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tipoc · 07-10-2002, 10:21 AM

I stopped by Krausewerkes yesterday, to put some money on a Colt, and while there looked at the two byf's in question. A second set of eyes looking at a gun often helps. I am no expert on P08's but I do have some experience looking at things that go bang when you pull the trigger and I can tell most rework jobs.
I compared the guns side to side. The location of markings on the two pieces was identical, as were the markings except for the serial number of course.[serial numbers are usually reported in a 39xx type of format, rather than an xx85 format. Cuz the first tells us more or less when a gun was made, and other info, more than the latter. 01xx would tell us that this gun was amoung the first 200 guns made in this sequence, for example, while simply recording the last 2 digits, xx85, tells us nothing. Was it 0085? or 9985? to a collector this can often make a difference. I say this, with all respect, because of the first few posts in this thread.]
Let's cut to the chase. Both guns show wear. One much more wear than the other. This latter has the regular holster and handling wear, scratches and dings from a lot of use. A good looking, working piece that is 60 years old. It comes with a full rig, holster, etc. About 60-70%, maybe less. As already mentioned it's offered in the $1300 range.
The other shows much less wear. It is the pattern of wear that one sees sometimes on cop guns when the cop only takes the gun from the holster to qualify once or twice a year and when he uses the toilet. A desk officers gun. The muzzle, side plate, take down lever, grip panels (particularly the right side, where the palm rests, as is normal for right handed users)back of the strap, front sight, top of the toggles, where the safety rides up and down, etc. All show consistant patterns of wear.
The blueing looks consistant with what I have seen in other 60 year old dip (immersion) blued guns (byf's were not rust blued). There are very slight variations in it from barrel, to toggle, to take down, etc. where the different hardnesses of the metal among other things have reacted differently. But nothing, to my eyes anyway, radical.
Overall condition of the gun is 85-90%.
The grips; right grip shows slight normal wear. Left grip shows the same pattern of wear and a flaw. This is a slight flaw and one I've seen before. These type grips were made in a mold. Some times when a finished grip is pulled from a mold some small bit of it remains behind in the mold. When the next grip is molded and than pulled loose it has a raised area to it. The left grip here has such a raised area about .700 long and .100 to .150 wide. I removed the grips (with Mike's permission) and inside they looked the same as the grips on the other byf there and on one other I recently saw. I own a P-38 with a similiar type flaw.
This gun is offered at $1200. It does not come with a full rig. It is alone.
Please excuse the length of this post. I mean no disrespect to mm by disagreeing with him on the condition of the second gun.

07-10-2002, 10:21 AM	#11
tipoc User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Redwood City, Ca. Posts: 9 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	I stopped by Krausewerkes yesterday, to put some money on a Colt, and while there looked at the two byf's in question. A second set of eyes looking at a gun often helps. I am no expert on P08's but I do have some experience looking at things that go bang when you pull the trigger and I can tell most rework jobs. I compared the guns side to side. The location of markings on the two pieces was identical, as were the markings except for the serial number of course.[serial numbers are usually reported in a 39xx type of format, rather than an xx85 format. Cuz the first tells us more or less when a gun was made, and other info, more than the latter. 01xx would tell us that this gun was amoung the first 200 guns made in this sequence, for example, while simply recording the last 2 digits, xx85, tells us nothing. Was it 0085? or 9985? to a collector this can often make a difference. I say this, with all respect, because of the first few posts in this thread.] Let's cut to the chase. Both guns show wear. One much more wear than the other. This latter has the regular holster and handling wear, scratches and dings from a lot of use. A good looking, working piece that is 60 years old. It comes with a full rig, holster, etc. About 60-70%, maybe less. As already mentioned it's offered in the $1300 range. The other shows much less wear. It is the pattern of wear that one sees sometimes on cop guns when the cop only takes the gun from the holster to qualify once or twice a year and when he uses the toilet. A desk officers gun. The muzzle, side plate, take down lever, grip panels (particularly the right side, where the palm rests, as is normal for right handed users)back of the strap, front sight, top of the toggles, where the safety rides up and down, etc. All show consistant patterns of wear. The blueing looks consistant with what I have seen in other 60 year old dip (immersion) blued guns (byf's were not rust blued). There are very slight variations in it from barrel, to toggle, to take down, etc. where the different hardnesses of the metal among other things have reacted differently. But nothing, to my eyes anyway, radical. Overall condition of the gun is 85-90%. The grips; right grip shows slight normal wear. Left grip shows the same pattern of wear and a flaw. This is a slight flaw and one I've seen before. These type grips were made in a mold. Some times when a finished grip is pulled from a mold some small bit of it remains behind in the mold. When the next grip is molded and than pulled loose it has a raised area to it. The left grip here has such a raised area about .700 long and .100 to .150 wide. I removed the grips (with Mike's permission) and inside they looked the same as the grips on the other byf there and on one other I recently saw. I own a P-38 with a similiar type flaw. This gun is offered at $1200. It does not come with a full rig. It is alone. Please excuse the length of this post. I mean no disrespect to mm by disagreeing with him on the condition of the second gun.