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Heydrich · 07-18-2002, 03:10 AM

Herb:

Thanks for the keywords for me to investigate with my search engine. I spent a few hours looking over all kinds of fascinating surveillance related articles. I’d heard of Echelon before, but not Carnivore and Tempest. First off, the link you gave me was of dubious value. (http://psychicspy.com/) This site is an obvious conspiracy theory based Web site. Most of the articles and postings there are preposterous claptrap. Many of the other topics, such as military base manuals, NSA and Area 51 security manuals, offered only a modicum of interest. Although I did like the article on the Aurora aircraft. (I wonder if the Air Force really has that thing?)

Here is some of what I got for Tempest:

[TEMPEST is an official acronym for "Telecommunications Electronics Material Protected From Emanating Spurious Transmissions" and includes technical security countermeasures; standards, and instrumentation, which prevent (or minimize) the exploitation of security vulnerabilities by technical means. TEMPEST is nothing more then a fancy name for protecting against technical surveillance or eavesdropping of UNMODIFIED equipment.

When modern electrical devices operate they generate electromagnetic fields. Digital computers, radio equipment, typewriters, and so on generate massive amounts of electromagnetic signals which if properly intercepted and processed will allow certain amounts of information to be reconstructed based on these "compromising emanations". Basically anything with a microchip, diode, or transistor, gives off these fields.]

This is all very interesting. But the reality of the physics here is that for the emanations from the typical unmodified computer screen (15 or so inches) to be detected and converted at even the mere range of 12 feet away, you would need a receiver about 13 feet by 11 feet across. And outside this “transition zone” you would need a receiver hundreds of feet across. Clearly, if federal agents were spying on us this way, they would have to be no more than 10 feet away.

Here is some of what I got for Carnivore:

[Carnivore is apparently the third generation of online-detection software used by the FBI. While information about the first version has never been disclosed, many believe that it was actually a readily available commercial program called Etherpeek.]

If the FBI can’t get the suspect’s ISP to provide back-up copies of his or her computer records, they can get a court order (they need reasonable cause) to install the Carnivore device directly to the suspect’s ISP connection. It will then capture all of their on-line activities, e-mails, downloads, everything. None of this surprises me. This device only proves the FBI’s intent to go about investigating things like organized crime. And we already knew that anyway. So I don’t see what this has to do with people posting on an average message board like this.

Echelon:

[The ECHELON system, designed and coordinated by the U.S. National Security Agency (NSA) is one of the world's biggest, most closely held intelligence projects. Unlike many of the Cold War electronic spy systems, ECHELON is designed primarily to gather electronic transmissions from nonmilitary targets: governments, organizations, businesses, and individuals in virtually every country. The system works by indiscriminately intercepting very large quantities of communications and using computers to identify and extract messages of interest from the mass of unwanted ones.]

This surveillance system is well known. But the key phrase here is “extract messages of interest from the mass of unwanted ones.” I’m sure the NSA would consider postings dealing with things like WW1 leather holsters and the history of Georg Luger “unwanted” messages when they are looking for world-wide terrorists. Don’t you think?

Basically, none of this gives credence in my mind to the idea that Jews and federal agents are constantly reading our mundane messages here. Or on any other typical Web site for that matter. I guess you can just call me a skeptic. [img]biggrin.gif[/img]

07-18-2002, 03:10 AM	#2
Heydrich Banned Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Oregon Posts: 181 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Herb: Thanks for the keywords for me to investigate with my search engine. I spent a few hours looking over all kinds of fascinating surveillance related articles. I’d heard of Echelon before, but not Carnivore and Tempest. First off, the link you gave me was of dubious value. (http://psychicspy.com/) This site is an obvious conspiracy theory based Web site. Most of the articles and postings there are preposterous claptrap. Many of the other topics, such as military base manuals, NSA and Area 51 security manuals, offered only a modicum of interest. Although I did like the article on the Aurora aircraft. (I wonder if the Air Force really has that thing?) Here is some of what I got for Tempest: [TEMPEST is an official acronym for "Telecommunications Electronics Material Protected From Emanating Spurious Transmissions" and includes technical security countermeasures; standards, and instrumentation, which prevent (or minimize) the exploitation of security vulnerabilities by technical means. TEMPEST is nothing more then a fancy name for protecting against technical surveillance or eavesdropping of UNMODIFIED equipment. When modern electrical devices operate they generate electromagnetic fields. Digital computers, radio equipment, typewriters, and so on generate massive amounts of electromagnetic signals which if properly intercepted and processed will allow certain amounts of information to be reconstructed based on these "compromising emanations". Basically anything with a microchip, diode, or transistor, gives off these fields.] This is all very interesting. But the reality of the physics here is that for the emanations from the typical unmodified computer screen (15 or so inches) to be detected and converted at even the mere range of 12 feet away, you would need a receiver about 13 feet by 11 feet across. And outside this “transition zone” you would need a receiver hundreds of feet across. Clearly, if federal agents were spying on us this way, they would have to be no more than 10 feet away. Here is some of what I got for Carnivore: [Carnivore is apparently the third generation of online-detection software used by the FBI. While information about the first version has never been disclosed, many believe that it was actually a readily available commercial program called Etherpeek.] If the FBI can’t get the suspect’s ISP to provide back-up copies of his or her computer records, they can get a court order (they need reasonable cause) to install the Carnivore device directly to the suspect’s ISP connection. It will then capture all of their on-line activities, e-mails, downloads, everything. None of this surprises me. This device only proves the FBI’s intent to go about investigating things like organized crime. And we already knew that anyway. So I don’t see what this has to do with people posting on an average message board like this. Echelon: [The ECHELON system, designed and coordinated by the U.S. National Security Agency (NSA) is one of the world's biggest, most closely held intelligence projects. Unlike many of the Cold War electronic spy systems, ECHELON is designed primarily to gather electronic transmissions from nonmilitary targets: governments, organizations, businesses, and individuals in virtually every country. The system works by indiscriminately intercepting very large quantities of communications and using computers to identify and extract messages of interest from the mass of unwanted ones.] This surveillance system is well known. But the key phrase here is “extract messages of interest from the mass of unwanted ones.” I’m sure the NSA would consider postings dealing with things like WW1 leather holsters and the history of Georg Luger “unwanted” messages when they are looking for world-wide terrorists. Don’t you think? Basically, none of this gives credence in my mind to the idea that Jews and federal agents are constantly reading our mundane messages here. Or on any other typical Web site for that matter. I guess you can just call me a skeptic. [img]biggrin.gif[/img]