Kreighoff P-08

02-07-2002, 07:32 PM

I have a P-08 manufactured by Heinrich Kreighoff Waffenbrik. I have not been able to locate any information as to it's year of manufacture or value. It is marked on the toggle with the Kreighoff "dagger over anchor" logo over Kreighoff Suhl. The breech block is marked just to the left of the extractor with a very small star over the letter "N". This "star over N" mark is also on the left side of the breech just in front of the 3 digit serial number and just below that on the left frame rail. The frame has the same 3 digit serial number preceded by the letter "P", stamped on the front immediately under the barrel. I would think that the "P" would be the date code, but I can find no information on that. The left side of the frame is marked "Heinrich Kreighoff Waffenbrik Suhl" in three lines and the safety is just marked "Gesichert", which is visible when the weapon is on safe. The only marking on the right side of the pistol is a small star on the leading edge of the breech directly above the frame rail. The grip panels are of brown plastic. It shows some holster wear at the muzzle, but other than that the finish is very good. I also have a black leather holster with a magazine pouch attached to it and two magazines. One magazine has a walnut base plate and the other is aluminum. Thanks in advance for any help you can provide.

Orv Reichert · 02-07-2002, 09:10 PM

You have a Krieghoff Commercial-side frame inscribed...as described in Kenyon's LUGERS AT RANDOM page 316

Everything sounds correct...even the plastic brown grips

Congratulations!..Less than 1000 made..1935-1937

Orv Reichert

Orv Reichert · 02-07-2002, 09:16 PM

Simpson has one for sale..70% blue/straw with pitting due to bad storage ... SN P1XX at $1500

Orv Reichert

Herb · 02-07-2002, 09:39 PM

The toggle marking is that of the Krieghoff dated 1936 through 1943 military contract late 1st issue middle toggle link. It should be the 'fat' anchor. Are you sure about the 'star' over N? It should be a sort of 'crown' over N. If it is a sort of 'crown' over N it is a nitro proof of commercial models from 1906 through 1930. It represents a smokeless powder testing and took the place of the crown B and U. Five digit models are 1923 models. This mark may also be found on other parts of the Luger. The 'P' code before the three digit serial number indicates that it is a Krieghoff commercial model, such as P358. The side frame inscription should be 'leaning' a little to the rear of the pistol,if so it is a mid Krieghoff inscription used on the 1939 'P' code models. Also the barrel should be 4" and the caliber is 7.65mm. If this is true, only TWO (2) models of this Luger are know to exist!! This is the best I can do with the info provided. There were several kinds of brown plastic grips, most were 1/4" thick but the checkering differed from fine to medium, some were bakelite, and all apparently had a smooth rim around the edge. If yours appears to have 'fine' chekering it is a 1936 to 1943 grip. Hope this info helped you to identify it. If you come up with additional info, I'll be glad to try to identify the markings. Please remit $20.00 to my e-mail address, preferably in Green Stamps.

02-07-2002, 10:32 PM

Thanks for the info guys. I should have mentioned that it has a 4" barrel, but it is chambered in 9mm. Thanks for the ID on the proof marks. I had been wondering if it was a refurbished piece.

Big Norm · 02-08-2002, 02:20 AM

Herb,

I wonder just where you got the info that the 30 cal P-code w/side inscription had only two produced. I really think that you mean that two with a 150mm barrel in 9mm per Gibson pg 190. (hate it when people put things in milimeters) I have a three digit serial # one w/100mm barrel (four inch) with brown, plastic grips, fine checkering w/ smooth rim trim. A five digit star on the right side receiver near the barrel is just a rejection mark. No marking on the locking bolt or trigger. The inscribtion is correct according to Gibson.

The crowned lazy or vertical "N" is on the underside on the barrel, side plate (on its thumb), breech block and left side of receiver. The serial number on the left side of the receiver is just the three digit number but no "P". The underside of the barrel does not have the serial number. Only the crown "N" over the caliber marking "765/m" (sloppy caliber marking). A very quick examination indicated that the two digit serial number exists in only a few places. On the inside of the side plate and the left side on the breech block. I wanted to get this off to the forum so I did not do a great stripping, looking for two digit numbers. All the three digit serial numbers were put in pretty sloppily. Otherwise, the gun looks pretty minty and does not look redone.

The Aluminum bottom mag has no serial number but is marked 655 under an eagle.There is also what looks like a "42" on the bottom. The tube is blued.

Not that I am challenging you. But I now have a vested interest in what you say and would like to look up what you said. Your comment that only two are known set some bells off in my head. Thats the same quanity as the 1906 45 caliber test Luger so maybe my Luger is worth a million bucks too. If so, then I will send you $20 worth of S&H green stamps as a thank you and a token of my gratitude.

