View Single Post
Unread 05-11-2021, 10:05 AM   #33
Douglas Jr.
User
 
Douglas Jr.'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: South America
Posts: 948
Thanks: 598
Thanked 584 Times in 254 Posts
Default

Sorry my late answer on this topic, but I had to answer it on the other board.
So, I will just paste my answer to Albert's theory, as I wrote in Jan Still's forum.

______________________________________________________________________

Dear folks,
I am sorry for my delay to jump into this topic, but I have been busy with some new articles and the work at the museum.

After reading the messages, I must say that, with all the due respect to Albert, his theory does not hold up against some historical facts. Other military firearms contracts entered by Brazilian Armed Forces, shows that the "Circled-B proof" is not "related to a cartridge caliber" while other Foreign contract of very similar firearms does not bear the same marks.

First, we should remember that, at the very same time as Brazili was purchasing its Parabellums, Portugal was doing the same. And the Portuguese Army was not only buying the same number of guns (5000) but also in the same configuration: 7,65 mm Parabellum caliber, 4.75 in. bbl. and grip safety. However, even when chambered for the same caliber, the Portuguese guns have a completely different set of proofs (the "circled-Triangle").

It just makes no sense - from the point of viewn of a proofing system - to have this kind of "warning" concerning a "cartridge caliber" used in some guns while not using it in others, from the same time frame.

Now, let's take a look at the well known 1908 Brazilian Mauser Contract (chambered to 7 x 57). This contract is of special meaning as this purchased was made at the same time frame as the Brazilian Lugers and 3/4 of the total amount of the rifles were made at the DWM factory in Berlin. Every each of the 400,000 rifles of this sizable contract (fulfilled between 1908-1914) has the "circled-B" stamp (example below). Blueprints from the Mauser factory - from Jon Speed archives - present the "circled B" as the proof for the "Brazilianische Infanterie Gewehr 1908". It is worth mentioning that such mark has not been seen in any other foreign contract of identical guns (as the Mauser Model 1909 made for Argentina, chambered for the 7,65 x 53) or for the same cartridge (like the Mexican Mauser Model 1910, also chambered for the 7 x 57) just to mention two examples.

On the other hand, "circled-B" proof was also used on other Brazilian military firearms as Anthony Vanderlinden mentioned above.

Those facts clearly show that the "Circled-B" proof was intended to be used by DWM (and Mauser) factory inspectors to identify both rifles and pistols made for Brazilian Military, at least initially. The appearance of this marking in barrels (and barrels only) made at the same time is yet to be explained, although Ron and I have different opinions on this subject.

Greetings,
Douglas.
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	Mauser Modelo 1908-5c.jpg
Views:	102
Size:	86.6 KB
ID:	82934  

Click image for larger version

Name:	1908 Brazil Mauser-3.jpg
Views:	111
Size:	106.9 KB
ID:	82935  

Click image for larger version

Name:	1908 Brazil Mauser-2.jpg
Views:	105
Size:	89.5 KB
ID:	82936  

Click image for larger version

Name:	1908 Brazil Mauser-1.jpg
Views:	114
Size:	137.1 KB
ID:	82937  

Douglas Jr. is offline   Reply With Quote
The following 2 members says Thank You to Douglas Jr. for your post: