As Mike states, the 1900 luger serial no 5673 (with Ideal Grips) was separated long ago.
Luger found at auction in 2013.
This ideal Stock (mike's) was found only in Jan 2021...in the same geographic area of the original auction.
Mike is someone unknown to me....I do not believe he is a faker. The serial and bomb exactly match the luger (with period Serifs) covered by ancient patina as you will see in the photos when I post them. Out of town right now.
Since they were both separated long ago....a fake stock would have to be faked back in the 1900s when they got separated.
That clearly did not happen..since no one wants to fake a US test luger that had no value until..what the 1990s?
And they were both in separate ownership.....
Unless, as Mike said, the wealth family sold the guns in 2013 (when I got the luger) and all teh small part accessories were kept until sold recently.
The fact that 2 separate collectors unknown to each other found the original gun and stock, 8 years apart, speak to authenticity.
This forum exist primary to make discoveries like this.
How many lugers that sell for 100,000 bucks have any paperwork at all?????
How many lugers have any factory paperwork at all?????
I sold a "Royal" presentation 1902 carbine for 80K ....with no documentation at all.
?
Why? because it was original blue and looked like it was expected to look for bining real...but no one knows to what crowned head (letter "A") it belonged to....thats only speculation. Did not matter. 80K.
Proof of royal provenance????? zero.
Fact. So paperwork and documentation is not THE ONLY issue here...and its a false choice to demand paperwork on an early 1900 that otherwise perfectly fits the First US TEST characteristics and US property markings.
So you look at the blue. real close.
You look at the patina. Real close..under a scope.
You look at the period serial number in the correct range (pre-6200 test range). and you look at the 1900 era serifs with 120 year old halos.
Yep thats what we do.
And we keep an open mind.
Since anything else is an attempt to stifle speech and hate on fellow collectors...based on if you like the guy or not...fellow collectors who are honest, collecting for 40 years.... and stand more than a 50% chance of having found the first US test Luger.
So lets start again at the beginning of the logical process (since we are not going to find a document..so we have to use logic.).
First we have to read the only documents that exist on the First US Test...most people here skip this reading assignment. See them below...enjoy.
Second, it has to be a luger made before serial 6200 (the start of the 1000 test range).
Third it has to be a gun made after #5600 to fit into the correct production time range to arrive at Springfield Arms test site in April 1901.
Forth, the Test Luger should have several hammer blows (see document where it was stated that they hit the toggle several times in the function test!!!). I know..we all got a hammer. But not so fast!
Age from deformation cannot be faked..its a chemical process when the deformations change color only due to age. A deformation on a blued surface remains blue for the first 40 years.
A hammer blow made recently will not turn the blue brown. Only age does that. Gun has no value until say 1980s...when anyone thought to even look for it.
These Blows...about 20 ...show brown patina in bright light.
Fifth, if the gun and stock were separated long ago..and brought together separately from another independent collector"s efforts...then it speaks to authenticity. Was not my doing...Ron Wood had to contact me personally to say some guy found my stock etc.
Agreed we are only following logic here?
Serial number #5673 (photos below) fits these conditions exactly...
AND SHOULD THUS NOT BE DISMISSED OUT OF HAND WITH CONTEMPT.
With the discovery of the stock independently of my own efforts, IMHO establishes a more than 60% probably of being authentic.
I agree its not 100% proof...but is that even possible?????????????????
Bottom line??? It is a great find and no future book on lugers or US test trail can ever ignore the existence of 1900 Test #5673...especially now that its serialized stock has been found with the exact same fonts and "US PROPERTY" with extreme patina and authentic age.
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