S/42 Load Hornady 124 gr XTP with VV340

[B40]

After searching far and wide, I have not been able to find any load data for Hornady 124gr XTP using VV340. Gun is a 1938 S/42. Particularly interested in minimum load to start with and then what seems to work best. COL looks like a key factor as those under 1.100" don't seem to feed well. Can anyone help?

[rhuff]

I can't help you first hand with that powder or bullet, but I do load for my Lugers(7.65 Para, and 9mm). In my Lugers, they function the best with as long of an OAL as I can get away with in the chamber and magazine. Also with FMJRN bullets. Perhaps someone will be along with help as to that powder/bullet combo.

[mrerick]

Hi,

ADI Publishes a Vitavouri equivalent powder table at:

http://www.adi-limited.com/handloade...quivalents.asp

You might find equivalent loads for the alternate powders.

Marc

[B40]

Thanks, Marc. I'll see where that takes me. Talked with Hodgdon, which imports VV powder, and with Hornady this AM. The conclusion from these chats is that Hornady's FMJ/FP and XTP are essentially the same bullets, so VihtaVouri's published starting load (or something less) for FMJ/FP is a good place to start the workup of a load.
Dick

[rhuff]

I must apologize for my ignorance of this powder, and did not realize that VV340 is the same powder as N340(according to the chart posted by mrerick). If this is correct, then I can help you out.

Lyman's 49th Edition

9mm Luger
125gr Jacketed Hollow Point
OAL 1.075
N340 Starting load 4.0gr Vel 937fps 21,000 C.P.U. pressure
Max load 4.6gr Vel1060fps 31.000 C.P.U. pressure.

[B40]

Great! Many thanks for the information. You mentioned earlier that you keep OAL up for good feeding. I haven't a lot of experience with OAL 1.075, but what I have had exhibited some feeding problems at that length.

The VihtaVouri N340 published load for 124gr FMJ/FP (supposedly the "same" bullet) at OAL 1.142 starts at 5.3 gr and goes to a max of 5.7 gr with published speeds of 1139 fps to 1214 fps.

I have shot 115 gr XTP ahead of N340 5.2 gr at OAL 1.142 and speed of 1198 fps with no problem.

Given the age of this pistol, it would seem that starting at 4.0 and OAL of 1.100 would be safe and conservative. Make sense?
Dick

[mrerick]

Some of the jacketed hollow point bullets are shaled a bit like the truncated cone bullets that Lugers were designed for. The Lyman 1.075 OAL is, in fact, what I used recently with some Lead Truncated Cone shaped wad cutters I bought recently. They seem to be working quite well. I loaded these with Hodgen TiteGroup, so my powder data wouldn't help you.

I've been told that the Mauser era metallurgy resulted in stronger steel than what was used in WW-I pistols. I don't know if this is true, or where facts can be found on this.

I generally am pretty conservative when working up a new load, regardless of the pistol.

Marc

[B40]

Thanks, Marc. I'll load some per the Lyman data at 1.075 and see if it feeds well. Will keep you posted.
Dick

[rhuff]

I think that if your chamber/leade, and mags will tolerate 1.160-1.175 OAL, then you should be in the zone. I am sure that you know that Lugers do not like real soft loads, so if you are going to start with the starting load from Lymans, I would only load 10 or so rounds, so you don't have a bunch to disassemble for the components. Most of my Lugers want the loads to be near the upper end for reliable functioning. Of course, that depends on what springs are in you guns. Good luck, and keep us informed.

[Sieger]

Originally Posted by rhuff

I think that if your chamber/leade, and mags will tolerate 1.060-1.075 OAL, then you should be in the zone. I am sure that you know that Lugers do not like real soft loads, so if you are going to start with the starting load from Lymans, I would only load 10 or so rounds, so you don't have a bunch to disassemble for the components. Most of my Lugers want the loads to be near the upper end for reliable functioning. Of course, that depends on what springs are in you guns. Good luck, and keep us informed.

Hi:

To find the correct OAL for that particular bullet, search my name and find the thread on finding correct OAL for a new bullet type. This will eliminate your guess work on proper OAL, which is a major cause of Luger malfunctions.

The original WWI 9mm Luger load was a 123 gr. truncated cone bullet traveling at 1,076 fps from a 4 inch barreled pistol. With modern, medium slow powders like SR 4756 or Power Pistol, you will find very accurate and reliable loads in this exact same range. Search my name for several really excellent loads for the 4 inch Lugers using 124 gr. bullets and the aforementioned powders.

By the way, the original 9mm truncated cone load's OAL was at 29 mm (approximately 1.14 inches), round nose bullets were loaded to 29.8 mm (approximately 1.173 inches) so don't feel strange when loading "long" bullets in your Luger. Again, correct and precise OAL is necessary for proper Luger function.

The rule that will get you a functional and accurate load is to start slow and work up. Without this process, again, you will simply be guessing, and will probably become quite frustrated.

Of major importantance is the condtion of the recoil spring in your particular Luger. Again, when the springs are out of spec, don't expect a Luger to function properly.

I hope this was helpful.

Sieger

[B40]

Loaded and fired the Lyman load of 4.0 gr at 1.075 and 4.2 gr at 1.100. Neither cycled the action sufficiently to eject cleanly and allow feeding of the next round. Will continue up slowly with N340 and also try the VihatVouri recommended N340 starting load for FMJ/FP of 5.3 gr at 1.142 OAL. Thanks to you all for your advice and to Sieger for the comment on SR4756, which may be the ultimate winner.

[rhuff]

Sounds like you are doing the normal "reloader thing" with starting low and move up the load scale/OAL until you get to a functioning/accurate load. That is just what we do, but when you throw in a Luger that is normally picky on ammo, you have an even harder job. Sounds like you are approaching the problems with vim and vigor....Good luck.

[Sieger]

Originally Posted by B40

Loaded and fired the Lyman load of 4.0 gr at 1.075 and 4.2 gr at 1.100. Neither cycled the action sufficiently to eject cleanly and allow feeding of the next round. Will continue up slowly with N340 and also try the VihatVouri recommended N340 starting load for FMJ/FP of 5.3 gr at 1.142 OAL. Thanks to you all for your advice and to Sieger for the comment on SR4756, which may be the ultimate winner.

Hi:

The longer 1.142 sounds like a good place to start (always start too long and shorten 0.01 as needed for proper function).

Your N340 (VV) falls right between HS-6 and SR 4756 in buring rate, so it should be just fine. To shorten up your development time, start low and build up in 0.1 grain increments. Load and fire only one of each weight until the hold open works. You then have found the relative range.

With your N340, I'd start at about 4.5 or so. Chances are your most accurate load will be somewhere between 5.0 and 5.5 (my best experienced guess).

Good luck!

Sieger