16-2003, 11:11 AM	#5
Fern User Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: California Posts: 6 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Hi Ron.... I had not noticed this marking until you mentioned it...I am now thoroghlly confused! Can you or anybody else help me determine what I have? (year, value, etc). I am grateful for any feedback... Fern

01-16-2003, 12:34 PM	#7
Pete Ebbink User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: The USA Posts: 5,919 Thanks: 0 Thanked 6 Times in 4 Posts	Hello Fern, If you go to our entry site at www.lugerforum.com, you will see a menu selection for "Technical" information, in which there is a decent description to disassemble/re-assemble a luger. Not sure when you shot those rounds through this pistol that you got in 1989, but a good cleaning after a day at the range is always a good idea. If you need additional help, you might let us know, generally, where in California you live. We have several Luger Forum memebers that live in CA-state and you might find one person close by to help you in person if you need more help. Regards, Pete... <img border="0" alt="[typing]" title="" src="graemlins/yltype.gif" />

01-16-2003, 02:57 PM	#8
Fern User Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: California Posts: 6 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Thanks for your help Pete... The last time I shot it was 5-6 years ago; I always made sure that I cleaned and oiled it after use... I live near LAX in Los Angeles Fern

01-16-2003, 03:00 PM	#9
Fern User Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: California Posts: 6 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Thanks Ron... Fern

01-20-2003, 02:10 PM	#11
Fern User Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: California Posts: 6 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Hello Lugerdoc... Thanks for the info... Martin Retting is the dealer where I purchased the pistol originally and identified it as a 1908! Fern