Big "potential millionaire" Norm

P.S.

If Simpson had a P-code w/inscription for sale for $1500, then it has to be in worse condition than indicated. Many of these guns have been restored. And there has been counterfeiting.

Lonnie Zimmerman · 02-08-2002, 12:17 PM

Norm; your magazine is a ww11 replacement from Mauser.

Herb · 02-08-2002, 02:50 PM

I found all of that info in Sam Costanzo's book "World of Lugers". The particular side plate inscription is on page 213, item 200A. His book is long out of print and will set you back about $350.00 in excellent condition if you can even find one. I have only seen one other for sale and it was in 'good' condition for $275.00.

Herb · 02-08-2002, 02:54 PM

Didn't read your message closely enough, Sam says only two were known to exist, have no idea how many were actually produced.

02-08-2002, 11:27 PM

Orv,

Does the star on the right side, as described by the post author, mean that this was a Kreighoff military that did not pass proofing and was reworked for commerical issue ?

Big Norm · 02-09-2002, 11:28 AM

Dang! I figured that since the Kreg w/side inscription was a commercial, this was a commercial mag.

Big Norm

Big Norm · 02-09-2002, 11:32 AM

Herb,

Dang again! I just quit my job because I thought that I was a millionaire.

Big (poor man) Norm

Herb · 02-09-2002, 12:05 PM

I did a search for the book after my last post. Found a few, one is "like new" even has the dust jacket, mine doesn't, it is in a militaria shop in Vantaa Finland and can be yours for only $425.00 US or 455 EURO. The guy's name is Olli and I have his e-mail if you want it. The others are in the two hundred range and their condition varies. Now that you are unemployed, you have a lot more time to find some really great Lugers. By the way, Costanzo's book has a 1977 copywrite so in the last 25 years a lot of new variations have probably popped up that are not covered in his examples.

Big Norm · 02-09-2002, 11:45 PM

I know a guy in Tonsberg, Norway who runs a militia shop. These Scandinavian guys seem to have a lot of stuff. I have not contacted my guy yet. He specializes in WW2 stuff and I am a WW1 nut. But I have sent him a list of serial #'s though a contact that I have. Since I don't have an export license, I can only hope for some mags or stocks. I did not know that Finland was on the Euro.

Thanks for reminding me. I have not heard from the Norwegian guy yet. I will have to get ahold of my contact again to see what is happening.

Big Norm

02-10-2002, 01:06 PM

Only Orv and Herb get the 5 extra bonus points for spelling the name right in their posts.........tsk tsk, guys.

02-10-2002, 02:24 PM

I always pronounced it thater way?

Is that be wrong?

02-10-2002, 07:50 PM

Herb · 02-10-2002, 09:06 PM

Maybe not, my last name is Keister, pronounced properly it is Kaister, buy the family, after immigrating here from Germany in the 1700's, somehow got it changed to Keester. I think it was done at immagration, as there is no other explanation for it. Normally, in the German language, Kei will be kai and Kie will be kee. But who cares as long as I get called something similar early enough to get a beer!

Big Norm · 02-11-2002, 05:57 AM

I tink that your rool only applies if the phonetic sound is "E". Witch gets us down to what is the correct pronunceiaton? Is it Kr-ee-ghoff or Kr-aye-ghoff?

Big Norm

02-13-2002, 12:27 AM

Auf Deutsch (in German), pronounce the last letter. For ei, pronounce "i." For ie, pronounce "e." Krieghoff is KriEghoff. As in blitzkrieg, krieg meaning war.

02-07-2002, 07:32 PM	#1
k9baron Guest Posts: n/a	Kreighoff P-08 I have a P-08 manufactured by Heinrich Kreighoff Waffenbrik. I have not been able to locate any information as to it's year of manufacture or value. It is marked on the toggle with the Kreighoff "dagger over anchor" logo over Kreighoff Suhl. The breech block is marked just to the left of the extractor with a very small star over the letter "N". This "star over N" mark is also on the left side of the breech just in front of the 3 digit serial number and just below that on the left frame rail. The frame has the same 3 digit serial number preceded by the letter "P", stamped on the front immediately under the barrel. I would think that the "P" would be the date code, but I can find no information on that. The left side of the frame is marked "Heinrich Kreighoff Waffenbrik Suhl" in three lines and the safety is just marked "Gesichert", which is visible when the weapon is on safe. The only marking on the right side of the pistol is a small star on the leading edge of the breech directly above the frame rail. The grip panels are of brown plastic. It shows some holster wear at the muzzle, but other than that the finish is very good. I also have a black leather holster with a magazine pouch attached to it and two magazines. One magazine has a walnut base plate and the other is aluminum. Thanks in advance for any help you can provide.

