High speed velocity champion?

conehammer · 12-26-2011, 02:55 PM

I know I've read where the 7.63 Mauser cartridge ( as loaded for the C96) was considered by some authors the high speed pistol velocity champion until the .357 magnum came along.

However what about the 8.5mm Gabbet-Fairfax 'MARS' pistol cartridge? It supposedly attained 1750fps in 1900??

Nobody wanted to fire it supposedly but it was sold commercially even for a short time; doesn't that qualify as a commercial alternative to the Mauser?

Jerry

sheepherder · 12-26-2011, 04:28 PM

I dunno...but I can recall reading that the 38 Super was the velocity champ until the 357 came along...

Guess it depended on who was tooting what horn...

alvin · 12-26-2011, 04:29 PM

I saw people on wiki discussing this. One guy explained that Mars was considered being a market disaster so it does not count -

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talk:Mauser_C96

conehammer · 12-26-2011, 06:58 PM

Some wags would say the C96 wasn't commercially successful at first and the Mauser fudged serial numbers to give the impression that it was doing better than it actually was....

Mr Gabbet should have taken a cue from Mauser and started his serial numbers at 4,000...
there might have been more interest which would have precipitated meaningful, commercially salable changes and we'd all have another reasonably plentiful classic to collect.

I can see us all scrambling for the British Naval Contract Mars .45 caliber ( with or without Royal Lions Rampant ), Tibetan Mounted Police Contract 8.5mm
with stylized Mahakala effigy over the chamber and the highly sought after 9mm Gabbet-Fairfax Latvian Postal Inspector Commemorative Contract with high relief Morning Star side panel engravings....

Perhaps I'll just stick to my Mausers....

Jerry

alvin · 12-26-2011, 07:05 PM

Did the "fudged serial numbers" theory come from Belford and Dunlap's book? I saw it's repeated many times but I believe that book was the source. The theory was based on some observation on samples, but no detail was given in the book. e.g. Which feature jumping back and forth,,, no detail. That's not convincing IMO.

conehammer · 12-26-2011, 07:56 PM

It's a theory Alvin like many others in the firearms field.
Jerry

12-26-2011, 02:55 PM	#1
conehammer User Join Date: Jul 2007 Posts: 116 Thanks: 1 Thanked 55 Times in 21 Posts	High speed velocity champion? I know I've read where the 7.63 Mauser cartridge ( as loaded for the C96) was considered by some authors the high speed pistol velocity champion until the .357 magnum came along. However what about the 8.5mm Gabbet-Fairfax 'MARS' pistol cartridge? It supposedly attained 1750fps in 1900?? Nobody wanted to fire it supposedly but it was sold commercially even for a short time; doesn't that qualify as a commercial alternative to the Mauser? Jerry

12-26-2011, 04:28 PM	#2
sheepherder Lifer Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: ...on the 'ol Erie Canal... Posts: 8,195 Thanks: 1,413 Thanked 4,462 Times in 2,336 Posts	I dunno...but I can recall reading that the 38 Super was the velocity champ until the 357 came along... Guess it depended on who was tooting what horn... __________________ I like my coffee the way I like my women... ...Cold and bitter...

12-26-2011, 04:29 PM	#3
alvin User Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: US Posts: 3,843 Thanks: 132 Thanked 729 Times in 438 Posts	I saw people on wiki discussing this. One guy explained that Mars was considered being a market disaster so it does not count - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talk:Mauser_C96

12-26-2011, 06:58 PM	#4
conehammer User Join Date: Jul 2007 Posts: 116 Thanks: 1 Thanked 55 Times in 21 Posts	Some wags would say the C96 wasn't commercially successful at first and the Mauser fudged serial numbers to give the impression that it was doing better than it actually was.... Mr Gabbet should have taken a cue from Mauser and started his serial numbers at 4,000... there might have been more interest which would have precipitated meaningful, commercially salable changes and we'd all have another reasonably plentiful classic to collect. I can see us all scrambling for the British Naval Contract Mars .45 caliber ( with or without Royal Lions Rampant ), Tibetan Mounted Police Contract 8.5mm with stylized Mahakala effigy over the chamber and the highly sought after 9mm Gabbet-Fairfax Latvian Postal Inspector Commemorative Contract with high relief Morning Star side panel engravings.... Perhaps I'll just stick to my Mausers.... Jerry

12-26-2011, 07:05 PM	#5
alvin User Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: US Posts: 3,843 Thanks: 132 Thanked 729 Times in 438 Posts	Did the "fudged serial numbers" theory come from Belford and Dunlap's book? I saw it's repeated many times but I believe that book was the source. The theory was based on some observation on samples, but no detail was given in the book. e.g. Which feature jumping back and forth,,, no detail. That's not convincing IMO.

12-26-2011, 07:56 PM	#6
conehammer User Join Date: Jul 2007 Posts: 116 Thanks: 1 Thanked 55 Times in 21 Posts	It's a theory Alvin like many others in the firearms field. Jerry