Do I need to Register my Luger?

[The Worm]

I am new here and have been searching for an answer and come up with a lot of fuzzy answers. Searching did however lead me here and I am hoping someone can help me.

I will be inheriting a Luger shortly from a relative that has no children to leave it to. It was left to him by another relative who acquired it from a friend that served. I am very excited about getting it and look forward to firing it. I just have no idea what steps I have to take when I receive it. I live in Massachusetts which as everyone knows is very strict when it comes to guns. I asked this question in another forum and some members laughed and said don't say or anything. I am just afraid that if I bring it to the range some day and get pulled over god forbid and have an unregistered firearm, that it will be taken away. Then I have to explain to my relative that the gun he gave me that has been in this country for 70 years, has been confiscated after being in my possession for one day.

Any and all help is greatly appreciated. This is my last resort for trying to find info and I am thankful for all that is given. Thanks again.

[Edward Tinker]

I kinda doubt your mother names you J for your first name and G for your last... Someone must have said you should be secretive about posting...

Well, I have only lived in one state that required registration and that was Hawaii, so I registered those I brought over (was in the army). I have lived in about 8 or 9 states and registering a firearm always seemed weird to me, as none except HI required it....

So, if you are required to register and worried about it, then register it.

Simply look up gun laws for the state and see if required. Also see what the laws state about transporting to a range (whether the range requires you to have a registration card etc).

Every forum will give slightly conflicting answers, because every forum has different members.

Check it out legally and then decide if you want to legally do what is required or keep to yourself.

Ed

[lew1]

I am not familiar with the laws in Massachusetts except that I am aware that they have some unusual laws. Also, I know people, from Massachusetts, who collect handguns. So the laws do permit purchases. One such person does post on the P38 board.


I would suggest that you visit the NRA website as I have been told that that have info on the laws in various states, which would include Massachusetts.

[silverknife]

Here is just one link to what appears to be a good site regarding firearms laws in your state. As Plan "A" I respectfully suggest obeying the law whether you agree with it or not.

http://www.mass.gov/dfwele/dfw/educa...d_gun_laws.htm


Here in NY, which has the most restrictive laws of any state, (with the possible exception of California), the circumstances you describe would require the following:

Surrender the handgun to a local police agency for safekeeping.
Apply for a "certificate of non-destruct."
The police run the firearm's serial number. When it comes back "no hit" (as I presume that it will) the licensing authority register's the weapon to your permit and off you go with a legal firearm being transported legally which you can use in public and show to your friends and family. Since you have no permit at the moment, you would of course have to obtain the requisite authority to be in posession of a handgun before the Luger was returned to you. Obvioulsy, before you give the gun to the police, you would want to coat it liberally with a good protective gun oil, or maybe some heavier protectant such as RIG (my favotie for long term storage.)

My point is that even in New York, your gun would not simply be taken away and destroyed. I SUSPECT (the key word here is "suspect," that Mass would have a similar procedure. The best way to find out is to contact the agency which issues firearms cards and ask.

Plan "B" is to become a criminal and violate your state's laws. Following this plan will prevent you from ever shooting the Luger in public without fear of arrest, prevent you from lawfully buying ammunition since you need a firearms card in Mass. to buy ammunition (of course you could cross state lines to buy ammunition, thus committing another crime) , and prevent you from ever showing your family heirloom to anyone who might one day get angry with you and turn you into the police.

Personally, I would go with plan "A".

Regards,
Doug

[alanint]

If this is indeed the procedure for lawful possesion in Mass. May I suggest that you telephone your local police station and arrange for a time and place to surrender your Luger for future registry. Police usually do not like surprise visits from people in possesion of a handgun.

I agree that the gun should be liberally coated in rig or other preservative grease and placed in a heavy, zip-lock plastic bag. I would perhaps remove the grips prior to surrendering the pistol, to keep grease from penetrating the wood, (read grip removal procedure here on the site to prevent grip damage!).
The plastic zip-lock bag will allow the police to see the serial number but the greasy mess and the lack of grips will discourage unnecessary handling and playing with it.

Good luck getting your pistol into your hands legally!!

[Edward Tinker]

I would NOT immediately think that he should go and attempt to turn it in, until someone who knows MA laws or he researches it.

NY laws and MA laws are, I am sure totally different.

These laws are foreign to me, as are NJ laws, yet I know lots of collectors in each state....

Research first, then go another step, there is nothing gained by assuming

[The Worm]

I should add that I have my Class A LTC in Mass, so legally I can have it.

I am very friendly with the town police department, so Im not worried about this gun ending up in some cops personal gun collection, but I have also read that going to the police is a bad idea, so Im not to sure about this idea.

I have read the Mass Gun law website and I cannot find anything on there that would pertain to my situation.

Im thinking my best bet is to call the Firearms Records Bureau in Mass and see if they can answer my questions. If they can't then I am at a complete loss at what I do.

