LugerForum Discussion Forums my profile | register | faq | search
upload photo | donate | calendar

Go Back   LugerForum Discussion Forums > Luger Discussion Forums > Lugerforum Archive

 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Unread 07-12-2001, 02:21 PM   #1
Johnny Peppers
User
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Calion, Arkansas
Posts: 1,042
Thanks: 0
Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post
Default Leather preservation

Was looking at a site on German helmets. Found this and thought it might be of innterest to the group.


Leather Balms, Oils, and Preservatives:


In an effort to prevent dry rot, many collectors have considered or have used "leather balms" or "preservatives" that reportedly restore

the natural oils in the leather. Unfortunately, these agents have been shown to accelerate deterioration rather than decrease it!

While many substances are sold for this purpose, the only two that have ever been found to be moderately helpful without causing

further damage include Pecard's Antique Leather Restorer�® and also Lanolin�®. Pecard's�® is considered the best and is also

recommended as the only treatment acceptable for long term leather preservation by the United States Smithsonian Institution.


Never use the following on German helmet leather parts or liners:


Neats-Foot�® brand oils, balms, salves, creams, or conditioners


Lexol�® brand leather oils, creams or conditioners


Water and basic soap solutions


Saddle-Soap�® applied in any fashion whether it be bar or cream


Any type of commercial leather shoe or handbag "restorers" or "cleaners"


Gun, machine, or motor oils of any kind


Vaseline or petroleum jelly


Use of any of the commercially sold leather restorers other than Pecard's�® or basic Lanolin�® will result in permanent damage to the

leather fittings in the helmet. Although the products mentioned above advertise that they will not damage old leather, tests of these

substances on old leather shows that they accelerate deterioration by introducing oils that cause dry rot or wet rot in the cellular

structures of the old leather. Remember! If in doubt about how to restore old leather, simply leave the helmet as it was found and

apply no treatment whatsoever!





Johnny Peppers is offline  
Unread 07-12-2001, 02:41 PM   #2
Marvin
User
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Upstate S.C.
Posts: 1,132
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Default Re: Leather preservation

Johnny,


Good post on the treating of leather. Even though the post says not to use Lexol, this is what I use VERY sparingly on a holster and only one application. One of the reasons the Lexol is not recommended is that is contains water in the solution. I contacted Lexol a couple of years ago and they did say that Pecards was a good product, but of course, they said theirs was better. Their theory was that the water in Lexol would evaporate quickly from the surface and not actually penetrate deep into the leather. This seemed to make sense to me as the holster was made to be out in the weather and get wet from time to time. I wonder if the small amount of water is bad for the leather?


This seems to be a subject that no one, even the experts, cannot agree upon. I feel that one of the the most important items with either Pecards or Lexol is to use it sparingly and don't over-do it. If you do use too much the leather will become soaked and then be soft rather that the hardshell.


Marvin



Marvin is offline  
Unread 07-12-2001, 02:58 PM   #3
John Sabato
Lifer
Lifetime Forum
Patron
 
John Sabato's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: The Capital of the Free World
Posts: 10,153
Thanks: 3,003
Thanked 2,304 Times in 1,096 Posts
Default Great Info Johnny P. - thanks!

Could you please also identify the website where you got this information?


-JS



John Sabato is offline  
Unread 07-12-2001, 03:56 PM   #4
Johnny Peppers
User
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Calion, Arkansas
Posts: 1,042
Thanks: 0
Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post
Default Re: Great Info Johnny P. - thanks!

John,

Will have to try and find it again. Will post it if I can "re-find" it.



Johnny Peppers is offline  
Unread 07-12-2001, 04:23 PM   #5
Johnny Peppers
User
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Calion, Arkansas
Posts: 1,042
Thanks: 0
Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post
Default Re: Great Info Johnny P. - thanks!

John,

Try this: http://www.german-helmets.com/



Johnny Peppers is offline  
Unread 07-12-2001, 11:36 PM   #6
mac
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default Re: Leather preservation

I have corresponded with museum conservators and researchers for several years and have not yet been able to locate the oft-mentioned endorsement from the Smithsonian Institution concerning Pecards. It would be extremely odd for a large museum staffed with researchers and conservators to endorse a commercial product for antique leather preservation, particularly one that is designed as a water-resistant treatment but anything is possible. I can not locate the claim on the Pecard's home page nor has anyone responded in support of such a claim from the Smithsonian. I have been searching for the origin of this claim for years and hope you can tell me where it comes from. Who do I contact at The SI to confirm this?


To date, I have been discouraging the use of this grease (it consists of petroleum high melting temp waxes/greases and not animal or plant oils as noted on the P's web site) because of the darkening and permanent stickiness it causes and because no positive benefits are known for its use on valuable old leather. It fills voids left by oil/moisture lost through age or due to inadequate humidity--the same effect can be had by proper care without the use of grease.


I strongly discourage the use of treatments of any type unless you are aware of research supporting its benefits and know of the long-term consequences of treatment. Too much informal "gun show" advice is irreversibly detrimental to the preservation of historic artifacts and the value of your personal collections.


I recommend reading about conservation at the American Institute for Conservation of Historic and Artistic Works


http://aic.stanford.edu/treasure/objects.html


The advice they provide regarding your treasures is grounded in research and expert knowledge rather than folk belief. I am not disparaging anyone here only requesting confirmation of an often-heard claim about the Smithsonian and a commercial product and urging utmost caution in treating these irreplacable old holsters.


Good luck preserving your valuables!


David



 
Unread 07-13-2001, 07:19 AM   #7
Mark McMorrow
User
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: NE USA
Posts: 28
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Default Re: Leather preservation

Interesting info. I merely touched upon leather treatment in my guideline on antique sword conservation - but I agree, the best product is Pecard's.


Mark McMorrow





Antique Sword Conservation
Mark McMorrow is offline  
Unread 07-13-2001, 08:13 AM   #8
Johnny Peppers
User
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Calion, Arkansas
Posts: 1,042
Thanks: 0
Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post
Default Re: Leather preservation

Marvin,

Just my opinion, but I would think the Lexol would work best on leather that still has a hard finish. Leather that has the original hard finish worn off would act like a sponge for the water in the Lexol.



Johnny Peppers is offline  
Unread 07-13-2001, 09:02 AM   #9
Marvin
User
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Upstate S.C.
Posts: 1,132
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Default Re: Leather preservation

Johnny,


YES, this is the only time I would use the Lexol is on the original finish. Again, you are correct in my opinion that it does NOT work well on a scuffed or worn finish. I have read good and bad opinions on all the leather conditioners. I wish there was a definitive answer to what we do.


My holsters are lightly wiped to remove any dust dirt, etc. and then a VERY light coat of Lexol is put on, let fry for about 1-2 hours, and then LIGHTLY buff with a soft, clean cloth. Then, before storage, I put bubble wrap inside the holster and a 1/4" dia roll of bubble wrap inside the belt loops. Then the holster is stored inside a shipping box and stacked in my humidy controled vault. I never store a weapon in the holster. In the 8-9 years, all my holsters are still in perfect condition with no signs of deterioration. I have heard some folks say to re-apply a conditioner on a yearly basis, but I have never done this and mine are fine. The other school of thought is to do nothing to the leather. I don't know if this is right or not, but since the leather was once a living tissue, I feel that some type moisture replacement like the Lexol or Pecards will help preserve the leather. But, the holster still must be controlled from the elements like high humidity and the worst enemy is the sun.


Marvin



Marvin is offline  
 


Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is Off
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 04:20 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright © 1998 - 2024, Lugerforum.com