First Luger! 1936 s/42 and some questions

Valfodur · 03-20-2014, 10:07 AM

Hi everybody!

I've been lurking on this forum for a little while as my "need" to buy my first luger grew. So far I'm seriously impressed with all the people on here and I look forward to learning more as my luger collection surely grows. "Can't have just one"

I may have overpaid for my 1936 S/42, but my impatience got the best of me and I'm more than happy with it. Its all matching as far as I can tell. The bore is minty and the finish seems solid. One thing that surprised me is in all the pictures Lugers look 'black' however in real life they are a beautiful shade of blueish gray. Very attractive color.

So onto my questions. There is small dots of rust on gun, under the finish in some cases as I'll show in pictures below. It's only really visible if you have a light coming at it from an angle. What is the best method for keeping the rust contained? I don't want to 0000 steel wool it because it'll likely remove the pretty blue finish.

Also, what is the best oil to use to preserve these old boys? Any tips for storage? (I've read of people using de-humidifiers in their gun safes, any links for these?)

Thank you everyone!
Matt

PS - How does one PM? I've seen that mentioned but I don't see a way to do it.

DavidJayUden · 03-20-2014, 10:23 AM

Matt:
Looks like a nice gun as-is, and I too would be reluctant to use any steel wool, although some do recommend it. I'd say to oil a course cloth, run the offending areas, and call it a day understanding that those spots developed over years, and are not going away.
Any 3-in-one oil will work, as will any gun oil. Don't soak the grips but keep the rest lightly lubed. Most here say to not store in the holster.
If you click on the name of a member, it will give you the option of sending a personal message.
dju

jamese · 03-21-2014, 04:15 AM

Matt,

I never "overpaid" for any of my Lugers, however I have aquired a couple at the wrong time. Those overpriced Lugers I got a few years ago would be a great buy today.

Sergio Natali · 03-21-2014, 05:29 AM

Matt

First of all welcome to this forum.

I agree with what David wrote, I've never used any steel wool of any kind on my guns, especially on my collectibles; I've always preferred to use Ballistol and a rough, harsh in texture cloth for a few times.
Sometimes it just takes a bit of patience and a lot of love for these beautiful guns.

Congratulations again, nice Luger.

alanint · 03-21-2014, 05:54 AM

A simple nylon toothbrush sprayed with oil will help remove much of this without hurting the finish. Another option is a brass brush used VERY gently around raised rust spots, then cleaned off.

Edward Tinker · 03-21-2014, 07:36 AM

We love to answer questions - but take a look at the top of the forums - where all the postings are (threads) - you will see what are called stickies - it has lots of help in the how to section - new collector section - FAQ area - and many questions like how to PM - click on a persons name and then options will appear - personal message - if the person isn't some kind of paranoid, then email will be there - does not show your email, but it will show it to whomever emailed you. talking to an expert is nice, but the forum is here for most questions (you would not beleive how many PM's me and other other mods get and many times I refer them HERE to the experts)

Curly1 · 03-21-2014, 08:11 AM

Welcome to the forum, nice first luger.

Take a look at this product.

I have used it on surface rust with no problems.

http://www.exploreproducts.com/big45...un-cleaner.htm

John Sabato · 03-21-2014, 08:27 AM

Also, You check can your own Private Messages at the link at the top right of every page...

...and you guys need to watch out or the spelling police will nab you.

Course, as in "course cloth", is actually spelled "C O A R S E"... the other spelling is as used in "college course" as most of you evidently skipped a lot of classes in Spelling 101.

alanint · 03-21-2014, 09:12 AM

To further improve the look of your pistol, also remove the shiny varnish from the grips and then treat them with Lindseed Oil or other period finish.

Valfodur · 03-21-2014, 10:47 PM

Thank you for all the responses! I'll definitely have the try some of the products listed. I'm especially curious about the Big 45 Frontier pad. And I'll try the toothbrush tomorrow. This is my first truly collectible firearm... I'm still nervous touching it like it's going to somehow instantly sprout rust!

I'm fascinated at how well crafted and intricate all the parts are. I can't wait to add to this new collection. I'm sure I'll have more questions down the road

mrerick · 03-22-2014, 06:14 AM

Properly done, well oiled 0000 fine steel wool or oiled bronze wool will not damage the blued finish if you use it correctly.

The issue is relative hardness.

The dark blue-black magnetite form of iron oxide is very hard and dense compared to the red oxide rust form of iron oxide. While the magnetite is hard, and rust is soft, the thickness of bluing is only about 2 to 2 1/2 microns. it's a surface conversion of the steel.

Spots of rust will eventually form pitting through the metal surface. That's why you don't want it growing. That said, it's normal to find the red form of iron oxide visible in the surface of a 75 year old firearm. In fact, if you don't see it you suspect a refinish.

