Erfurt Photo Request

JohnF · 03-15-2003, 11:23 AM

Could someone please be kind enough to post a close-up photo of the front toggle train of an Erfurt P.08. Preferably from above and the left hand side. I'm restoring a very poor condition 1912 Erfurt - well trying to - but the toggle train is at least partly from a Mauser code 42. Everything else is rusty but matching. I don't have another Erfurt and would like to see how an Erfurt extractor and the front toggle section are marked.
Finally, for the suspicious minds out there - this won't be appearing for sale later as another "mint condition" piece for two reasons.

1) I like to think that I'm honest.
2) This piece is a dewat and has no collector value. I'm just doing this for my own education and pleasure.

Any help would be appreciated.
Cheers,
John

Edward Tinker · 03-15-2003, 02:12 PM

John, all I have is the one Erfurt, and it has been "buffed bad" (sounds like a new age rock band), so hopefully someone else has an Erfurt laying around?

JohnF · 03-15-2003, 02:14 PM

I found a nice photo of the top view of the toggle train but I would still appreciate it if someone could tell me what the correct proof should on the side of the front part of the toggle train as arrowed in the photo below. (This isn't the Luger in question - just a handy photo.)

Herb · 03-15-2003, 03:15 PM

John, that eagle appears to be the same one that appears on the right side of the receiver , the front one of the four stamps. The one on my 1912 is not clear enough to get a good photo of but it looks like the on the receiver side.

Herb · 03-15-2003, 03:58 PM

JohnF, I'm really thinking today! 'The eagle on my breechblock is not clear but the one on the right reciever is, for some reason 'the upload pic' option is not showing so here is the location
http://boards.rennlist.com/lfupload/DSCN1075.JPG

Dwight Gruber · 03-15-2003, 04:02 PM

John,

Here are samples from a 1914 Erfurt Artillery. The breechblock proof is inset into this composite photograph (I enhanced it a bit, the stamp is very weak). It is indeed the same Arsenal Acceptance Eagle found on the chamber and the barrel, as illustrated. Also included is a closeup of the top of the extractor.

Also included is a scan of this mark as illustrated in Costanzo's "World of Lugers Proof Marks", p.66.

Hope this helps.

--Dwight

PS Ron Wood, you were right (re: Costanzo), I've -already- consulted it a jillion times!

JohnF · 03-15-2003, 05:20 PM

Thank you very much guys, that was really helpful. It seems that the breechblock that I have is actually a correct Erfurt part. The central part of the toggle - the code 42 marked section - obviously isn't and neither is the extractor which is unmarked and an odd plum colour. I do have an Erfurt crown marked toggle so now all I need to do is find an Erfurt extractor. I'll post it in the WTB section - one never knows.
I just bought a copy of Costanzo on eBay and should get it soon so I'll know more about the marks in future. In fact it's the most expensive Luger book I've bought so far and cost more than the distressed Erfurt!!

Pete Ebbink · 03-17-2003, 01:52 PM

Hello John F.,

Here are a few shots of my 1913/1920 Erfurt that was police modified...

Regards,

Pete... <img border="0" alt="[typing]" title="" src="graemlins/yltype.gif" />

JohnF · 03-17-2003, 02:56 PM

Thanks Pete, great detail on the photos and that is a very nice Luger that you have!!!

kidvett · 03-17-2003, 09:10 PM

Pete,

You have an incredibly nice ERFURT!

My turn to be very jeaaaaaaaalous!

CONGRATS

on a very very nice P-08!

kidvett

Pete Ebbink · 03-18-2003, 10:01 PM

Marc,

The photos I posted are from the luger's "good side"...the gun is sort of doggy...grip strap is very brown and patina'd...

If you'd like to see more photos, send me your e-mail address to "pebbink@pacbell.net" and I will send you more jpegs.

But everything does match and every little part is Erfurt stamped, including the back of the grip panels and the grip screws...

This one will be my trade stock; when I find a nice, non-police modified 1912 or 1913 Erfurt, I will sell this one off for the funds...

Thanks for the compliment, however...

Regards,

Pete... <img border="0" alt="[typing]" title="" src="graemlins/yltype.gif" />

kidvett · 03-19-2003, 10:42 PM

Hello Pete,

Thanks for the offer. I'll probably email you for some PICS as documentation....

Our superb Firearms Laws in Canada make it IMPOSSIBLE to import a 4 inch P-08 as it is classified as a prohibited pistol up here....So it is impossible for me to even think about it

Sad, sad, sad....

kidvett

03-15-2003, 11:23 AM	#1
JohnF User Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: UK Posts: 167 Thanks: 0 Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post	Erfurt Photo Request Could someone please be kind enough to post a close-up photo of the front toggle train of an Erfurt P.08. Preferably from above and the left hand side. I'm restoring a very poor condition 1912 Erfurt - well trying to - but the toggle train is at least partly from a Mauser code 42. Everything else is rusty but matching. I don't have another Erfurt and would like to see how an Erfurt extractor and the front toggle section are marked. Finally, for the suspicious minds out there - this won't be appearing for sale later as another "mint condition" piece for two reasons. 1) I like to think that I'm honest. 2) This piece is a dewat and has no collector value. I'm just doing this for my own education and pleasure. Any help would be appreciated. Cheers, John

03-15-2003, 02:12 PM	#2
Edward Tinker Super Moderator Eternal Lifer LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: North of Spokane, WA Posts: 15,915 Thanks: 1,989 Thanked 4,506 Times in 2,080 Posts	John, all I have is the one Erfurt, and it has been "buffed bad" (sounds like a new age rock band), so hopefully someone else has an Erfurt laying around? __________________ Edward Tinker ************ Co-Author of Police Lugers - Co-Author of Simson Lugers Author of Veteran Bring Backs Vol I, Vol II, Vol III and Vol IV

03-15-2003, 03:15 PM	#4
Herb User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Utah, in the land of the Sleeping Rainbow Posts: 1,457 Thanks: 0 Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post	John, that eagle appears to be the same one that appears on the right side of the receiver , the front one of the four stamps. The one on my 1912 is not clear enough to get a good photo of but it looks like the on the receiver side. __________________ Utah, where gun control means a steady trigger pull

03-15-2003, 03:58 PM	#5
Herb User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Utah, in the land of the Sleeping Rainbow Posts: 1,457 Thanks: 0 Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post	JohnF, I'm really thinking today! 'The eagle on my breechblock is not clear but the one on the right reciever is, for some reason 'the upload pic' option is not showing so here is the location http://boards.rennlist.com/lfupload/DSCN1075.JPG __________________ Utah, where gun control means a steady trigger pull

03-15-2003, 02:14 PM	#3
JohnF User Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: UK Posts: 167 Thanks: 0 Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post	I found a nice photo of the top view of the toggle train but I would still appreciate it if someone could tell me what the correct proof should on the side of the front part of the toggle train as arrowed in the photo below. (This isn't the Luger in question - just a handy photo.)

03-15-2003, 04:02 PM	#6
Dwight Gruber User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Portland, Oregon Posts: 3,890 Thanks: 0 Thanked 1,282 Times in 424 Posts	John, Here are samples from a 1914 Erfurt Artillery. The breechblock proof is inset into this composite photograph (I enhanced it a bit, the stamp is very weak). It is indeed the same Arsenal Acceptance Eagle found on the chamber and the barrel, as illustrated. Also included is a closeup of the top of the extractor. Also included is a scan of this mark as illustrated in Costanzo's "World of Lugers Proof Marks", p.66. Hope this helps. --Dwight PS Ron Wood, you were right (re: Costanzo), I've -already- consulted it a jillion times!

03-15-2003, 05:20 PM	#7
JohnF User Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: UK Posts: 167 Thanks: 0 Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post	Thank you very much guys, that was really helpful. It seems that the breechblock that I have is actually a correct Erfurt part. The central part of the toggle - the code 42 marked section - obviously isn't and neither is the extractor which is unmarked and an odd plum colour. I do have an Erfurt crown marked toggle so now all I need to do is find an Erfurt extractor. I'll post it in the WTB section - one never knows. I just bought a copy of Costanzo on eBay and should get it soon so I'll know more about the marks in future. In fact it's the most expensive Luger book I've bought so far and cost more than the distressed Erfurt!!

03-17-2003, 01:52 PM	#8
Pete Ebbink User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: The USA Posts: 5,919 Thanks: 0 Thanked 6 Times in 4 Posts	Hello John F., Here are a few shots of my 1913/1920 Erfurt that was police modified... Regards, Pete... <img border="0" alt="[typing]" title="" src="graemlins/yltype.gif" />

03-17-2003, 02:56 PM	#9
JohnF User Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: UK Posts: 167 Thanks: 0 Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post	Thanks Pete, great detail on the photos and that is a very nice Luger that you have!!!

03-17-2003, 09:10 PM	#10
kidvett User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Montreal, Quebec Posts: 584 Thanks: 0 Thanked 3 Times in 3 Posts	Pete, You have an incredibly nice ERFURT! My turn to be very jeaaaaaaaalous! CONGRATS on a very very nice P-08! kidvett

03-18-2003, 10:01 PM	#11
Pete Ebbink User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: The USA Posts: 5,919 Thanks: 0 Thanked 6 Times in 4 Posts	Marc, The photos I posted are from the luger's "good side"...the gun is sort of doggy...grip strap is very brown and patina'd... If you'd like to see more photos, send me your e-mail address to "pebbink@pacbell.net" and I will send you more jpegs. But everything does match and every little part is Erfurt stamped, including the back of the grip panels and the grip screws... This one will be my trade stock; when I find a nice, non-police modified 1912 or 1913 Erfurt, I will sell this one off for the funds... Thanks for the compliment, however... Regards, Pete... <img border="0" alt="[typing]" title="" src="graemlins/yltype.gif" />

03-19-2003, 10:42 PM	#12
kidvett User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Montreal, Quebec Posts: 584 Thanks: 0 Thanked 3 Times in 3 Posts	Hello Pete, Thanks for the offer. I'll probably email you for some PICS as documentation.... Our superb Firearms Laws in Canada make it IMPOSSIBLE to import a 4 inch P-08 as it is classified as a prohibited pistol up here....So it is impossible for me to even think about it Sad, sad, sad.... kidvett