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John Sabato · 03-11-2003, 11:00 AM

Good Morning all,

I would like say a few words in Pete's defense and to add that I don't think it was Pete's intention to disparage the memory or reputation of Harry Jones...

Although Pete was appointed one of the Lugerforum moderators because of his enthusiasm for the Swiss Model and high level of participation when the Lugerforum began this new incarnation this year, he is a relative newcomer to Lugers and collecting them and would have had no prior knowledge of Harry Jones reputation.

I have never heard a derogatory word about Mr. Jones before this thread started... and Pete was only bringing the forum's attention to the AM article where the innuendo regarding Mr. Jones began...

Don H... in your own words, <blockquote>quote:<hr />Think, AM is a discussion publication, not a documentation of printed facts.<hr /></blockquote>The lugerforum is exactly that, a medium for discussion, and not so much a documentation of historical fact... New folks have to learn somewhere, and this is a great place to learn because knowledgable folks who frequent here share their wisdom that was learned the hard way... How else would a newcomer learn about Harry Jones and his reputation except by being witness to printed conversations here in this forum, or by hearsay learned at a gunshow.

We must all learn to sift the wheat from the chaff... Hopefully learning from others keeps us from learning the hard way ourselves...

I am grateful for the responses from both Don Hallock and Mike Jones, who took the time to set all of us (especially the newcomers) straight on Harry Jones and this facet of Luger history...

I still find the discussion of the alleged Japanese Luger a legitimate topic for discussion.

We now have three examples known to the forum. The gun in Harry's book. The gun pictured in Alain's photograph, and the gun Don just said is in his collection. If more of the collectors who frequent this forum would take the time to chime in on this discussion with what they know or believe they know, and at the same time publish photos of the "mum" lugers here for comparison... perphaps we could all learn much more about this variation.

My speculation (and noted as such) that the Mum appears to have been added to the gun later than the time of manufacture because of the placement of the stamp compared to other variations is not completely without merit... and I would welcome other facts or speculation on this topic.

Perhaps if we can jointly research this area, we can come up with some facts from collectors who are Harry Jones peers, but who have not yet passed on, who can elighten the Luger enthusiasts about the origin of this really neat variation of Luger.

On another topic... the spell checker! I don't think that the implementation of spell check that is part of the forum software can deal with long posts (such as this one) It does work fine for posts that are only a couple of lines... It ain't perfect, but it is all we have

Thanks to all for contributing.

03-11-2003, 11:00 AM	#19
John Sabato Lifer Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: The Capital of the Free World Posts: 10,155 Thanks: 3,003 Thanked 2,308 Times in 1,098 Posts	Good Morning all, I would like say a few words in Pete's defense and to add that I don't think it was Pete's intention to disparage the memory or reputation of Harry Jones... Although Pete was appointed one of the Lugerforum moderators because of his enthusiasm for the Swiss Model and high level of participation when the Lugerforum began this new incarnation this year, he is a relative newcomer to Lugers and collecting them and would have had no prior knowledge of Harry Jones reputation. I have never heard a derogatory word about Mr. Jones before this thread started... and Pete was only bringing the forum's attention to the AM article where the innuendo regarding Mr. Jones began... Don H... in your own words, </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Arial,Helvetica,Geneva">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Arial,Helvetica,Geneva">Think, AM is a discussion publication, not a documentation of printed facts.</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Arial,Helvetica,Geneva">The lugerforum is exactly that, a medium for discussion, and not so much a documentation of historical fact... New folks have to learn somewhere, and this is a great place to learn because knowledgable folks who frequent here share their wisdom that was learned the hard way... How else would a newcomer learn about Harry Jones and his reputation except by being witness to printed conversations here in this forum, or by hearsay learned at a gunshow. We must all learn to sift the wheat from the chaff... Hopefully learning from others keeps us from learning the hard way ourselves... I am grateful for the responses from both Don Hallock and Mike Jones, who took the time to set all of us (especially the newcomers) straight on Harry Jones and this facet of Luger history... I still find the discussion of the alleged Japanese Luger a legitimate topic for discussion. We now have three examples known to the forum. The gun in Harry's book. The gun pictured in Alain's photograph, and the gun Don just said is in his collection. If more of the collectors who frequent this forum would take the time to chime in on this discussion with what they know or believe they know, and at the same time publish photos of the "mum" lugers here for comparison... perphaps we could all learn much more about this variation. My speculation (and noted as such) that the Mum appears to have been added to the gun later than the time of manufacture because of the placement of the stamp compared to other variations is not completely without merit... and I would welcome other facts or speculation on this topic. Perhaps if we can jointly research this area, we can come up with some facts from collectors who are Harry Jones peers, but who have not yet passed on, who can elighten the Luger enthusiasts about the origin of this really neat variation of Luger. On another topic... the spell checker! I don't think that the implementation of spell check that is part of the forum software can deal with long posts (such as this one) It does work fine for posts that are only a couple of lines... It ain't perfect, but it is all we have Thanks to all for contributing. __________________ regards, -John S "...We hold these truths to be self-evident that ALL men are created EQUAL *and are endowed by their Creator* with certain UNALIENABLE* rights, and among these are life, LIBERTY, and the pursuit of happiness..."*