1900 Swiss

deepdarkwoodsman · 03-22-2014, 12:28 AM

Saw this one on Gunbroker. Anyone seen a 1900 Swiss with "Liechtenstein crest" before?

Thanks,

Doug

http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/Vie...Item=402914817

Ron Wood · 03-22-2014, 01:54 AM

Beautiful gun but the "crest" looks laser etched to me. The buy it now is pretty low for a gun that is supposedly that rare. It is almost worth it for the conversation value

mrerick · 03-22-2014, 07:29 AM

it looks like the description of 3761 is from a Rock Island auction writeup:

http://www.rockislandauction.com/vie...aid/59/lid/504

Marc

Stucki · 03-22-2014, 11:09 AM

it doesn't look like the crest of Liechtenstein to me. The gun looks like a ordinary Pistol 1900 of the Swiss Army in beautyful condition. May be a former owner of the pistol has engraved his family coats of arms on it - never saw something like this before but that could be possible.

Alexander

Stucki · 03-22-2014, 11:32 AM

by the way: between 1815 and 1866 was Liechtenstein member of the German federation (Deutscher Bund) and therefore committed to have an army od 80 men. In 1868 Liechtenstein disbanded its army and has no armed forces since then.

Alexander

cirelaw · 03-22-2014, 11:42 AM

He has another Swiss! http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/Vie...Item=402920836 1906 for $2100???

Stucki · 03-22-2014, 12:37 PM

nice Pistol 1900/06, not to expensive. Wrong magazine and it looks that it has a not original U-shape rear sight (correct?) - the rest should be ok

Alexander

mrerick · 03-22-2014, 02:21 PM

Swiss 13217

Another Rock Island Auction purchase:

http://www.rockislandauction.com/vie...aid/59/lid/506

barrel reference... <corrected below>

The Rock Island story about the Cross in Shield is bogus. This is the Swiss military symbol at the time of purchase of this Luger.

With these two, I'm beginning to think that the Rock Island Auction team has some fiction writers on staff...

swissdagger · 03-23-2014, 06:15 PM

Original barrel.Correct large digits style.
#13217 was delivered 1911 in parts and in the white from DWM.
Assembled ,blued and serial numbers stamped by our Waffenfabrik Bern.

The bolt (First Part of the toggle train) is from a later M1906 WF Luger.
Thanks
Stefan

Stucki · 03-24-2014, 08:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by swissdagger

The bolt (First Part of the toggle train) is from a later M1906 WF Luger

Stafan is right - I didn't realized it and therefore I come back to my comment above: it's to expensive...

Alexander

John Sabato · 03-24-2014, 11:05 AM

Definitely a Swiss gun, fine condition, as most Swiss are, and the additional crest, whatever it is, is just that. Something someone added to a personal firearm (IMHO)

Ben M. · 03-24-2014, 11:08 AM

i am not following what is meant by

The bolt (First Part of the toggle train) is from a later M1906 WF Luger

are you saying the breechblock part? the extractor slot-cut looks like from a m1900 model. i am confused about your meening.

swissdagger · 03-25-2014, 03:16 AM

Yes, "breechblock " is the word I looked for.

This part was changed on this DWM Luger with a part made by WF for the model 1906 WF , or for "non-collectors" the model 06/24.
If the Serial number on the breechblock is matching ,I would say it`s possible that the repair/changing was done in an Arsenal.

I think M1906 WF pistols and parts were not available on the Commercial market at this time.

Thanks
Stefan

Sergio Natali · 03-25-2014, 03:44 AM

I add my comment, to me that crest has nothing to do with Liechtenstein coat of arms, and I agree with Ron, it looks made by laser.
IMHO

NYRommel · 03-25-2014, 10:43 AM

You guys are good. Too bad becasue I was really liking this piece, until I read this thread.
Many thanks once again.

Sergio Natali · 03-25-2014, 12:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NYRommel

You guys are good. Too bad becasue I was really liking this piece, until I read this thread.
Many thanks once again.

Mind it IS a nice gun anyway!

NYRommel · 03-25-2014, 02:47 PM

^^You are absolutely correct, but I just can't spend my money if it's not original.
If it was an old engraving that was time correct to the piece, I would be more apt to be a buyer but if it's laser engraved, I can't. The shield is very cool by the way.
Is the any way to verify the timeframe of the engraving? Obviously if it's laser it can't be period correct.

NYRommel · 03-25-2014, 03:03 PM

The closest crest I find to what is on the toggle is the crest of arms from Montreal.

03-22-2014, 01:54 AM	#2
Ron Wood Moderator 2010 LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Santa Teresa New Mexico just outside of the West Texas town of El Paso Posts: 7,020 Thanks: 1,090 Thanked 5,173 Times in 1,701 Posts	Beautiful gun but the "crest" looks laser etched to me. The buy it now is pretty low for a gun that is supposedly that rare. It is almost worth it for the conversation value __________________ If it's made after 1918...it's a reproduction

03-22-2014, 07:29 AM	#3
mrerick Super Moderator - Patron LugerForum Life Patron Join Date: Dec 2009 Location: Eastern North Carolina, USA Posts: 3,909 Thanks: 1,374 Thanked 3,110 Times in 1,510 Posts	it looks like the description of 3761 is from a Rock Island auction writeup: http://www.rockislandauction.com/vie...aid/59/lid/504 Marc __________________ Igitur si vis pacem, para bellum - - Therefore if you want peace, prepare for war.

03-22-2014, 02:21 PM	#8
mrerick Super Moderator - Patron LugerForum Life Patron Join Date: Dec 2009 Location: Eastern North Carolina, USA Posts: 3,909 Thanks: 1,374 Thanked 3,110 Times in 1,510 Posts	Swiss 13217 Another Rock Island Auction purchase: http://www.rockislandauction.com/vie...aid/59/lid/506 barrel reference... <corrected below> The Rock Island story about the Cross in Shield is bogus. This is the Swiss military symbol at the time of purchase of this Luger. With these two, I'm beginning to think that the Rock Island Auction team has some fiction writers on staff... __________________ Igitur si vis pacem, para bellum - - Therefore if you want peace, prepare for war.

03-24-2014, 11:05 AM	#11
John Sabato Lifer Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: The Capital of the Free World Posts: 10,154 Thanks: 3,003 Thanked 2,306 Times in 1,097 Posts	Definitely a Swiss gun, fine condition, as most Swiss are, and the additional crest, whatever it is, is just that. Something someone added to a personal firearm (IMHO) __________________ regards, -John S "...We hold these truths to be self-evident that ALL men are created EQUAL *and are endowed by their Creator* with certain UNALIENABLE* rights, and among these are life, LIBERTY, and the pursuit of happiness..."*

03-25-2014, 03:44 AM	#14
Sergio Natali User Join Date: Feb 2013 Location: Somewhere in Northern Italy Posts: 2,646 Thanks: 1,082 Thanked 1,783 Times in 1,007 Posts	I add my comment, to me that crest has nothing to do with Liechtenstein coat of arms, and I agree with Ron, it looks made by laser. IMHO __________________ "Originality can't be restored and should be at the top of any collector's priority list.

03-22-2014, 12:28 AM	#1
deepdarkwoodsman User Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: North Carolina Posts: 38 Thanks: 1 Thanked 5 Times in 1 Post	1900 Swiss Saw this one on Gunbroker. Anyone seen a 1900 Swiss with "Liechtenstein crest" before? Thanks, Doug http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/Vie...Item=402914817

03-22-2014, 11:09 AM	#4
Stucki User Join Date: Feb 2013 Posts: 84 Thanks: 1 Thanked 130 Times in 34 Posts	it doesn't look like the crest of Liechtenstein to me. The gun looks like a ordinary Pistol 1900 of the Swiss Army in beautyful condition. May be a former owner of the pistol has engraved his family coats of arms on it - never saw something like this before but that could be possible. Alexander

03-22-2014, 11:32 AM	#5
Stucki User Join Date: Feb 2013 Posts: 84 Thanks: 1 Thanked 130 Times in 34 Posts	by the way: between 1815 and 1866 was Liechtenstein member of the German federation (Deutscher Bund) and therefore committed to have an army od 80 men. In 1868 Liechtenstein disbanded its army and has no armed forces since then. Alexander

03-22-2014, 11:42 AM	#6
cirelaw Lifer Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: PORT ST LUCIE, FLORIDA Posts: 12,216 Thanks: 6,209 Thanked 4,133 Times in 2,173 Posts	He has another Swiss! http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/Vie...Item=402920836 1906 for $2100???

03-22-2014, 12:37 PM	#7
Stucki User Join Date: Feb 2013 Posts: 84 Thanks: 1 Thanked 130 Times in 34 Posts	nice Pistol 1900/06, not to expensive. Wrong magazine and it looks that it has a not original U-shape rear sight (correct?) - the rest should be ok Alexander

03-23-2014, 06:15 PM	#9
swissdagger User Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Switzerland Posts: 53 Thanks: 1 Thanked 8 Times in 4 Posts	Original barrel.Correct large digits style. #13217 was delivered 1911 in parts and in the white from DWM. Assembled ,blued and serial numbers stamped by our Waffenfabrik Bern. The bolt (First Part of the toggle train) is from a later M1906 WF Luger. Thanks Stefan

03-24-2014, 11:08 AM	#12
Ben M. User Join Date: Dec 2009 Location: Retired to Naples, FL. Posts: 488 Thanks: 90 Thanked 123 Times in 83 Posts	i am not following what is meant by The bolt (First Part of the toggle train) is from a later M1906 WF Luger are you saying the breechblock part? the extractor slot-cut looks like from a m1900 model. i am confused about your meening.

03-25-2014, 03:16 AM	#13
swissdagger User Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Switzerland Posts: 53 Thanks: 1 Thanked 8 Times in 4 Posts	Yes, "breechblock " is the word I looked for. This part was changed on this DWM Luger with a part made by WF for the model 1906 WF , or for "non-collectors" the model 06/24. If the Serial number on the breechblock is matching ,I would say it`s possible that the repair/changing was done in an Arsenal. I think M1906 WF pistols and parts were not available on the Commercial market at this time. Thanks Stefan

03-25-2014, 10:43 AM	#15
NYRommel User Join Date: Nov 2013 Posts: 17 Thanks: 1 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	You guys are good. Too bad becasue I was really liking this piece, until I read this thread. Many thanks once again.

03-25-2014, 02:47 PM	#17
NYRommel User Join Date: Nov 2013 Posts: 17 Thanks: 1 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	^^You are absolutely correct, but I just can't spend my money if it's not original. If it was an old engraving that was time correct to the piece, I would be more apt to be a buyer but if it's laser engraved, I can't. The shield is very cool by the way. Is the any way to verify the timeframe of the engraving? Obviously if it's laser it can't be period correct.

03-25-2014, 03:03 PM	#18
NYRommel User Join Date: Nov 2013 Posts: 17 Thanks: 1 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	The closest crest I find to what is on the toggle is the crest of arms from Montreal.