WTK German Ortgies...

[minigun]

Hello,
I can't seem to find any reference to this little gun. It is an "Ortgies" 6.35 cal. .25 cal I assume. Any info out there? Thanks in advance. <img border="0" alt="[jumper]" title="" src="graemlins/jumper.gif" />

[minigun]

Hello,
Where do I start finding the info? I guess just the basics, what yrs. it was manufactured, civilian or military use weapon and (or) just general info on the pistol.

I'm sorry, I'm just really computer challenged and when I do a search, I keep coming up with weird things that don't have anything to do with this gun. Thanks

[Ron Smith]

Tac, How is Ortgies pronounced. With hard or soft G. ORT-GEES? or ORT-JEES? I've heard OR-TEG-IES, also.
Ron

[Edward Tinker]

Kelly, let me give you some tips on searching (and I don't always find what the hell I am after either).

1. Do a complete name search, i.e. luger pistol 9mm erfurt artillery

This will bring up any pages with all of those words.

Adding " and " front and back will make the search look for those words in that order, I never find this very useful, but a good option if looking for exact matches.

2. Use different words / and/or combination of words, such as

parabellum pistol 7.65 mm or luger handgun germany etc. Using different combinations will get you different things. Sometimes writers will put pistol, sometimes revolver, handgun, etc., and those pages won't pop up unless the search engine sees those words on the pages.

Even tho there are literally millions of pages of web pages in the USA, it all depends on if they are searchable, have the right words etc., or the searchable words are not on say the first page that the search engine looks for. That is why sometimes you will never see a certain webpage, but then somehow you come across it later!

Ed

[Aaron]

The "g" in Ortgies is pronounced like the g in "gigabyte", not like the g in "giant".

[Fritzer]

This page has some nice photo's of the Deutsche Werke version.

http://www.gunsworld.com/gun_pistols/ortgies_us.html

There were also a couple of diagrams at these sites as well...
http://tinyurl.com/2uwt2
http://tinyurl.com/2qee7
http://tinyurl.com/2vtwy

Kinda neat little fella, what were the significant details that Heinrich patented?

Regards,
Fritz.

[Lloyd in Nevada]

These are great little pistols exhibiting a high degree of fit and finish and they are real fun to shoot. The .32 and .380 are very accurate and mine have both digested several different ammo makes without any problem. The .25 caliber is less accurate and is more a "stick it up their nose" type pistol. Some say these pistols were used by our own OSS (spies) in WWII but I have never been able to verify or confirm this.

I have had a .25 (6.35mm) and .32 (7.65mm) models for years and finally found a .380 (9mm short) model a few months ago. It came in a period high quality German made excellent condition brown leather holster with extra magazine. Mine (top pistol in the photo) is the .380 without the manual safety catch. If you can find one of the .380 models with the manual safety above the left grip and the grips held with a screw GRAB IT they are very scarce!

These are very tricky pistols to disassemble and then reassemble until you know the secret. The firing pin, spring and follower (looks like a short 1/2" blunt tipped nail) are retained inside the slide in a very small semicircular lateral groove. I hold the slide in my left hand upside down using my pointing finger (left hand) to hold the follower down (it has a tendency to jump up at the front) while pushing the back of the follower into position with my right hand. Make sure this groove is clean and dry. I usually use a wood handled cotton tipped swab and push the follower in until the rim of the follower catches or engages the before mentioned groove. I use this wood handle cotton swab because I can feel the engagement and catch of the groove a lot easier than with a screwdriver. You then MUST BE very careful as you mate the frame and slide back together or the spring loaded follower will come out very quickly--do this in a room where you can find the spring and follower because it happens very easily especially the firt time you try it. I have learned to keep my left hand over the back of the slide to stop the follower and spring from flying out the back if it separates from the groove before slide and frame are back in position. If you loose these parts they can be purchased from GPC--I know I have had to purchase a couple from losing a follower and spring a few years ago. Anyway, I hope you enjoy the pictures of my Ortgies .

[lugerholsterrepair]

LLoyd, Nice! Would love to see the holster...Jerry Burney

[Lloyd in Nevada]

Jerry,

Thanks for your input and interest. Here are some pictures of the holster that came with the .380 Ortgies Pistol. It is NOT German Army acceptance stamped. It does bear a maker mark and inside the holster on the back is a purple inked marking. Any information you can provide about the hoslter will be greatly appreciated!

[Ron Smith]

Lloyd, I believe the ink stamp is an army clothing and/or supply depot, 12th Army acceptance stamp.? Nice pistols and holster! I'd offer you a trade,but my Bill Clinton Action Figure is writing a book.

Ron

[Russ]

I bought one of these today. A very interesting gun.

Russ

[RockinWR]

Lloyd,
* Suspect you may already know the following as this subject has been discussed before under "L.Z.A. marking" here on the Forum.
* Following are excerpts taken from an 8/99 AutoMag article written by J.Cates/M.Krause:
(1) L.Z.St. = Leder-Zuweisungs-Stelle = Leather Allocation place(district office).
(2) J = I = Inspection
(3) Fbg. = "It could be that the Fbg. seen on some holsters.....is not the abbreviation of Freiburg [near Karlsrule (BA district XIV)]; but, of Freiberg, a town in Saxony near Dresden (BA district XII)".
(4) "The job of the BA's were to procure equipment and to supply the equipment to the troops; but, it was probably not the job of the BA to ration and to supply leather to the producers and grant orders for the delivery of their products. That was the job of the L.Z.'s...handling contract orders for the Army to commercial manufacturers of leather goods(in contrast to the Army owned & operated workshops such as the AWM artillery workshop in Munich and AWSp artillery workshop in Spandau)".
(5) "L.Z.'s were established in 1914".
* OBTW: I know little about these pistols, beyond the above; but, a local full line Gun Store in the neighborhood has two nice ones, as I recall, for sale. Guns only: one in 6.35mm; the other in 7.65mm Cal. If anyone is looking seriously for one, drop me a PM & I'll forward you the store's name, address, phone#'s, contact, etc.
Respectfully,
Bob

[Lugerdoc]

I too have all 3 calibers of the Ortgies pattern pistol available for sale. I know of no German military accepted Ortgies, but it's quite possible that an officer may have purchased and carried one after 1918 when they first came on the market; so too late for the WW1 holster show. I believe that it is rather for a M1914 Mauser 7.65mm or Sauer M1913. TH