1918 Dwm

jamese · 03-29-2004, 09:31 AM

The gun is a 1918 DWM, the extra eagle looks like early Mauser to me
It also looks like a grip strap marking have been removed.

Is this a possible rework after the warÃ¢?Â¦ any thoughts on the mater ?

http://www.auctionarms.com/search/di...temnum=5611585

Jim

Vlim · 03-31-2004, 10:49 AM

Hi,

Reproofed after barrel replacement?

Lugerdoc · 03-31-2004, 11:24 AM

GvV, You're probably correct about the addition of the early Nazi proof eagle, but this is quite unusual. I've seen several WW1 militaries with added Nazi proofs, but this is the first like this. TH

Vlim · 03-31-2004, 11:49 AM

Tom,

The fact that it has no 1920 property mark is interesting. Perhaps an officer's personal gun that served during WW1, was not 1920-marked because of personal ownership, had it's barrel replaced and proofed at Mauser when the Officer went back in service in the 1930s and rather than buying a new gun, continued using his old one.

JuergenG · 04-01-2004, 03:00 AM

The additional eagle is "Federal Republic of Germany".
I'm not sure but this might show the gun has been in service with post WWII German authorities.
BTW, the grip looks pretty much like a unit mark has been grounded off.
Juergen

Vlim · 04-01-2004, 11:31 AM

Juergen,

I'm puzzled. Do you mean that the proof used in the postwar Bundesrepublik is similar to that before the war?

(I trust you refer to the rightmost eagle?)

JuergenG · 04-01-2004, 12:04 PM

Yes, I mean the rightmost eagle.
Pretty much looks like the Federal Eagle (Bundesadler), in use since January 20, 1950.
At the time it was introduced the order issued by Adenauer was referring to the Weimar era eagle.
Could this mean it was re-proofed in the Weimar era ?

Vlim · 04-01-2004, 12:47 PM

Hi Juergen,

The first 'proof eagle' dates from the time the gun was manufactured, 1918. The second (rightmost) 'proof eagle' was in use as a Wehrmacht acceptance proof from 1936 - 1939.

A change in proof marks in 1950 is logical since the post-1939 one was a Nazi-swastika one and therefore not fit for use after WW2. I guess they just returned to the 1936 - 1939 proof since that one was 'a-political' and available.

Therefore I think this particular gun was reproofed between 1936 - 1939.

Vlim · 04-05-2004, 11:42 AM

Found a nice website addressing postwar German proofing. You will see that the later postwar proofs match the earlier prewar one which may indeed create confusion.

http://www.waffeninfo.net/beschuss.php

Also follow the link to the german proof house identifiers. The staghorn is found on postwar Mauser Parabellums and I have a 1989-proofed VoPo which has the Koln proof mark.

http://www.waffeninfo.net/waffen/bes...schuss_brd.jpg

Proof mark years are either 2 letter year codes or 2 digit year codes (i.e. 1972 is proofed as 72).

The year letters follow the following scheme:
A = 0
B = 1
C = 2
D = 3
E = 4
F = 5
G = 6
H = 7
I = 8
J = 9

So 1989 would be represented by IJ.

Hope this may clarify some proofmark issues.

03-29-2004, 09:31 AM	#1
jamese User Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: South Florida Posts: 792 Thanks: 0 Thanked 86 Times in 36 Posts	1918 Dwm The gun is a 1918 DWM, the extra eagle looks like early Mauser to me It also looks like a grip strap marking have been removed. Is this a possible rework after the warÃ¢?Â¦ any thoughts on the mater ? http://www.auctionarms.com/search/di...temnum=5611585 Jim __________________ The "truth" is a matter of Perception

03-31-2004, 11:24 AM	#3
Lugerdoc Patron LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: POB 398 St.Charles,MO. 63302 Posts: 5,089 Thanks: 6 Thanked 737 Times in 484 Posts	GvV, You're probably correct about the addition of the early Nazi proof eagle, but this is quite unusual. I've seen several WW1 militaries with added Nazi proofs, but this is the first like this. TH __________________ Tom Heller POB 398 ST.Charles, MO. 63302 Tel 636-447-3006 lugerdoc@charter.net

03-31-2004, 10:49 AM	#2
Vlim Moderator Lifetime LugerForum Patron Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Europe Posts: 5,053 Thanks: 1,036 Thanked 3,990 Times in 1,205 Posts	Hi, Reproofed after barrel replacement?

03-31-2004, 11:49 AM	#4
Vlim Moderator Lifetime LugerForum Patron Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Europe Posts: 5,053 Thanks: 1,036 Thanked 3,990 Times in 1,205 Posts	Tom, The fact that it has no 1920 property mark is interesting. Perhaps an officer's personal gun that served during WW1, was not 1920-marked because of personal ownership, had it's barrel replaced and proofed at Mauser when the Officer went back in service in the 1930s and rather than buying a new gun, continued using his old one.

04-01-2004, 03:00 AM	#5
JuergenG User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Germany Posts: 155 Thanks: 3 Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post	The additional eagle is "Federal Republic of Germany". I'm not sure but this might show the gun has been in service with post WWII German authorities. BTW, the grip looks pretty much like a unit mark has been grounded off. Juergen

04-01-2004, 11:31 AM	#6
Vlim Moderator Lifetime LugerForum Patron Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Europe Posts: 5,053 Thanks: 1,036 Thanked 3,990 Times in 1,205 Posts	Juergen, I'm puzzled. Do you mean that the proof used in the postwar Bundesrepublik is similar to that before the war? (I trust you refer to the rightmost eagle?)

04-01-2004, 12:04 PM	#7
JuergenG User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Germany Posts: 155 Thanks: 3 Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post	Yes, I mean the rightmost eagle. Pretty much looks like the Federal Eagle (Bundesadler), in use since January 20, 1950. At the time it was introduced the order issued by Adenauer was referring to the Weimar era eagle. Could this mean it was re-proofed in the Weimar era ?

04-01-2004, 12:47 PM	#8
Vlim Moderator Lifetime LugerForum Patron Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Europe Posts: 5,053 Thanks: 1,036 Thanked 3,990 Times in 1,205 Posts	Hi Juergen, The first 'proof eagle' dates from the time the gun was manufactured, 1918. The second (rightmost) 'proof eagle' was in use as a Wehrmacht acceptance proof from 1936 - 1939. A change in proof marks in 1950 is logical since the post-1939 one was a Nazi-swastika one and therefore not fit for use after WW2. I guess they just returned to the 1936 - 1939 proof since that one was 'a-political' and available. Therefore I think this particular gun was reproofed between 1936 - 1939.

04-05-2004, 11:42 AM	#9
Vlim Moderator Lifetime LugerForum Patron Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Europe Posts: 5,053 Thanks: 1,036 Thanked 3,990 Times in 1,205 Posts	Found a nice website addressing postwar German proofing. You will see that the later postwar proofs match the earlier prewar one which may indeed create confusion. http://www.waffeninfo.net/beschuss.php Also follow the link to the german proof house identifiers. The staghorn is found on postwar Mauser Parabellums and I have a 1989-proofed VoPo which has the Koln proof mark. http://www.waffeninfo.net/waffen/bes...schuss_brd.jpg Proof mark years are either 2 letter year codes or 2 digit year codes (i.e. 1972 is proofed as 72). The year letters follow the following scheme: A = 0 B = 1 C = 2 D = 3 E = 4 F = 5 G = 6 H = 7 I = 8 J = 9 So 1989 would be represented by IJ. Hope this may clarify some proofmark issues.