jammed luger

hoosiermike · 06-03-2013, 06:38 PM

Greetings. I just purchased my first Luger. it is a all numbers matching DWM dated 1918. I fired it today for the first time. The first 2 rounds fired and ejected normally. The 3rd round fired but did not eject. When I went to retract the toggle, it would only come back approximately 1/2 the length of the 9x19 case. There it seems to hit a hard stop. I cannot retract the toggle further to eject the empty casing. Does anyone have any ideas? Thanks,
Mike

DavidJayUden · 06-03-2013, 06:45 PM

I dunno, but take the upper off the lower, then take out the rear toggle pin. It will all be open and certainly the problem will be obvious.
Check YouTube for disassembly videos if you are not certain.
dju

hoosiermike · 06-03-2013, 09:45 PM

I took your advice and field stripped it. The fired casing fell right out as expected. I could not see anything damaged or broken. I reassembled and work the toggle several times. Somewhere around pull 5 or 6 it locked up again. Same thing. The toggle would only come back somewhere around 3/8" and then a hard stop. I field stripped her and reassembled her again and no problems. I probably worked the action another 50 times without a problem. Im scratching my head. But at least I didnt find a broken part.

Edward Tinker · 06-03-2013, 10:14 PM

Is the safety lever loose? I.e. does it very easily go up and down?

mrerick · 06-03-2013, 10:31 PM

Is there any play along the toggle train (where the axles hold the toggle and breech block parts together)? This would be forward / backward play.

Is there any play in the hook that extends down from the rear toggle to the recoil spring lever?

What is the condition of the locking bolt in front above the trigger guard in the frame?

What is the condition of the bottom part of the front of the receiver that contacts the locking bolt?

Marc

John Sabato · 06-04-2013, 02:08 PM

On WW1 vintage Lugers, they may have an unmodified sear which would prevent the toggle from opening as you have described when the safety is on, which I presume you put the safety on when you attempted to clear the jam?

hoosiermike · 06-05-2013, 12:42 PM

Gentlemen, thank you again for all of the advice.

The safety is not loose and engages with a audible click.
There is no play anywhere in the toggle assembly.
All components inside the frame appear near new with very little sign of wear/use.
The only component with any play is the the little "tee bar" that hangs from the toggle and engages the frame. It swings freely but has side to side play.
Is that a problem? If so, how can it be corrected?

Thanks,
Mike

hoosiermike · 06-05-2013, 12:50 PM

Oh, I missed one. No i did not put the safety on to clear the original jam. When I was familiarizing myself with the gun before loading, i noted that the safety locked the toggle with a rising bar. I also knew I had a fired casing in the chamber. After dropping the mag, I considered it safe.

DavidJayUden · 06-05-2013, 01:17 PM

That piece that hangs down serves to catch the mainspring and really shouldn't show much side-side play. Also that is important in the reassembly process in that it needs to catch the hooks on the top of the spring to make it all work.
Now that the weapon is cleared, once reassembled, does it still catch on the rearward travel?

dju

glock30 · 06-05-2013, 08:26 PM

THese toggle link coupling can move a little side to side in my experience, but a little. Can the extractor spring might be a little worn? The beak of the extractor is solid? Wait, this sounds familiar, I have to think about this,

hoosiermike · 06-05-2013, 09:00 PM

Glock30, the extractor looks fine to me. Not broken or excessively worn.

David Jay, It has done it twice. First time was 3rd round fired right after I got it. Second time was after I field stripped it and reassembled. I worked the toggle several times and it locked again. I repeated the fieldstrip process and have not been able to duplicate the situation since. The side to side play is probably 1/32 of an inch or so off center both directions.

06-03-2013, 06:38 PM	#1
hoosiermike User Join Date: Jun 2013 Location: Southern Indiana Posts: 5 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	jammed luger Greetings. I just purchased my first Luger. it is a all numbers matching DWM dated 1918. I fired it today for the first time. The first 2 rounds fired and ejected normally. The 3rd round fired but did not eject. When I went to retract the toggle, it would only come back approximately 1/2 the length of the 9x19 case. There it seems to hit a hard stop. I cannot retract the toggle further to eject the empty casing. Does anyone have any ideas? Thanks, Mike

06-03-2013, 10:14 PM	#4
Edward Tinker Super Moderator Eternal Lifer LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: North of Spokane, WA Posts: 15,933 Thanks: 2,032 Thanked 4,530 Times in 2,092 Posts	Is the safety lever loose? I.e. does it very easily go up and down? __________________ Edward Tinker ************ Co-Author of Police Lugers - Co-Author of Simson Lugers Author of Veteran Bring Backs Vol I, Vol II, Vol III and Vol IV