02-07-2002, 09:10 PM	#2
Orv Reichert RIP Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: SW Washington State Posts: 339 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Kreighoff P-08 You have a Krieghoff Commercial-side frame inscribed...as described in Kenyon's LUGERS AT RANDOM page 316 Everything sounds correct...even the plastic brown grips Congratulations!..Less than 1000 made..1935-1937 Orv Reichert

02-07-2002, 09:16 PM	#3
Orv Reichert RIP Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: SW Washington State Posts: 339 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Value Simpson has one for sale..70% blue/straw with pitting due to bad storage ... SN P1XX at $1500 Orv Reichert

02-07-2002, 09:39 PM	#4
Herb User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Utah, in the land of the Sleeping Rainbow Posts: 1,457 Thanks: 0 Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post	Re: Kreighoff P-08 The toggle marking is that of the Krieghoff dated 1936 through 1943 military contract late 1st issue middle toggle link. It should be the 'fat' anchor. Are you sure about the 'star' over N? It should be a sort of 'crown' over N. If it is a sort of 'crown' over N it is a nitro proof of commercial models from 1906 through 1930. It represents a smokeless powder testing and took the place of the crown B and U. Five digit models are 1923 models. This mark may also be found on other parts of the Luger. The 'P' code before the three digit serial number indicates that it is a Krieghoff commercial model, such as P358. The side frame inscription should be 'leaning' a little to the rear of the pistol,if so it is a mid Krieghoff inscription used on the 1939 'P' code models. Also the barrel should be 4" and the caliber is 7.65mm. If this is true, only TWO (2) models of this Luger are know to exist!! This is the best I can do with the info provided. There were several kinds of brown plastic grips, most were 1/4" thick but the checkering differed from fine to medium, some were bakelite, and all apparently had a smooth rim around the edge. If yours appears to have 'fine' chekering it is a 1936 to 1943 grip. Hope this info helped you to identify it. If you come up with additional info, I'll be glad to try to identify the markings. Please remit $20.00 to my e-mail address, preferably in Green Stamps.

02-07-2002, 10:32 PM	#5
k9baron Guest Posts: n/a	Re: Kreighoff P-08 Thanks for the info guys. I should have mentioned that it has a 4" barrel, but it is chambered in 9mm. Thanks for the ID on the proof marks. I had been wondering if it was a refurbished piece.

02-08-2002, 02:20 AM	#6
Big Norm RIP Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: SE Michigan Posts: 1,864 Thanks: 1 Thanked 6 Times in 5 Posts	Re: Kreighoff P-08 Herb, I wonder just where you got the info that the 30 cal P-code w/side inscription had only two produced. I really think that you mean that two with a 150mm barrel in 9mm per Gibson pg 190. (hate it when people put things in milimeters) I have a three digit serial # one w/100mm barrel (four inch) with brown, plastic grips, fine checkering w/ smooth rim trim. A five digit star on the right side receiver near the barrel is just a rejection mark. No marking on the locking bolt or trigger. The inscribtion is correct according to Gibson. The crowned lazy or vertical "N" is on the underside on the barrel, side plate (on its thumb), breech block and left side of receiver. The serial number on the left side of the receiver is just the three digit number but no "P". The underside of the barrel does not have the serial number. Only the crown "N" over the caliber marking "765/m" (sloppy caliber marking). A very quick examination indicated that the two digit serial number exists in only a few places. On the inside of the side plate and the left side on the breech block. I wanted to get this off to the forum so I did not do a great stripping, looking for two digit numbers. All the three digit serial numbers were put in pretty sloppily. Otherwise, the gun looks pretty minty and does not look redone. The Aluminum bottom mag has no serial number but is marked 655 under an eagle.There is also what looks like a "42" on the bottom. The tube is blued. Not that I am challenging you. But I now have a vested interest in what you say and would like to look up what you said. Your comment that only two are known set some bells off in my head. Thats the same quanity as the 1906 45 caliber test Luger so maybe my Luger is worth a million bucks too. If so, then I will send you $20 worth of S&H green stamps as a thank you and a token of my gratitude. Big "potential millionaire" Norm P.S. If Simpson had a P-code w/inscription for sale for $1500, then it has to be in worse condition than indicated. Many of these guns have been restored. And there has been counterfeiting.

02-08-2002, 12:17 PM	#7
Lonnie Zimmerman User Join Date: Jun 2002 Posts: 523 Thanks: 0 Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post	Re: Kreighoff P-08 Norm; your magazine is a ww11 replacement from Mauser.