[alanint]

Another suggestion would be to contact the NRA. Here is at least a body who would be interested in protecting your pistol and your ownership. They have extensive records on local pistol laws and liabilities.
You don't have to be a member for them to help you.

[Edward Tinker]

I am unsure what the issue is then if you already possess other guns?

Guns are passed down from family members all the time. This is not like a one time deal, just read here on the forum and see the questions every single month about family items.

This is not a big deal, its simply another transfer or its not?

Your worry is unfounded if you simply handle this issue as suggested.

[John Sabato]

The advice to contact the NRA is the best IMHO. I know we have members who live in MA who are familiar with the laws in situations like this. I guess none of them have seen this thread yet.

[silverknife]

You did not state where the Luger is now located. If it is in Mass the following would apply:

IF the person who has the Luger now has a valid FIC (firearms Identification Card) leave it with that person until you obtain an FIC from your local police agency. In Mass the permit issuing authority is your local police agency. Contact them for detailed information on obtaining the FIC. After you obtain the FIC you may lawfully take possession of the Luger and register it using Mass Form A-10 which you may obtain on line. The transferor will be the executor of the estate of the decedent.

http://www.mass.gov/Eeops/docs/chsb/firearms/FA10.pdf

If the person who now has the Luger does not have an FIC, it may be brought for safe-keeping to a person who has a valid FIC until you obtain yours. You would then register the luger using the above referenced form.

I researched the law for you this morning but the procedure for accomplishing this transfer is really not spelled out in the applicable statutes so the above information was obtained by me in a telephone conversation this morning @ 0920 with the Detective in charge of firearms licensing in the Medford Mass. Police Department, (Det. Mulcahy 781-391-6769). The Detective was quite cordial and glad to offer his help in answering my questions.

Because the FIC is issued by the local police agency my advice to you is to contact your local police agency and confirm that the procedure will be the same in your jurisdiction.

If the Luger is not in the State of Mass. you would need to:

1. Obtain your FIC
2. Have the gun brought to a FFL (Federal Firearms Licensee) in the state where the Luger is now located.
3. Have the gun sent by that FFL to an FFL in your locality.
4. Have the FFL in your locality transfer the firearm to you.

If you have to go this route you will need to find an FFL in your locality to take delivery of the luger for you. It is common for them to do that although there is generally a charge for the service. In my part of the world it varies quite a bit- from $20-80 dollars. Of course the person who has the gun now would have to do the same thing.

Bottom line: You may not possess the firearm in Mass. until you have obtained your FIC, but the law will permit you to do so if you are qualified to obtain an FIC.

Regards,
Doug

[Edward Tinker]

Doug, sometimes I suggest folks follow the path you did, so they learn, although your research was outstanding.

I wonder if Federal FFL law supersedes? i.e. it is legal for a person to transport a firearm across state lines if they inherit it, meaning they would not use an FFL?

That is in the regulations also...


Ed

[silverknife]

Ed,

Transportation though a state otherwise prohibiting possession of the weapon would not be a problem as long as there are no side trips or extended stays.

Under the McClure-Volkmer Act of 1986 which amends certain provisions of the Gun Control Act of 1968, individuals may transport firearms through a state which would otherwise view the transport as unlawful if the firearm is unloaded, cased, and stowed in a trunk or external compartment which is not readily accessible to the occupants. Ammunitition would have to be kept separate from the firearms. If the vehicle has no trunk or outside compartment the individual may transport the firearm in a locked container. An internal compartment other than a glove box or console box which is locked may also suffice when a trunk is not available.

If the gun is passing to an individual through a will or the laws of intestate succession, you are correct that federal law would permit the transfer directly to the legatee, even from one state to another, under § 922 (a)(3)(A):

Unlawful acts.
(a) It shall be unlawful—

...

(3) for any person other than a licensed importer, licensed manufacturer, licensed dealer, or licensed collector to transport into or receive in the State where he resides (or if the person is a corporation or other business entity, the State where it maintains a place of business) any firearm purchased or otherwise obtained by such person outside that State, except that this paragraph

(A) shall not preclude any person who lawfully acquires a firearm by bequest or intestate succession in a State other than his State of residence from transporting the firearm
into or receiving it in that State, if it is lawful for such person to purchase or possess such firearm in that state." (emphasis added)

The gentleman who asked the question did say that he was "inheriting" the Luger but that can mean different things to different people. If there is a will and a specific bequest of the Luger to him, once the will is accepted for probate it would be lawful for him to receive the firearm state to state as long as he has obtained his Mass. FIC.

However, if it was me I would want the gun in my dealer's possession ASAP rather than wait for Mass. to issue the FIC so I would ask my dealer to take delivery of it and hold it until I could lawfully pick it up.