06-03-2013, 10:31 PM	#5
mrerick Super Moderator - Patron LugerForum Life Patron Join Date: Dec 2009 Location: Eastern North Carolina, USA Posts: 3,909 Thanks: 1,374 Thanked 3,110 Times in 1,510 Posts	Is there any play along the toggle train (where the axles hold the toggle and breech block parts together)? This would be forward / backward play. Is there any play in the hook that extends down from the rear toggle to the recoil spring lever? What is the condition of the locking bolt in front above the trigger guard in the frame? What is the condition of the bottom part of the front of the receiver that contacts the locking bolt? Marc __________________ Igitur si vis pacem, para bellum - - Therefore if you want peace, prepare for war.

06-04-2013, 02:08 PM	#6
John Sabato Lifer Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: The Capital of the Free World Posts: 10,154 Thanks: 3,003 Thanked 2,306 Times in 1,097 Posts	On WW1 vintage Lugers, they may have an unmodified sear which would prevent the toggle from opening as you have described when the safety is on, which I presume you put the safety on when you attempted to clear the jam? __________________ regards, -John S "...We hold these truths to be self-evident that ALL men are created EQUAL *and are endowed by their Creator* with certain UNALIENABLE* rights, and among these are life, LIBERTY, and the pursuit of happiness..."*

06-05-2013, 08:26 PM	#10
glock30 User Join Date: Aug 2011 Location: Obama LAND Posts: 206 Thanks: 18 Thanked 17 Times in 14 Posts	THese toggle link coupling can move a little side to side in my experience, but a little. Can the extractor spring might be a little worn? The beak of the extractor is solid? Wait, this sounds familiar, I have to think about this, __________________ Mauser Parabellum 10.2098 !

06-03-2013, 06:45 PM	#2
DavidJayUden Patron LugerForum Patron Join Date: Nov 2008 Posts: 4,047 Thanks: 578 Thanked 1,414 Times in 887 Posts	I dunno, but take the upper off the lower, then take out the rear toggle pin. It will all be open and certainly the problem will be obvious. Check YouTube for disassembly videos if you are not certain. dju

06-03-2013, 09:45 PM	#3
hoosiermike User Join Date: Jun 2013 Location: Southern Indiana Posts: 5 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	I took your advice and field stripped it. The fired casing fell right out as expected. I could not see anything damaged or broken. I reassembled and work the toggle several times. Somewhere around pull 5 or 6 it locked up again. Same thing. The toggle would only come back somewhere around 3/8" and then a hard stop. I field stripped her and reassembled her again and no problems. I probably worked the action another 50 times without a problem. Im scratching my head. But at least I didnt find a broken part.

06-05-2013, 12:42 PM	#7
hoosiermike User Join Date: Jun 2013 Location: Southern Indiana Posts: 5 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Gentlemen, thank you again for all of the advice. The safety is not loose and engages with a audible click. There is no play anywhere in the toggle assembly. All components inside the frame appear near new with very little sign of wear/use. The only component with any play is the the little "tee bar" that hangs from the toggle and engages the frame. It swings freely but has side to side play. Is that a problem? If so, how can it be corrected? Thanks, Mike

06-05-2013, 12:50 PM	#8
hoosiermike User Join Date: Jun 2013 Location: Southern Indiana Posts: 5 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Oh, I missed one. No i did not put the safety on to clear the original jam. When I was familiarizing myself with the gun before loading, i noted that the safety locked the toggle with a rising bar. I also knew I had a fired casing in the chamber. After dropping the mag, I considered it safe.

06-05-2013, 01:17 PM	#9
DavidJayUden Patron LugerForum Patron Join Date: Nov 2008 Posts: 4,047 Thanks: 578 Thanked 1,414 Times in 887 Posts	That piece that hangs down serves to catch the mainspring and really shouldn't show much side-side play. Also that is important in the reassembly process in that it needs to catch the hooks on the top of the spring to make it all work. Now that the weapon is cleared, once reassembled, does it still catch on the rearward travel? dju

06-05-2013, 09:00 PM	#11
hoosiermike User Join Date: Jun 2013 Location: Southern Indiana Posts: 5 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Glock30, the extractor looks fine to me. Not broken or excessively worn. David Jay, It has done it twice. First time was 3rd round fired right after I got it. Second time was after I field stripped it and reassembled. I worked the toggle several times and it locked again. I repeated the fieldstrip process and have not been able to duplicate the situation since. The side to side play is probably 1/32 of an inch or so off center both directions.