Looking for info

Bill Rupp · 11-05-2001, 09:36 PM

I am looking for information on a luger that I inherited.

It has the following markings:

The crown N is in several locations.

The serial number is in the 9800 series.

It has a 3" barrel.

The DWM logo is on the top of the action.

The last two digits of the sn are in numerous locations.

The word Geladen in on the extractor.

The only place the sn is in full is the barrel and just below the barrel on the front of the frame.

It is .30 cal.

The sn on the clip does not match the rest.

Any info would be appreciated. I need to know if I need to extend my insurace coverage.

Thanks!

Bill

Bill Rupp · 11-05-2001, 10:11 PM

I noted that just below the serial number on the frame and barrel is the letter n in cursive.

Bill Rupp · 11-05-2001, 10:42 PM

http://boards.rennlist.com/upload/serialnum.JPG

11-05-2001, 10:55 PM

Bill,

I hate to be the one to start bad news, but I think;

The serial of 98xx with a barrel no of 98"0" indicated a rebarrel job.

"0" indicates a different size and location of this digit.

and if the serial is other than 9805 then you have a mis-matched takedown lever, (ser. 05)

Which as I understand makes your pistol a "Shooter".

Hope you are not hurt by this news.

ViggoG

Lonnie Zimmerman · 11-05-2001, 11:49 PM

His picture shows 9805 on the barrel and 05 on the takedown lever, so it isn"t a new barrel.

Lonnie

11-06-2001, 12:28 AM

The mistake is partially mine as I failed to see the "5".

However this ser no shown Is a replacement barrel or the poorest job of seralizing on an original stamping that I have ever seen.

The "0" is definatly out of line with the other digits and poorly spaced.

Sorry I think This is a rework of one sort or another for that reason.

My Opinion.

ViggoG

John Sabato · 11-06-2001, 10:25 AM

and from the small portion of photo that you posted, it appears to be in fine shape... although there is the distinct possibility that it has been reblued.

BTW, the barrel should be measured from the tip of the muzzle to the face of the bolt and you should find that it is either 3-7/8ths or 4 inches long... drop a pencil into the muzzle, and then mark it at the muzzle when it stops on the bolt face, then measure the distance from the mark to the end you put in the barrel...

IMHO it is worth a minimum of $400 and could be a couple to a few hundred more depending on the true condition and whether or not it has been reblued...

Please post photos of both sides and the top so we can see the rest of this beauty!

regards,

John Sabato

P.S. - to all who read this: It is election day here in Virginia... if it is where you are then GET OUT AND EXERCISE YOUR RIGHT and Consitutional Duty to VOTE!

And while you're at it VOTE REPUBLICAN! before the liberals give away our constitutional rights to own guns...

(just my political $0.02 )

Bill Rupp · 11-06-2001, 05:46 PM

http://boards.rennlist.com/upload/lugleft.JPG

Bill Rupp · 11-06-2001, 05:48 PM

The right side

http://boards.rennlist.com/upload/lugright.JPG

Bill Rupp · 11-06-2001, 05:49 PM

Front

http://boards.rennlist.com/upload/lugfront.JPG

Bill Rupp · 11-06-2001, 05:51 PM

The clip

http://boards.rennlist.com/upload/lugclip.JPG

John D. · 11-06-2001, 08:05 PM

First of all - that is a MIGHTY FINE looking Commercial!!!

At first, I too thought it was re-barrelled (I saw what Viggo referred to). After seeing several of the new pictures however - I believe it is original. From the pictures - all the "0"s seem to have been struck similiarily...

Also - given the condition of the grips, it appears not to have been handled much - which would account for the overall condition of this Luger and the condition of the strawed parts.

Anyone agree? Disagree??

IMO - it is in beautiful condition. Absolutely beautiful...

John D. · 11-06-2001, 09:01 PM

Given the left side picture - I don't think it has been re-blued either...

Outstanding.!!!

John Sabato · 11-06-2001, 09:28 PM

I will have to wait until I can examine the photo of the mag bottom for evidence of renumbering. I think I can see a sanding line on the computer where I presently am, but I don't have any graphics software for enlargement and enhancement of the photo...

I'll post again tomorrow.

-John Sabato

Johnny Peppers · 11-06-2001, 09:50 PM

The pistol is very nice, but the magazine is the spare magazine from a military Luger rig. The original commercial magazine would not have been numbered.

