What kind of rework is this?

cgilbert37 · 02-06-2005, 10:44 AM

I recently acquired an S/42 model from SOG. At first I was disappointed by the its' condition, but fell better after knowing it fires excellent.

It is obviously a rework but I am unclear if it belongs to the group done by the Nazis or after WWII. With all of my reasearch, I've been unable to find much information about the "official" Nazi Reworks and am hoping someone can assist me on this site.

Here is some info:
Frame Serial Number: 1709
Takedown lever, trigger, safety, and toggle (all three parts) all have the correct serial number (last two digits of frame): 09.
Barrel and receiver serial number: 7285 (I think). These numbers were crossed out with a "/\" and restamped with 1709. This was done in two places: on the receiver side and underneath the barrel.
The receiver has the year of manufacture: 1937.

Here is something interesting: the barrel seems to have a Mauser Rework proof mark on it.
There are three things not original:
Magazine- only holds seven rounds and has too much paint on the aluminium base to see if there are numbers there.
Grips- black plastic, obviously not original
Extractor/Sideplate- Seems to be from an older style model, as the takedown lever has slight interference; making it hard to pull the lever down. It is stamped 50 on the bottom.

Here are some pictures:
Receiver serial numbers:
http://pg.photos.yahoo.com/ph/cgilbe...f9.jpg&.src=ph

Bottom of barrel:
http://pg.photos.yahoo.com/ph/cgilbe...7f.jpg&.src=ph

Receiver proof marks:
http://pg.photos.yahoo.com/ph/cgilbe...0f.jpg&.src=ph

Barrel proof mark - is this indicative of a Mauser rework?
http://pg.photos.yahoo.com/ph/cgilbe...00.jpg&.src=ph
The barrel also has another mark that I am unable to determine.

The toggle:
http://pg.photos.yahoo.com/ph/cgilbe...00.jpg&.src=ph[img]

Even if this was a poor purchase, I have learned a lot already and am considering restoration- in an effort to learn even more.

Thanks!

Ron Smith · 02-06-2005, 11:32 AM

Hi Chris,

Welcome to the ward.

You have an S/42 Russian capture. Reworked by the Russians. The /\ is probably an incomplete poorly struck X. A Russian acceptance proof. SOG's Lugers are Russian imports. The Mauser proof on the barrel was put there as a barrel proof or acceptance mark during assembly.
If it's a good shooter, that's a plus. Some think that Russian reworks will become collectable in their own catagory eventually.

Ron

stantheboltactionman · 02-06-2005, 12:14 PM

Chris,
Welcome to the forum!!
I know I have posted not in favor of my SOG Luger experiance in the past.
My SOG luger just had too many problems for me personally.
This is a great forum for learning about lugers. There are alot of knowledgeable people here who are more than willing to help.
"Poor purchase"? Only if it keeps nagging at you.
If you are happy with it, then it is a good purchase...sounds like you are!!
Learning and enjoying is what it is all about.
Thanks,
Stan

cgilbert37 · 02-06-2005, 03:37 PM

Hey Ron and Stan- thanks for the warm welcome and info!

This may sound odd, but I am not much of a gun person... I enjoy shooting occasionally but am really more interested in relics of WWII. The only other pistol I have is a WWII Colt 1911. Besides a Luger and Colt, I don't forsee getting any additional pistols.

My interest is in owning a good looking example. I don't mind restoration- in fact I enjoy it and have done many cars over the years. My satisfaction comes from taking a heap and turning it into a showpiece but it is done within reason; meaning I wouldn't restore a rusted out 1963 VW Beetle from Michigan when a good rust-free candidate can be bought out west inexpensively.

The fact that the barrel and receiver are not matching does bother me... Is it possible to fill-in and restamp them to match the frame? This wouldn't be done in an effort to profit- just solely for making it look right.

Is there a difference in sideplates? I do not have enough experience to tell the difference between them.

If I do decide to keep it, the CAI stamping on the side will be removed, but that leaves the serial number... can it be relocated? Is it possible to have it re-registered with the original frame # so it doesn't need the importer's assigned one anymore?

