Simson or not

Walt NW · 07-26-2005, 06:32 PM

Local pawn shop has a quite nice 1918 DMW, about 95% finish and matched througout except the mag and the barrel which is a definate replacement. Only marking on the barrel is the "s" within a circle which appears to be a Simson mark. Because of this, the owner is claiming it as a Simson rework and asking a Simson price. I could be way off base on this, but it has been my belief that Simson reworks were appropriately stamped on several more areas than a single replaced part. Am I correct on this, and if so, any ideas where the circled "S" could have come from?

policeluger · 07-26-2005, 07:37 PM

Not what I would recognize as Simson, should be E/ and various numbers are possible...6/33/67 and so on....would be curious to find more info.

Herb · 07-26-2005, 07:47 PM

Walt, it is in fact a Simson rework proof. Per Constanzo, page 190...
Early Simson rework proof of DWM and Eurfurt usually found on the left reciever. This proof was used to indicate repair and rework of the pistol. Most of these models were reworked for police use and may be found dated 1910-1918, no date or double date. Locations noted: Left barrel chamber, left breech block, right barrel, top of barrel....
In my opinion if it's not a Simson it's not worth a Simson price, a DWM on the toggle doesn't command that kind of money.

policeluger · 07-26-2005, 08:25 PM

Thanks Herb!

Walt NW · 07-26-2005, 09:12 PM

Thanks much, guys,
I thought as much but needed confirmation from the pros. Much appreciation. He's willing to "negotiate", but for a 1918 DMW with a "what is it" barrel, we'll leave it sitting in his display case.
Walt

Dwight Gruber · 07-26-2005, 11:47 PM

Walt,

It sounds like you have made a good decision on the Luger.

For the record, the circle-S is a subject of some controversy. Experienced and respected collectors assert that this mark is indicative of Simson rework; others, equally respectable and experienced, note that there is no documentary evidence for this interpretation and that its meaning must ultimately be considered unknown.

--Dwight

07-26-2005, 06:32 PM	#1
Walt NW User Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: New Caney, Texas Posts: 90 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Simson or not Local pawn shop has a quite nice 1918 DMW, about 95% finish and matched througout except the mag and the barrel which is a definate replacement. Only marking on the barrel is the "s" within a circle which appears to be a Simson mark. Because of this, the owner is claiming it as a Simson rework and asking a Simson price. I could be way off base on this, but it has been my belief that Simson reworks were appropriately stamped on several more areas than a single replaced part. Am I correct on this, and if so, any ideas where the circled "S" could have come from?

07-26-2005, 07:47 PM	#3
Herb User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Utah, in the land of the Sleeping Rainbow Posts: 1,457 Thanks: 0 Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post	Walt, it is in fact a Simson rework proof. Per Constanzo, page 190... Early Simson rework proof of DWM and Eurfurt usually found on the left reciever. This proof was used to indicate repair and rework of the pistol. Most of these models were reworked for police use and may be found dated 1910-1918, no date or double date. Locations noted: Left barrel chamber, left breech block, right barrel, top of barrel.... In my opinion if it's not a Simson it's not worth a Simson price, a DWM on the toggle doesn't command that kind of money. __________________ Utah, where gun control means a steady trigger pull

07-26-2005, 07:37 PM	#2
policeluger RIP Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Ca. Posts: 2,141 Thanks: 8 Thanked 89 Times in 54 Posts	Not what I would recognize as Simson, should be E/ and various numbers are possible...6/33/67 and so on....would be curious to find more info.

07-26-2005, 08:25 PM	#4
policeluger RIP Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Ca. Posts: 2,141 Thanks: 8 Thanked 89 Times in 54 Posts	Thanks Herb!

07-26-2005, 09:12 PM	#5
Walt NW User Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: New Caney, Texas Posts: 90 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Thanks much, guys, I thought as much but needed confirmation from the pros. Much appreciation. He's willing to "negotiate", but for a 1918 DMW with a "what is it" barrel, we'll leave it sitting in his display case. Walt

07-26-2005, 11:47 PM	#6
Dwight Gruber User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Portland, Oregon Posts: 3,890 Thanks: 0 Thanked 1,282 Times in 424 Posts	Walt, It sounds like you have made a good decision on the Luger. For the record, the circle-S is a subject of some controversy. Experienced and respected collectors assert that this mark is indicative of Simson rework; others, equally respectable and experienced, note that there is no documentary evidence for this interpretation and that its meaning must ultimately be considered unknown. --Dwight