Bill Rupp · 11-06-2001, 09:50 PM

I guess i'll relay what I know of the history of this. It was either bartered for or purchased by my grandfather in chicago at least 30-40 years ago. When I got it I was told it had less than one box run through it. I still have the remainer of that box. The cloth that is in many of the photos has been wrapped around it since my father had possesion. The bluing is worn only a bit from the action.

My grandfather collected many handguns. This was my prize.

Thanks for all the feedback.

Bill

http://boards.rennlist.com/upload/lugammo.JPG

John D. · 11-06-2001, 10:08 PM

I also own a .30 commercial in the same block as yours ("n" and off in numbers only slightly) and everything on your Luger looks perfect - including the oft-missed front proof of the left side of the toggle.

Yours is in fantastic condition compared to mine - and with a much more personal story. It goes without saying that I know you treasure it not only for being a pristine example, but even more - for the memories it must hold for you personally...!!

As an FYI - the mag is a proper type but not original to your Luger (non-matched and military), which is pretty typical. (Wood based mags back many years ago were sold for a "couple of dollars" in many local gun stores even when I was growing up.).

Best Always!

John D.

John Sabato · 11-07-2001, 10:31 AM

Luger and mag... This one IS apparently not renumbered though...

-JS

11-05-2001, 09:36 PM	#1
Bill Rupp User Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Muskego, WI Posts: 8 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Looking for info I am looking for information on a luger that I inherited. It has the following markings: The crown N is in several locations. The serial number is in the 9800 series. It has a 3" barrel. The DWM logo is on the top of the action. The last two digits of the sn are in numerous locations. The word Geladen in on the extractor. The only place the sn is in full is the barrel and just below the barrel on the front of the frame. It is .30 cal. The sn on the clip does not match the rest. Any info would be appreciated. I need to know if I need to extend my insurace coverage. Thanks! Bill

11-05-2001, 10:11 PM	#2
Bill Rupp User Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Muskego, WI Posts: 8 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Re: Looking for info I noted that just below the serial number on the frame and barrel is the letter n in cursive.

11-05-2001, 10:42 PM	#3
Bill Rupp User Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Muskego, WI Posts: 8 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Re: Looking for info (EOM) http://boards.rennlist.com/upload/serialnum.JPG

11-05-2001, 10:55 PM	#4
Viggo G Dereng Guest Posts: n/a	Re: Looking for info Bill, I hate to be the one to start bad news, but I think; The serial of 98xx with a barrel no of 98"0" indicated a rebarrel job. "0" indicates a different size and location of this digit. and if the serial is other than 9805 then you have a mis-matched takedown lever, (ser. 05) Which as I understand makes your pistol a "Shooter". Hope you are not hurt by this news. ViggoG

11-05-2001, 11:49 PM	#5
Lonnie Zimmerman User Join Date: Jun 2002 Posts: 523 Thanks: 0 Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post	Re: Looking for info His picture shows 9805 on the barrel and 05 on the takedown lever, so it isn"t a new barrel. Lonnie

11-06-2001, 12:28 AM	#6
Viggo G Dereng Guest Posts: n/a	Re: Looking for info - I still Think Rework. The mistake is partially mine as I failed to see the "5". However this ser no shown Is a replacement barrel or the poorest job of seralizing on an original stamping that I have ever seen. The "0" is definatly out of line with the other digits and poorly spaced. Sorry I think This is a rework of one sort or another for that reason. My Opinion. ViggoG

11-06-2001, 10:25 AM	#7
John Sabato Lifer Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: The Capital of the Free World Posts: 10,152 Thanks: 3,003 Thanked 2,304 Times in 1,096 Posts	Based on your information, I VOTE for a 1920 Commercial DWM and from the small portion of photo that you posted, it appears to be in fine shape... although there is the distinct possibility that it has been reblued. BTW, the barrel should be measured from the tip of the muzzle to the face of the bolt and you should find that it is either 3-7/8ths or 4 inches long... drop a pencil into the muzzle, and then mark it at the muzzle when it stops on the bolt face, then measure the distance from the mark to the end you put in the barrel... IMHO it is worth a minimum of $400 and could be a couple to a few hundred more depending on the true condition and whether or not it has been reblued... Please post photos of both sides and the top so we can see the rest of this beauty! regards, John Sabato P.S. - to all who read this: It is election day here in Virginia... if it is where you are then GET OUT AND EXERCISE YOUR RIGHT and Consitutional Duty to VOTE! And while you're at it VOTE REPUBLICAN! before the liberals give away our constitutional rights to own guns... (just my political $0.02 )

