LugerForum Discussion Forums - View Single Post - new member first post tell me about my luger please

RockinWR · 01-29-2004, 08:39 PM

Angel,
* Thank you for your Inside sideplate number (ISPN) report of the single digit numeral "4". If it is a "14" you'll see the significance after this post.
* "What does it mean?" you ask <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="eek.gif" /> . Truthfully, I don't believe a documented answer is known yet. <img border="0" alt="[crying]" title="" src="graemlins/crying.gif" /> To allay any concern, IMHO this numeral report neither confirms nor denies any further conclusion about this pistol's history.
* Guess I owe a 'splaining:
- Typically, a single alpha or numeric digit is thought to be a worker's stamp signifying the satisfactory completion of a "unit of work" task. In this case, it may be the assembly of the sideplate detail components or the fitting of the sideplate assembly to the rest of the pistol. I think this is the case for your 1490o example.
- However, another explaination has been explored. A study was done about 10 years ago on ISPN's in AutoMag by a gentleman we'll call Dr. Bob. As a Luger's sideplate is pivotable to both function & "smooth" trigger pull, the question was raised on whether the ISPN was related to the exact sideplate fitted and was related to the first two digits of the pistol's Serial Number.
- Dr. Bob's tenative conclusion was published in the 6/94 issue wherein he stated (partially): "The transitional range between no ISPN (or just a non-specific single digit number in the horizontal position or a letter) and first S/N digit(s) is S/42-1936,1937 m, n, o, p, q, a rather large, about 40,000 number block (range). 11 pistols fell within this range: 6 have ISPN's , 5 do not, no particular pattern. After the "q" block, ISPN's are quite consistently present with a very few exceptions". As your "o" block is late into 1936 production & fell into this range, my curiosity was peaked.
- Of twenty-nine (29) S/42-1936 examples I have heard of in the "o" block(yours=30), 5 have reported ISP numeral(s)/letter(yours makes 6). Two have numerals which match the first digits of the S/N. The other 3(yours=4th) do not. The remaining 24 are either blank or have no report on this facet of study. BTW: a 1936 S/N 76xx "o" is reported with a single numeral "4" inside its sideplate.
* So it again appears the S/N to ISPN number relationship did start later than your "o" block...generally accepted to be in the 1937 chamber dated pistols & later. Every original example reported helps to delineate the exact or transition point range of a P.08 change.
* Hope this helps de-mystify my query.

Herb:
* Barrel diameter marking is 8,85 +0.01/-0.03mm(8,82-8,86mm). J. Walter opines this was likely relaxed as 8,81 & 8,87mm markings are recorded.
Respectfully,
Bob

PS: Next time you field strip this example, would you be so kind as to report whether the inside of the frame is polished(all-in-the-white), thinly blued(weak solution washed), or fully blued(like the outside). Another piece of minutia being tracked. And the quest continues.
Thanks !

01-29-2004, 08:39 PM	#14
RockinWR User Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: D/FW, Tx Posts: 279 Thanks: 109 Thanked 31 Times in 16 Posts	Angel, * Thank you for your Inside sideplate number (ISPN) report of the single digit numeral "4". If it is a "14" you'll see the significance after this post. * "What does it mean?" you ask <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="eek.gif" /> . Truthfully, I don't believe a documented answer is known yet. <img border="0" alt="[crying]" title="" src="graemlins/crying.gif" /> To allay any concern, IMHO this numeral report neither confirms nor denies any further conclusion about this pistol's history. * Guess I owe a 'splaining: - Typically, a single alpha or numeric digit is thought to be a worker's stamp signifying the satisfactory completion of a "unit of work" task. In this case, it may be the assembly of the sideplate detail components or the fitting of the sideplate assembly to the rest of the pistol. I think this is the case for your 1490o example. - However, another explaination has been explored. A study was done about 10 years ago on ISPN's in AutoMag by a gentleman we'll call Dr. Bob. As a Luger's sideplate is pivotable to both function & "smooth" trigger pull, the question was raised on whether the ISPN was related to the exact sideplate fitted and was related to the first two digits of the pistol's Serial Number. - Dr. Bob's tenative conclusion was published in the 6/94 issue wherein he stated (partially): "The transitional range between no ISPN (or just a non-specific single digit number in the horizontal position or a letter) and first S/N digit(s) is S/42-1936,1937 m, n, o, p, q, a rather large, about 40,000 number block (range). 11 pistols fell within this range: 6 have ISPN's , 5 do not, no particular pattern. After the "q" block, ISPN's are quite consistently present with a very few exceptions". As your "o" block is late into 1936 production & fell into this range, my curiosity was peaked. - Of twenty-nine (29) S/42-1936 examples I have heard of in the "o" block(yours=30), 5 have reported ISP numeral(s)/letter(yours makes 6). Two have numerals which match the first digits of the S/N. The other 3(yours=4th) do not. The remaining 24 are either blank or have no report on this facet of study. BTW: a 1936 S/N 76xx "o" is reported with a single numeral "4" inside its sideplate. * So it again appears the S/N to ISPN number relationship did start later than your "o" block...generally accepted to be in the 1937 chamber dated pistols & later. Every original example reported helps to delineate the exact or transition point range of a P.08 change. * Hope this helps de-mystify my query. Herb: * Barrel diameter marking is 8,85 +0.01/-0.03mm(8,82-8,86mm). J. Walter opines this was likely relaxed as 8,81 & 8,87mm markings are recorded. Respectfully, Bob PS: Next time you field strip this example, would you be so kind as to report whether the inside of the frame is polished(all-in-the-white), thinly blued(weak solution washed), or fully blued(like the outside). Another piece of minutia being tracked. And the quest continues. Thanks !