Regards,
Doug

[lew1]

Originally Posted by silverknife

Here is just one link to what appears to be a good site regarding firearms laws in your state. As Plan "A" I respectfully suggest obeying the law whether you agree with it or not.

http://www.mass.gov/dfwele/dfw/educa...d_gun_laws.htm


Here in NY, which has the most restrictive laws of any state, (with the possible exception of California), the circumstances you describe would require the following:

Surrender the handgun to a local police agency for safekeeping.
Apply for a "certificate of non-destruct."
The police run the firearm's serial number. When it comes back "no hit" (as I presume that it will) the licensing authority register's the weapon to your permit and off you go with a legal firearm being transported legally which you can use in public and show to your friends and family. Since you have no permit at the moment, you would of course have to obtain the requisite authority to be in posession of a handgun before the Luger was returned to you. Obvioulsy, before you give the gun to the police, you would want to coat it liberally with a good protective gun oil, or maybe some heavier protectant such as RIG (my favotie for long term storage.)

My point is that even in New York, your gun would not simply be taken away and destroyed. I SUSPECT (the key word here is "suspect," that Mass would have a similar procedure. The best way to find out is to contact the agency which issues firearms cards and ask.


Personally, I would go with plan "A".

Regards,
Doug

If such is the procedure, I will not be moving to New York. I did know that magazines taking more than 10 rounds could not be sold in NY or so my friend said when i tried to sell him two Hi Powers.

Since I have more than one pistol, over a third of which have 13 round magazines, I would have a lot of problems with the local police. They probably would never let me out of the police station.

I do have a friend in the Buffalo area who keeps asking me to come up and visit and I have always refused as I think the police would have problems with my CCW permit.

A few other states are on my no move list also.

[silverknife]

Originally Posted by lew1

If such is the procedure, I will not be moving to New York. I did know that magazines taking more than 10 rounds could not be sold in NY or so my friend said when i tried to sell him two Hi Powers.

Since I have more than one pistol, over a third of which have 13 round magazines, I would have a lot of problems with the local police. They probably would never let me out of the police station.

I do have a friend in the Buffalo area who keeps asking me to come up and visit and I have always refused as I think the police would have problems with my CCW permit.

A few other states are on my no move list also.

Charlie,

Now you have two friends in Buffalo, or nearby anyway.

Hi cap (over 10 rounds) magazines are OK in NY if manufactured before 1994. However, NY does not recognize any other state's handgun license and you would have to obtain one here before you could lawfully have them in your possession.

One day I am going to move to a class III state!

Regards,
Doug

[alanint]

Welcome to Florida. Possibly the most gun, CCW and Class 3 friendly state in the Union!!

(we started the CCW revolution!)

[silverknife]

Originally Posted by alanint

Welcome to Florida. Possibly the most gun, CCW and Class 3 friendly state in the Union!!

(we started the CCW revolution!)

Tampa- Clearwater area is high on my list. My youngest daughter lives there and wants me to come down. I have my application pending for my Florida CCW permit. Won't take much more rain, snow, hail, sleet and crappy weather to get me, my boat, my guns, and my sweetheart out of the rust belt!
I was there a week ago, wandered into a big gun store outside of Tampa "Shoot Straight" and had to wipe the drool off my T shirt before I left. NFA weapons, Class III weapons, supressors, all the toys.

Unfortunately not a Luger in the place!

Regards,
Doug

[lew1]

Originally Posted by silverknife

Charlie,

Now you have two friends in Buffalo, or nearby anyway.

Hi cap (over 10 rounds) magazines are OK in NY if manufactured before 1994. However, NY does not recognize any other state's handgun license and you would have to obtain one here before you could lawfully have them in your possession.

One day I am going to move to a class III state!

Regards,
Doug

Mac lives just a little bit east of Buffalo in Clarence.

I keep asking him if I can look up his dress - seems like he and his sons march is parades (Gordon Highlanders), wear dresses and play those squeally type things that they say make music. I can't mention what his reply is becase the mods would censure the post.

I have three class III items - two supressors and one FA.

I noticed the comment about CCW in FLorida. Kentucky, for many, many years now, that a pistol in the gove compartment is not a concealed weapon --------- even if it is loaded and the compartment is unlocked.

Try that in Florida - if you don't have a CCW.


Kentucky also has NGD and SOS.

[alanint]

Actually, it's legal here in florida as long as the pistol is also in a holster inside an unlocked glove box, (two actions needed to access pistol). Anybody can have a gun in their car here.

We also have the "Castle" Doctrine", which states that we don't have to back down to an attacker in either our cars or in our home. If we feel threatened, we shoot. Not one successful prosecution to date under the new law.
How's that for one-upsmanship?

[silverknife]

"I keep asking him if I can look up his dress"

Remember what I said about now having two friends in the Buffalo area? You're back to one.

Regards,
Doug