11-06-2001, 05:46 PM	#8
Bill Rupp User Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Muskego, WI Posts: 8 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	As requested: More Photos (EOM) http://boards.rennlist.com/upload/lugleft.JPG

11-06-2001, 05:48 PM	#9
Bill Rupp User Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Muskego, WI Posts: 8 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	As Requested: more photos The right side http://boards.rennlist.com/upload/lugright.JPG

11-06-2001, 05:49 PM	#10
Bill Rupp User Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Muskego, WI Posts: 8 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	As Requested: More photos Front http://boards.rennlist.com/upload/lugfront.JPG

11-06-2001, 05:51 PM	#11
Bill Rupp User Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Muskego, WI Posts: 8 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Re: Looking for info The clip http://boards.rennlist.com/upload/lugclip.JPG

11-06-2001, 08:05 PM	#12
John D. Administrator & Site Owner LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: A Little NE of Somewhere... Posts: 2,651 Thanks: 473 Thanked 513 Times in 127 Posts	Bill.... First of all - that is a MIGHTY FINE looking Commercial!!! At first, I too thought it was re-barrelled (I saw what Viggo referred to). After seeing several of the new pictures however - I believe it is original. From the pictures - all the "0"s seem to have been struck similiarily... Also - given the condition of the grips, it appears not to have been handled much - which would account for the overall condition of this Luger and the condition of the strawed parts. Anyone agree? Disagree?? IMO - it is in beautiful condition. Absolutely beautiful...

11-06-2001, 09:01 PM	#13
John D. Administrator & Site Owner LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: A Little NE of Somewhere... Posts: 2,651 Thanks: 473 Thanked 513 Times in 127 Posts	Oh, and I forgot to add.... Given the left side picture - I don't think it has been re-blued either... Outstanding.!!!

11-06-2001, 09:28 PM	#14
John Sabato Lifer Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: The Capital of the Free World Posts: 10,152 Thanks: 3,003 Thanked 2,304 Times in 1,096 Posts	I agree with John D. , but I will have to wait until I can examine the photo of the mag bottom for evidence of renumbering. I think I can see a sanding line on the computer where I presently am, but I don't have any graphics software for enlargement and enhancement of the photo... I'll post again tomorrow. -John Sabato

11-06-2001, 09:50 PM	#15
Johnny Peppers User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Calion, Arkansas Posts: 1,042 Thanks: 0 Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post	Re: I agree with John D. , but The pistol is very nice, but the magazine is the spare magazine from a military Luger rig. The original commercial magazine would not have been numbered.

11-06-2001, 09:50 PM	#16
Bill Rupp User Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Muskego, WI Posts: 8 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Thanks! I guess i'll relay what I know of the history of this. It was either bartered for or purchased by my grandfather in chicago at least 30-40 years ago. When I got it I was told it had less than one box run through it. I still have the remainer of that box. The cloth that is in many of the photos has been wrapped around it since my father had possesion. The bluing is worn only a bit from the action. My grandfather collected many handguns. This was my prize. Thanks for all the feedback. Bill http://boards.rennlist.com/upload/lugammo.JPG

11-06-2001, 10:08 PM	#17
John D. Administrator & Site Owner LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: A Little NE of Somewhere... Posts: 2,651 Thanks: 473 Thanked 513 Times in 127 Posts	Just as an FYI... I also own a .30 commercial in the same block as yours ("n" and off in numbers only slightly) and everything on your Luger looks perfect - including the oft-missed front proof of the left side of the toggle. Yours is in fantastic condition compared to mine - and with a much more personal story. It goes without saying that I know you treasure it not only for being a pristine example, but even more - for the memories it must hold for you personally...!! As an FYI - the mag is a proper type but not original to your Luger (non-matched and military), which is pretty typical. (Wood based mags back many years ago were sold for a "couple of dollars" in many local gun stores even when I was growing up.). Best Always! John D.

11-07-2001, 10:31 AM	#18
John Sabato Lifer Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: The Capital of the Free World Posts: 10,152 Thanks: 3,003 Thanked 2,304 Times in 1,096 Posts	After photo enhancement and enlargement Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: The Capital of the Free World Posts: 10,152 Thanks: 3,003 Thanked 2,304 Times in 1,096 Posts	OOPS, the mag isn't matching at all... I was thinkin' bout a different Luger and mag... This one IS apparently not renumbered though... -JS