Stamp identity? - 1914 Erfurt

Cajonkev · 07-20-2010, 01:55 PM

Does anyone have the identity of the left-most mark here?

The "HZ***3" characters are well defined, however the center three are very hard to recognize.

As illustrated, it is 2 1/2 bars on the left and a full three on the right.

"HZ4**3" or "HZ**t3" are also possibles.

As seen in the overview, this is the far left stamp.

Thanks

Oops - Sketch was/is worse than I thought. The picture is better though and is perhaps enough.

Cajonkev · 07-20-2010, 02:12 PM

I am also looking to identify these barrel markings:

The main group appears on the underside and is center to the barrel.

The top is the serial number

Next comes the "8,82" underneath the serial

Then the "42" underneath the "8,82"

1/2mm to the right is a very small stamp (military poof?) without numbers

On the top of the barrel left of center is another mil style proof with the possible numbers "889". It appears that it was a roll stamped and the first and last numbers are partials.

This sketch will also probably be blurred. I am without a good camera, mount or diffuser here to take good images from and the lighting is horrible.

The bottom sketch is the one on the top of the barrel.

Ron Smith · 07-20-2010, 02:23 PM

Stick Eagle / HZA.J.B.3 is a rework mark "Heerszeugamt" indicating the facility where it was reworked or repaired.

8,82 is the bore gauge.

42 is a code assigned to Mauser for armorer replacement parts.

Not sure of the 1234

The others are test proofs or inspector's marks.

This is an Imperial WWI Luger that was reworked after 1933 under the Third Reich indicated by the Imperial proofs ahead of the Heerszeugamt.

Ron

Cajonkev · 07-20-2010, 02:31 PM

Thanks Ron!

I figured the 8,82 was the gauge but figured I'd not offer my opinions to ensure relevance.

The "1234" was in place of the actual serial number. I just included it to assist in describing the grouping.

I really appreciate your quick reply.

Cheers

mrerick · 07-20-2010, 04:37 PM

On the front of the trigger guard, just below the frame serial number, you may find a cursive letter. That is part of the serial number.

Marc

Dwight Gruber · 07-22-2010, 03:19 AM

HZaJt3 = Heers Zeugamt (Army arms depot), city of Ingolstadt (Jngolstadt, Jt), depot #3

--Dwight

Lugerdoc · 07-22-2010, 09:20 AM

I agree that the E/HZ--- marking is from the Army repair depot, that was probably applied when the new code 42 armor's spare E/623 Steyr made barrel was installed. TH

Cajonkev · 07-22-2010, 04:28 PM

Thanks All!

07-20-2010, 01:55 PM	#1
Cajonkev User Join Date: Jul 2010 Posts: 10 Thanks: 2 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Stamp identity? - 1914 Erfurt Does anyone have the identity of the left-most mark here? The "HZ*3" characters are well defined, however the center three are very hard to recognize. As illustrated, it is 2 1/2 bars on the left and a full three on the right. "HZ43" or "HZ**t3" are also possibles. As seen in the overview, this is the far left stamp. Thanks Oops - Sketch was/is worse than I thought. The picture is better though and is perhaps enough. Attached Thumbnails

07-20-2010, 02:12 PM	#2
Cajonkev User Join Date: Jul 2010 Posts: 10 Thanks: 2 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	I am also looking to identify these barrel markings: The main group appears on the underside and is center to the barrel. The top is the serial number Next comes the "8,82" underneath the serial Then the "42" underneath the "8,82" 1/2mm to the right is a very small stamp (military poof?) without numbers On the top of the barrel left of center is another mil style proof with the possible numbers "889". It appears that it was a roll stamped and the first and last numbers are partials. This sketch will also probably be blurred. I am without a good camera, mount or diffuser here to take good images from and the lighting is horrible. The bottom sketch is the one on the top of the barrel. Attached Thumbnails

07-22-2010, 09:20 AM	#7
Lugerdoc Patron LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: POB 398 St.Charles,MO. 63302 Posts: 5,089 Thanks: 6 Thanked 736 Times in 483 Posts	I agree that the E/HZ--- marking is from the Army repair depot, that was probably applied when the new code 42 armor's spare E/623 Steyr made barrel was installed. TH __________________ Tom Heller POB 398 ST.Charles, MO. 63302 Tel 636-447-3006 lugerdoc@charter.net

07-20-2010, 02:23 PM	#3
Ron Smith User Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Orygun Posts: 4,243 Thanks: 118 Thanked 245 Times in 150 Posts	Stick Eagle / HZA.J.B.3 is a rework mark "Heerszeugamt" indicating the facility where it was reworked or repaired. 8,82 is the bore gauge. 42 is a code assigned to Mauser for armorer replacement parts. Not sure of the 1234 The others are test proofs or inspector's marks. This is an Imperial WWI Luger that was reworked after 1933 under the Third Reich indicated by the Imperial proofs ahead of the Heerszeugamt. Ron __________________ I Still Need DWM side plate #49... if anyone runs across a nice one. What ~Rudyard Kipling~ said...

07-20-2010, 02:31 PM	#4
Cajonkev User Join Date: Jul 2010 Posts: 10 Thanks: 2 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Thanks Ron! I figured the 8,82 was the gauge but figured I'd not offer my opinions to ensure relevance. The "1234" was in place of the actual serial number. I just included it to assist in describing the grouping. I really appreciate your quick reply. Cheers

07-20-2010, 04:37 PM	#5
mrerick Super Moderator - Patron LugerForum Life Patron Join Date: Dec 2009 Location: Eastern North Carolina, USA Posts: 3,907 Thanks: 1,374 Thanked 3,108 Times in 1,509 Posts	On the front of the trigger guard, just below the frame serial number, you may find a cursive letter. That is part of the serial number. Marc

07-22-2010, 03:19 AM	#6
Dwight Gruber User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Portland, Oregon Posts: 3,893 Thanks: 0 Thanked 1,288 Times in 426 Posts	HZaJt3 = Heers Zeugamt (Army arms depot), city of Ingolstadt (Jngolstadt, Jt), depot #3 --Dwight

07-22-2010, 04:28 PM	#8
Cajonkev User Join Date: Jul 2010 Posts: 10 Thanks: 2 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Thanks All!