Simson "Refurbs"

jonnyc · 12-20-2008, 07:05 PM

As I understand it, before Simson began manufacturing Lugers, they refurbed a number of WWI P08s. How does one identify one of these reworked pistols? Do they simply have added E6 or E33 marks?

Edward Tinker · 12-20-2008, 07:25 PM

Here is an answer I did a few weeks back;

MANY lugers were refurbed and also about 12,000 were newly made. The following things are to tell the difffernece in new and refurbed:

1. Acceptance and proofing on right (should be Simson markings)
2. Simson acceptance on almost all small parts
3. Either no suffix or "a" suffix on front of frame, no other suffixes are correct
4. Stock lug should be marked with either E6 E6 or E33 E33 (although one E6 E7 is known)

Ed

jonnyc · 12-20-2008, 11:43 PM

I'm sure it's me, but I'm still a bit confused.
On a refurb, will the original markings still appear, in addition to added E6 or E33 marks? Will the toggles of refurbs have Simson & Son, S, or the original stamping?
Thanks.

jonnyc · 12-28-2008, 10:12 PM

Can someone answer the above?
Thanks.

drbuster · 12-28-2008, 11:11 PM

If Simson refurbished a DWM or Erfurt luger, the toggles will be unchanged. These guns were usually rebarrelled, re gripped and/or re-blued. The E/6 proofs were then added to the Luger, usually over the Imperial proofs on the right side of the receiver, in addition to other places.

Edward Tinker · 12-28-2008, 11:45 PM

Simson refurbs will sometimes swap the toggle (if it was damaged or some other need), I have an example in my book of a DWM with a simson toggle and it still has its original acceptance and proofs on it.

ANYTHING that required a Simson accpetance or proof (read that as new part or part that required re-proofing) would then get simson stamped.

Ed

drbuster · 12-28-2008, 11:53 PM

Thanks Ed. Of course Simson would not allow a damaged toggle to be unchanged!

12-20-2008, 07:05 PM	#1
jonnyc User Join Date: Dec 2008 Posts: 425 Thanks: 2 Thanked 46 Times in 34 Posts	Simson "Refurbs" As I understand it, before Simson began manufacturing Lugers, they refurbed a number of WWI P08s. How does one identify one of these reworked pistols? Do they simply have added E6 or E33 marks?

12-20-2008, 07:25 PM	#2
Edward Tinker Super Moderator Eternal Lifer LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: North of Spokane, WA Posts: 15,926 Thanks: 2,014 Thanked 4,523 Times in 2,089 Posts	Here is an answer I did a few weeks back; MANY lugers were refurbed and also about 12,000 were newly made. The following things are to tell the difffernece in new and refurbed: 1. Acceptance and proofing on right (should be Simson markings) 2. Simson acceptance on almost all small parts 3. Either no suffix or "a" suffix on front of frame, no other suffixes are correct 4. Stock lug should be marked with either E6 E6 or E33 E33 (although one E6 E7 is known) Ed __________________ Edward Tinker ************ Co-Author of Police Lugers - Co-Author of Simson Lugers Author of Veteran Bring Backs Vol I, Vol II, Vol III and Vol IV

12-28-2008, 11:45 PM	#6
Edward Tinker Super Moderator Eternal Lifer LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: North of Spokane, WA Posts: 15,926 Thanks: 2,014 Thanked 4,523 Times in 2,089 Posts	Simson refurbs will sometimes swap the toggle (if it was damaged or some other need), I have an example in my book of a DWM with a simson toggle and it still has its original acceptance and proofs on it. ANYTHING that required a Simson accpetance or proof (read that as new part or part that required re-proofing) would then get simson stamped. Ed __________________ Edward Tinker ************ Co-Author of Police Lugers - Co-Author of Simson Lugers Author of Veteran Bring Backs Vol I, Vol II, Vol III and Vol IV

12-20-2008, 11:43 PM	#3
jonnyc User Join Date: Dec 2008 Posts: 425 Thanks: 2 Thanked 46 Times in 34 Posts	I'm sure it's me, but I'm still a bit confused. On a refurb, will the original markings still appear, in addition to added E6 or E33 marks? Will the toggles of refurbs have Simson & Son, S, or the original stamping? Thanks.

12-28-2008, 10:12 PM	#4
jonnyc User Join Date: Dec 2008 Posts: 425 Thanks: 2 Thanked 46 Times in 34 Posts	Can someone answer the above? Thanks.

12-28-2008, 11:11 PM	#5
drbuster User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: San Mateo, California Posts: 1,432 Thanks: 2 Thanked 71 Times in 56 Posts	If Simson refurbished a DWM or Erfurt luger, the toggles will be unchanged. These guns were usually rebarrelled, re gripped and/or re-blued. The E/6 proofs were then added to the Luger, usually over the Imperial proofs on the right side of the receiver, in addition to other places.

12-28-2008, 11:53 PM	#7
drbuster User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: San Mateo, California Posts: 1,432 Thanks: 2 Thanked 71 Times in 56 Posts	Thanks Ed. Of course Simson would not allow a damaged toggle to be unchanged!