Steel wool is as hard as the in the white steel in the gun, give or take a bit for the different alloys involved. It is harder than the rust iron oxide, and softer than the blue-black magnetite. That's why it can be used to remove the rust without damaging the blued finish.

The key is to not be too aggressive in the process.

If you want to try it, find a non-visible area under the grips and start out well oiled and gentle.

Using a cloth that is oiled would also work, but require more rubbing, possibly generate heat in the process and possibly cause abrasion marks if it's got any grit or dirt in it.

In the materials world, hard cuts soft - not the other way around!

alvin · 03-22-2014, 06:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Valfodur

So onto my questions. There is small dots of rust on gun, under the finish in some cases as I'll show in pictures below. It's only really visible if you have a light coming at it from an angle. What is the best method for keeping the rust contained?

It took a while to convert attitude towards those dots. In the longer run, collectors found them very comfortable on those dots. That's a sign of old finish. On human hands, it's common to see some darker dots on skin,,,, of course, that's very unusual on kid's skin, but gradually becoming common when people grew older and older. Same for the blue finish. Those dark dots under the finish... it's a natural sign of old age. Better keep it as is.

]]

Probably everything has an exception. Some guns were well preserved, so almost free of those dots. Still use human skin as an analog -- just like some women started taking care of skin at their very young age, then, at same age, skin is much better preserved. Same for the gun. Some guns were collected by people many years ago, and were well taken care of, well preserved.

Valfodur · 03-22-2014, 09:23 AM

That's an awesome analogy Alvin! My whole goal is to be able to pass down some pretty incredible heirlooms like my father did for me. Though I'm much more of a gun nut than he is. I just want to keep these in the best condition possible. I'm glad to hear collectibility isn't necessarily hurt by the subtle 'red iron oxide'. I agree that it looks kind of cool - and adds confidence to it being the original finish.

03-20-2014, 10:07 AM	#1
Valfodur User Join Date: Feb 2014 Posts: 5 Thanks: 5 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	First Luger! 1936 s/42 and some questions Hi everybody! I've been lurking on this forum for a little while as my "need" to buy my first luger grew. So far I'm seriously impressed with all the people on here and I look forward to learning more as my luger collection surely grows. "Can't have just one" I may have overpaid for my 1936 S/42, but my impatience got the best of me and I'm more than happy with it. Its all matching as far as I can tell. The bore is minty and the finish seems solid. One thing that surprised me is in all the pictures Lugers look 'black' however in real life they are a beautiful shade of blueish gray. Very attractive color. So onto my questions. There is small dots of rust on gun, under the finish in some cases as I'll show in pictures below. It's only really visible if you have a light coming at it from an angle. What is the best method for keeping the rust contained? I don't want to 0000 steel wool it because it'll likely remove the pretty blue finish. Also, what is the best oil to use to preserve these old boys? Any tips for storage? (I've read of people using de-humidifiers in their gun safes, any links for these?) Thank you everyone! Matt PS - How does one PM? I've seen that mentioned but I don't see a way to do it. Attached Thumbnails

03-21-2014, 04:15 AM	#3
jamese User Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: South Florida Posts: 789 Thanks: 0 Thanked 84 Times in 34 Posts	Overpaid Matt, I never "overpaid" for any of my Lugers, however I have aquired a couple at the wrong time. Those overpriced Lugers I got a few years ago would be a great buy today. __________________ The "truth" is a matter of Perception

03-21-2014, 05:29 AM	#4
Sergio Natali User Join Date: Feb 2013 Location: Somewhere in Northern Italy Posts: 2,646 Thanks: 1,082 Thanked 1,783 Times in 1,007 Posts	Matt First of all welcome to this forum. I agree with what David wrote, I've never used any steel wool of any kind on my guns, especially on my collectibles; I've always preferred to use Ballistol and a rough, harsh in texture cloth for a few times. Sometimes it just takes a bit of patience and a lot of love for these beautiful guns. Congratulations again, nice Luger. __________________ "Originality can't be restored and should be at the top of any collector's priority list. Last edited by Sergio Natali; 03-21-2014 at 10:32 AM. Reason: mispelling sorry "me-no-English" :-)

03-21-2014, 07:36 AM	#6
Edward Tinker Super Moderator Eternal Lifer LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: North of Spokane, WA Posts: 15,916 Thanks: 1,992 Thanked 4,506 Times in 2,080 Posts	We love to answer questions - but take a look at the top of the forums - where all the postings are (threads) - you will see what are called stickies - it has lots of help in the how to section - new collector section - FAQ area - and many questions like how to PM - click on a persons name and then options will appear - personal message - if the person isn't some kind of paranoid, then email will be there - does not show your email, but it will show it to whomever emailed you. talking to an expert is nice, but the forum is here for most questions (you would not beleive how many PM's me and other other mods get and many times I refer them HERE to the experts) __________________ Edward Tinker ************ Co-Author of Police Lugers - Co-Author of Simson Lugers Author of Veteran Bring Backs Vol I, Vol II, Vol III and Vol IV

03-21-2014, 08:11 AM	#7
Curly1 User Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: Upstate New York Posts: 1,230 Thanks: 113 Thanked 703 Times in 365 Posts	Welcome to the forum, nice first luger. Take a look at this product. I have used it on surface rust with no problems. http://www.exploreproducts.com/big45...un-cleaner.htm __________________ Laugh hard and often. Gary

03-20-2014, 10:23 AM	#2
DavidJayUden Patron LugerForum Patron Join Date: Nov 2008 Posts: 4,047 Thanks: 578 Thanked 1,414 Times in 887 Posts	Matt: Looks like a nice gun as-is, and I too would be reluctant to use any steel wool, although some do recommend it. I'd say to oil a course cloth, run the offending areas, and call it a day understanding that those spots developed over years, and are not going away. Any 3-in-one oil will work, as will any gun oil. Don't soak the grips but keep the rest lightly lubed. Most here say to not store in the holster. If you click on the name of a member, it will give you the option of sending a personal message. dju

03-21-2014, 05:54 AM	#5
alanint User Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Marco Island, Florida Posts: 4,867 Thanks: 1,685 Thanked 1,916 Times in 1,192 Posts	A simple nylon toothbrush sprayed with oil will help remove much of this without hurting the finish. Another option is a brass brush used VERY gently around raised rust spots, then cleaned off.

03-21-2014, 08:27 AM	#8
John Sabato Lifer Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: The Capital of the Free World Posts: 10,152 Thanks: 3,003 Thanked 2,304 Times in 1,096 Posts	Also, You check can your own Private Messages at the link at the top right of every page... ...and you guys need to watch out or the spelling police will nab you. Course, as in "course cloth", is actually spelled "C O A R S E"... the other spelling is as used in "college course" as most of you evidently skipped a lot of classes in Spelling 101. __________________ regards, -John S "...We hold these truths to be self-evident that ALL men are created EQUAL *and are endowed by their Creator* with certain UNALIENABLE* rights, and among these are life, LIBERTY, and the pursuit of happiness..."*

03-21-2014, 09:12 AM	#9
alanint User Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Marco Island, Florida Posts: 4,867 Thanks: 1,685 Thanked 1,916 Times in 1,192 Posts	To further improve the look of your pistol, also remove the shiny varnish from the grips and then treat them with Lindseed Oil or other period finish.

03-21-2014, 10:47 PM	#10
Valfodur User Join Date: Feb 2014 Posts: 5 Thanks: 5 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Thank you for all the responses! I'll definitely have the try some of the products listed. I'm especially curious about the Big 45 Frontier pad. And I'll try the toothbrush tomorrow. This is my first truly collectible firearm... I'm still nervous touching it like it's going to somehow instantly sprout rust! I'm fascinated at how well crafted and intricate all the parts are. I can't wait to add to this new collection. I'm sure I'll have more questions down the road

03-22-2014, 06:14 AM	#11
mrerick Super Moderator - Patron LugerForum Life Patron Join Date: Dec 2009 Location: Eastern North Carolina, USA Posts: 3,900 Thanks: 1,372 Thanked 3,094 Times in 1,503 Posts	Properly done, well oiled 0000 fine steel wool or oiled bronze wool will not damage the blued finish if you use it correctly. The issue is relative hardness. The dark blue-black magnetite form of iron oxide is very hard and dense compared to the red oxide rust form of iron oxide. While the magnetite is hard, and rust is soft, the thickness of bluing is only about 2 to 2 1/2 microns. it's a surface conversion of the steel. Spots of rust will eventually form pitting through the metal surface. That's why you don't want it growing. That said, it's normal to find the red form of iron oxide visible in the surface of a 75 year old firearm. In fact, if you don't see it you suspect a refinish. Steel wool is as hard as the in the white steel in the gun, give or take a bit for the different alloys involved. It is harder than the rust iron oxide, and softer than the blue-black magnetite. That's why it can be used to remove the rust without damaging the blued finish. The key is to not be too aggressive in the process. If you want to try it, find a non-visible area under the grips and start out well oiled and gentle. Using a cloth that is oiled would also work, but require more rubbing, possibly generate heat in the process and possibly cause abrasion marks if it's got any grit or dirt in it. In the materials world, hard cuts soft - not the other way around! __________________ Igitur si vis pacem, para bellum - - Therefore if you want peace, prepare for war.

03-22-2014, 09:23 AM	#13
Valfodur User Join Date: Feb 2014 Posts: 5 Thanks: 5 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	That's an awesome analogy Alvin! My whole goal is to be able to pass down some pretty incredible heirlooms like my father did for me. Though I'm much more of a gun nut than he is. I just want to keep these in the best condition possible. I'm glad to hear collectibility isn't necessarily hurt by the subtle 'red iron oxide'. I agree that it looks kind of cool - and adds confidence to it being the original finish.