Quote:

Originally posted by stantheboltactionman
"Poor purchase"? Only if it keeps nagging at you.

... and Stan- you hit the nail on the head. It is nagging me a bit. SOG will let me return it but I have to decide soon.

On the brighter side, if it does go back to SOG- at least I'll have you experts to rely on before my next purchase!

Thanks again!
Chris

Ron Smith · 02-06-2005, 08:59 PM

Chris,
With what you would pay for retoration plus what you are paying SOG. You could get a pretty nice collector quality Luger. I don't think the ATF would appreciate changing ser#s around. The paper work alone is'nt worth the effort.
If it were me I would'nt waste my time and money restoring a Russian restoration. You would just be throwing money down a rat hole. Restration enhances the value of a car. It does'nt work that way with guns.
Just my opinion, Ron

G.W. Gill · 02-07-2005, 12:08 AM

Ditto Ron. Send it back or keep it and shoot it. Don't put another dollar in it.

stantheboltactionman · 02-07-2005, 06:16 PM

Chris,
That "CAI Billboard import marking abortion" was at least 50% of my nag...
The other 50% was the sewer pipe bore condition...
H#LL, the cleaning rod would not even spiral with a bore brush on it!! Unless you pushed it in REALLY slow!
As a shooter, I was sure accuracy would have been a non-event!

If you want a nice example, and only one,you have to ask yourself: "Is this that rusty VW"? Mine was a YUGO!!
Trust and listen to the guys on this forum.
They have "been there done that" and most have the T-shirt to prove it!!
"Life is too short to own an ugly gun"

Thanks,
Stan

Pete Ebbink · 02-07-2005, 07:11 PM

Guys,

If you do not mind saying so...what are the SOG lugers being priced at these days ?

stantheboltactionman · 02-07-2005, 07:39 PM

Pete,
$639.00 base price....add $25.00 for handpick....Right around $30.00 for shipping depending on where you live. Add extra 2% if by credit card.
So...right around $700.00 total.
Thanks,
Stan

Karl · 02-07-2005, 07:45 PM

Pete,

The price is $639. in the February SOG catalog, plus $25. for handpicked selection. Although I have seen a few of these in reasonably nice condition (mostly matching, good bore, no pitting), I find the price at least $100. high, especially considering the mutilated frame with the stippled import billboard.

To newbies who have purchased one of these: don't feel too bad about it. You didn't get burned that badly and I would bet that all of us have made a bad Luger purchase at some point. My personnal addiction to lugers began with a piece of junk that I paid too much for, but I learned a lot from it after complete disassembly, replacing springs, etc. KFS

cgilbert37 · 02-07-2005, 11:49 PM

Well... it turns out that the CAI billboard is nagging me too much... I will be sending this one back to SOG. I am somewhat sad to give up my very first Luger. Oh well, back to the search. After I get my $$$ back, I will be looking again. If any of you can know of a good shooting and numbers matching unit (I don't care if the magazine or grips don't match), please let me know. Since I am not a concourse collector, I don't mind one that will need eventual restoration. What were the last years and model that featured strawed parts?

Thanks All!

Chris

Edward Tinker · 02-07-2005, 11:53 PM

Chris, do remember this, that if you send it back, you already have what, $70 in shipping fees already... Might just take the $100 "loss" and shoot the hell out of her

Ed

cgilbert37 · 02-08-2005, 12:08 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Edward Tinker
Might just take the $100 "loss" and shoot the hell out of her

Ed- that is hilarious!

Seriously, I don't mind losing the $70 in favor of the knowledge gained. (Besides, I have shot it quite a bit too... LOL).

In my collection, I really don't want any duplicates... All I want is an M1 Carbine, Garande, Mauser K98, MP-40, Luger, Colt 1911, and now I am getting the urge for a P38... After sending this Luger back, I will only have the Colt left- leaving a lot of collecting to do!

stantheboltactionman · 02-08-2005, 03:53 PM

Chris,
When you send it back they will reimburse you for the shipping charges to send back. Just include the shipping receipt in the box.
Thanks,
Stan

P.S. Post a "Want ad" in this forum for a luger when you get your $$$ back.

