Double Date Question

[Marvin]

During the Weimar period when the 1920 property stamp date was added to the existing Lugers, were any of these pistols refinished by an armory or was just the 1920 stamp added?


Also, during this same period when many of the WWI pistols were reissued to the Police (Double Date type) and the magazine safety added, were any of these refinished? If they were, were they stripped, reblued, and were the starw parts reworked with new strawing?


Marvin

[Robert Wiggins]

Marvin;


Great question, we may both learn something here!!

I have found many cases of arsenal or factory (don't know at which level) re-pair and re-finishing on Double Date Lugers. I don't know if this was done exactly concurently with the 1920 stamping or not...As far as the question on the police Lugers, I am very confident in saying that many if not most of the Imperial and Weimar era police Lugers were Re-Blued and upgraded either at the time of the Sear and (sometimes) mag saftey addition or afterward. I would be interested in KNOWING at what level this re-work was conducted. A few months ago I got a 1917 DWM Police (Sear saftey) Luger from my Uncle, Vet bring back with two matching mags (one wood and one Aluminium bottom!) with Weimar brown Police Holster (unit marked to gun). This pistol has been period Rust re-blued. It is about 97% and has the inside surfaces polished bright, but there are tell-tale signs of pitts underneath the blue(very few, very light and minor). This finish is un-questionably period and Official, but is not the 1918 'factory" finish.

ps I have a 1962 era West-German Walther PP that I bought in Germany in about 1981. It is West German Police surplus and has been factory refinished during it's life as a German police pistol. The re-blue is as good or better as any first time Walther blue...and the slide was numbered to stay with and match the frame..this pistol was carried by the German Police after the factory re-blue....Old habits die hard!

I should add that over many years and in many cases the Lugers I inspected were from direct Vet sources that I have seen several Rust-Blue re-blues from the period of the 20's or early 30's. Most of these Lugers have shown pits under the re-applied finish. One has to assume that if the pistol was not rusted and badly worn then there would have been no need for the Germans to re-blue them and since the Germans did not resort in heavy buffing and polishing (in my experience) in their re-working practices....pits will sometimes be found under the re-applied finish. I cannot speak factually to re-applied Strawing, but I suspect that this was also done on the pistols that were rust re-blued.

[Marvin]

I really appreciate the information on this. I have always wondered if they had been reblued, and at what level. One of the Police Double dates I have shows that it was rust reblued at some point. If you look very close at the surface of the metal under the finish, there appears to be some very slight pitting on the metal. This pitting would never be noticed unless you looked closely. The inside is bright, the small parts still have some straw color to them, (although weak), and all marks appear to have never been buffed. Again, thanks for the information!


Marvin

Marvin, Your assesment is right on the mark. About 25 years ago my best friend, vet obtained a horribly pitted (under the rust re-blue), 1918 DWM police rework. This pistol was about 98% finish and had S/42 replacement grips and a Third Reich proof mark of some type (don't remember exactly what it looked like). At any rate is was a period done job and it amazed me that they (Police Officials) would re-work such a rough pistol, but the Germans did not scrap anything that was usable...even in peacetime. As you have probably picked up over time with my post, I really like these period reconditioned Lugers...It is sort of like owning two Lugers in one.

[bill m]

Hi,

I agree with BCC. I would guess that the majority of the Weimar Lugers have been re-blued. The sear safety and magazine safety was not added until the early 1930's, and the reblue could have been done ealier, before the Nazi era. I think at the time of the reblue they also re-strawed most. DWM, Simson, and Krieghoff were all refurbishing Lugers as early as 1922, with DWM as early as 1919 I think. The extend of these refurbishing at this time, and then in the 1930's by the Nazi's makes for some very interesting guns. I have two Weimar complete rigs were all the serial numbers are matching, but the barrel serial number for instance is 1234 A, and the frame serial number is 1234 B, meaning that they took the frame and numbered it to match the receiver, but did not remove the old suffix letter. Not all of these Weimar guns were made from all the parts of the original gun. A lot were made from two and three different guns, but re-numbered to match. Some also have some DWM parts and some Erfurt parts, and still others have mis-matched parts that are original assembly for that particular gun. Most people want the gun to be all matching, but some of these Weimar guns were just not assembled for the police that way.

I have a DWM 1918/1920-It had a unit number buffed off the front strap and left unfinished in that area-no evidence of any other tampering

[BILL]

In my opinion, the Weimar era Lugers that have many different proofs are the most interesting Lugers. There are so few 'conventions' that were followed. They are factory and can be a hybrid of almost any type of Luger. Some folks will really like this feature and some purists won't (again, we all have different interests in the Luger).

[Marvin]

I really appreciate the time all of you put into this question. I had given some thoughts to this question over the years, but nothing to speak off in trying to find out any information. This was good info to know because I was not totally sure of what had transpired during this time except there was a lot of re-work by DWM, Simson, etc. to some existing WWI pistols.


I also enjoy the Weimar era Lugers; they just have this "mystery" about them that canno tbe explained. Many of them saw service in WWI, the Weimar Era, and finally in WWII. Since the influx of Import ed Lugers from Russia have hit our shores, many of these are of this period. I assumed that since most were probably captured from Stalingrad (just my thoughts), that many of the Lugers in use were from the Weimar Republic with a smaller portion of the newly made Mauser pistols.


Marvin