02-08-2002, 02:50 PM	#8
Herb User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Utah, in the land of the Sleeping Rainbow Posts: 1,457 Thanks: 0 Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post	Re: Kreighoff P-08 I found all of that info in Sam Costanzo's book "World of Lugers". The particular side plate inscription is on page 213, item 200A. His book is long out of print and will set you back about $350.00 in excellent condition if you can even find one. I have only seen one other for sale and it was in 'good' condition for $275.00.

02-08-2002, 02:54 PM	#9
Herb User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Utah, in the land of the Sleeping Rainbow Posts: 1,457 Thanks: 0 Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post	Re: Kreighoff P-08 Didn't read your message closely enough, Sam says only two were known to exist, have no idea how many were actually produced.

02-08-2002, 11:27 PM	#10
Wm. "Pete" Ebbink Guest Posts: n/a	Star On Right Side ? Orv, Does the star on the right side, as described by the post author, mean that this was a Kreighoff military that did not pass proofing and was reworked for commerical issue ?

02-09-2002, 11:28 AM	#11
Big Norm RIP Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: SE Michigan Posts: 1,864 Thanks: 1 Thanked 6 Times in 5 Posts	Re: Kreighoff P-08 Dang! I figured that since the Kreg w/side inscription was a commercial, this was a commercial mag. Big Norm

02-09-2002, 11:32 AM	#12
Big Norm RIP Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: SE Michigan Posts: 1,864 Thanks: 1 Thanked 6 Times in 5 Posts	Re: Kreighoff P-08 Herb, Dang again! I just quit my job because I thought that I was a millionaire. Big (poor man) Norm

02-09-2002, 12:05 PM	#13
Herb User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Utah, in the land of the Sleeping Rainbow Posts: 1,457 Thanks: 0 Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post	Re: Kreighoff P-08 I did a search for the book after my last post. Found a few, one is "like new" even has the dust jacket, mine doesn't, it is in a militaria shop in Vantaa Finland and can be yours for only $425.00 US or 455 EURO. The guy's name is Olli and I have his e-mail if you want it. The others are in the two hundred range and their condition varies. Now that you are unemployed, you have a lot more time to find some really great Lugers. By the way, Costanzo's book has a 1977 copywrite so in the last 25 years a lot of new variations have probably popped up that are not covered in his examples.

02-09-2002, 11:45 PM	#14
Big Norm RIP Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: SE Michigan Posts: 1,864 Thanks: 1 Thanked 6 Times in 5 Posts	Re: Kreighoff P-08 I know a guy in Tonsberg, Norway who runs a militia shop. These Scandinavian guys seem to have a lot of stuff. I have not contacted my guy yet. He specializes in WW2 stuff and I am a WW1 nut. But I have sent him a list of serial #'s though a contact that I have. Since I don't have an export license, I can only hope for some mags or stocks. I did not know that Finland was on the Euro. Thanks for reminding me. I have not heard from the Norwegian guy yet. I will have to get ahold of my contact again to see what is happening. Big Norm

02-10-2002, 01:06 PM	#15
It is KRIEGHOFF!!!!! not "kreighoff" Guest Posts: n/a	Re: Kreighoff P-08 Only Orv and Herb get the 5 extra bonus points for spelling the name right in their posts.........tsk tsk, guys.

02-10-2002, 02:24 PM	#16
66mustang Guest Posts: n/a	Kreekorf I always pronounced it thater way? Is that be wrong?

02-10-2002, 07:50 PM	#17
The Shadow Guest Posts: n/a	I before E, except after C, or in ScheiBe (EOM)

02-10-2002, 09:06 PM	#18
Herb User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Utah, in the land of the Sleeping Rainbow Posts: 1,457 Thanks: 0 Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post	Re: Kreekorf Maybe not, my last name is Keister, pronounced properly it is Kaister, buy the family, after immigrating here from Germany in the 1700's, somehow got it changed to Keester. I think it was done at immagration, as there is no other explanation for it. Normally, in the German language, Kei will be kai and Kie will be kee. But who cares as long as I get called something similar early enough to get a beer!

02-11-2002, 05:57 AM	#19
Big Norm RIP Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: SE Michigan Posts: 1,864 Thanks: 1 Thanked 6 Times in 5 Posts	Re: I before E, except after C, or in ScheiBe I tink that your rool only applies if the phonetic sound is "E". Witch gets us down to what is the correct pronunceiaton? Is it Kr-ee-ghoff or Kr-aye-ghoff? Big Norm

02-13-2002, 12:27 AM	#20
Bill Utterback Guest Posts: n/a	Re: I before E, except after C, or in ScheiBe Auf Deutsch (in German), pronounce the last letter. For ei, pronounce "i." For ie, pronounce "e." Krieghoff is KriEghoff. As in blitzkrieg, krieg meaning war.