02-06-2005, 10:44 AM	#1
cgilbert37 User Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Metro Detroit, MI Posts: 6 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	What kind of rework is this? I recently acquired an S/42 model from SOG. At first I was disappointed by the its' condition, but fell better after knowing it fires excellent. It is obviously a rework but I am unclear if it belongs to the group done by the Nazis or after WWII. With all of my reasearch, I've been unable to find much information about the "official" Nazi Reworks and am hoping someone can assist me on this site. Here is some info: Frame Serial Number: 1709 Takedown lever, trigger, safety, and toggle (all three parts) all have the correct serial number (last two digits of frame): 09. Barrel and receiver serial number: 7285 (I think). These numbers were crossed out with a "/\" and restamped with 1709. This was done in two places: on the receiver side and underneath the barrel. The receiver has the year of manufacture: 1937. Here is something interesting: the barrel seems to have a Mauser Rework proof mark on it. There are three things not original: Magazine- only holds seven rounds and has too much paint on the aluminium base to see if there are numbers there. Grips- black plastic, obviously not original Extractor/Sideplate- Seems to be from an older style model, as the takedown lever has slight interference; making it hard to pull the lever down. It is stamped 50 on the bottom. Here are some pictures: Receiver serial numbers: http://pg.photos.yahoo.com/ph/cgilbe...f9.jpg&.src=ph Bottom of barrel: http://pg.photos.yahoo.com/ph/cgilbe...7f.jpg&.src=ph Receiver proof marks: http://pg.photos.yahoo.com/ph/cgilbe...0f.jpg&.src=ph Barrel proof mark - is this indicative of a Mauser rework? http://pg.photos.yahoo.com/ph/cgilbe...00.jpg&.src=ph The barrel also has another mark that I am unable to determine. The toggle: http://pg.photos.yahoo.com/ph/cgilbe...00.jpg&.src=ph[img] Even if this was a poor purchase, I have learned a lot already and am considering restoration- in an effort to learn even more. Thanks!

02-06-2005, 11:32 AM	#2
Ron Smith User Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Orygun Posts: 4,243 Thanks: 118 Thanked 245 Times in 150 Posts	Hi Chris, Welcome to the ward. You have an S/42 Russian capture. Reworked by the Russians. The /\ is probably an incomplete poorly struck X. A Russian acceptance proof. SOG's Lugers are Russian imports. The Mauser proof on the barrel was put there as a barrel proof or acceptance mark during assembly. If it's a good shooter, that's a plus. Some think that Russian reworks will become collectable in their own catagory eventually. Ron __________________ I Still Need DWM side plate #49... if anyone runs across a nice one. What ~Rudyard Kipling~ said...

02-06-2005, 12:14 PM	#3
stantheboltactionman User Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: N.E. Coastal South Carolina Posts: 25 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Chris, Welcome to the forum!! I know I have posted not in favor of my SOG Luger experiance in the past. My SOG luger just had too many problems for me personally. This is a great forum for learning about lugers. There are alot of knowledgeable people here who are more than willing to help. "Poor purchase"? Only if it keeps nagging at you. If you are happy with it, then it is a good purchase...sounds like you are!! Learning and enjoying is what it is all about. Thanks, Stan __________________ "This year will go down in history. For the first time,a civilized nation has full gun registration. Our streets will be safer,our police more efficient, and the world will follow our lead into the future!" Adolph Hitler, 1935

02-06-2005, 08:59 PM	#5
Ron Smith User Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Orygun Posts: 4,243 Thanks: 118 Thanked 245 Times in 150 Posts	Chris, With what you would pay for retoration plus what you are paying SOG. You could get a pretty nice collector quality Luger. I don't think the ATF would appreciate changing ser#s around. The paper work alone is'nt worth the effort. If it were me I would'nt waste my time and money restoring a Russian restoration. You would just be throwing money down a rat hole. Restration enhances the value of a car. It does'nt work that way with guns. Just my opinion, Ron __________________ I Still Need DWM side plate #49... if anyone runs across a nice one. What ~Rudyard Kipling~ said...

02-07-2005, 06:16 PM	#7
stantheboltactionman User Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: N.E. Coastal South Carolina Posts: 25 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Chris, That "CAI Billboard import marking abortion" was at least 50% of my nag... The other 50% was the sewer pipe bore condition... H#LL, the cleaning rod would not even spiral with a bore brush on it!! Unless you pushed it in REALLY slow! As a shooter, I was sure accuracy would have been a non-event! If you want a nice example, and only one,you have to ask yourself: "Is this that rusty VW"? Mine was a YUGO!! Trust and listen to the guys on this forum. They have "been there done that" and most have the T-shirt to prove it!! "Life is too short to own an ugly gun" Thanks, Stan __________________ "This year will go down in history. For the first time,a civilized nation has full gun registration. Our streets will be safer,our police more efficient, and the world will follow our lead into the future!" Adolph Hitler, 1935

02-07-2005, 12:08 AM	#6
G.W. Gill User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Southeastern USA Posts: 369 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Ditto Ron. Send it back or keep it and shoot it. Don't put another dollar in it.

02-07-2005, 07:11 PM	#8
Pete Ebbink User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: The USA Posts: 5,919 Thanks: 0 Thanked 6 Times in 4 Posts	Guys, If you do not mind saying so...what are the SOG lugers being priced at these days ?

02-07-2005, 07:39 PM	#9
stantheboltactionman User Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: N.E. Coastal South Carolina Posts: 25 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Pete, $639.00 base price....add $25.00 for handpick....Right around $30.00 for shipping depending on where you live. Add extra 2% if by credit card. So...right around $700.00 total. Thanks, Stan __________________ "This year will go down in history. For the first time,a civilized nation has full gun registration. Our streets will be safer,our police more efficient, and the world will follow our lead into the future!" Adolph Hitler, 1935

02-07-2005, 07:45 PM	#10
Karl Lifer - Twice Over Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Savannah Posts: 515 Thanks: 0 Thanked 252 Times in 112 Posts	Pete, The price is $639. in the February SOG catalog, plus $25. for handpicked selection. Although I have seen a few of these in reasonably nice condition (mostly matching, good bore, no pitting), I find the price at least $100. high, especially considering the mutilated frame with the stippled import billboard. To newbies who have purchased one of these: don't feel too bad about it. You didn't get burned that badly and I would bet that all of us have made a bad Luger purchase at some point. My personnal addiction to lugers began with a piece of junk that I paid too much for, but I learned a lot from it after complete disassembly, replacing springs, etc. KFS

02-07-2005, 11:49 PM	#11
cgilbert37 User Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Metro Detroit, MI Posts: 6 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Well... it turns out that the CAI billboard is nagging me too much... I will be sending this one back to SOG. I am somewhat sad to give up my very first Luger. Oh well, back to the search. After I get my $$$ back, I will be looking again. If any of you can know of a good shooting and numbers matching unit (I don't care if the magazine or grips don't match), please let me know. Since I am not a concourse collector, I don't mind one that will need eventual restoration. What were the last years and model that featured strawed parts? Thanks All! Chris

02-07-2005, 11:53 PM	#12
Edward Tinker Super Moderator Eternal Lifer LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: North of Spokane, WA Posts: 15,915 Thanks: 1,989 Thanked 4,506 Times in 2,080 Posts	Chris, do remember this, that if you send it back, you already have what, $70 in shipping fees already... Might just take the $100 "loss" and shoot the hell out of her Ed __________________ Edward Tinker ************ Co-Author of Police Lugers - Co-Author of Simson Lugers Author of Veteran Bring Backs Vol I, Vol II, Vol III and Vol IV

02-08-2005, 03:53 PM	#14
stantheboltactionman User Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: N.E. Coastal South Carolina Posts: 25 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Chris, When you send it back they will reimburse you for the shipping charges to send back. Just include the shipping receipt in the box. Thanks, Stan P.S. Post a "Want ad" in this forum for a luger when you get your $$$ back. __________________ "This year will go down in history. For the first time,a civilized nation has full gun registration. Our streets will be safer,our police more efficient, and the world will follow our lead into the future!" Adolph Hitler, 1935