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jim haycraft · 01-31-2002, 01:58 PM

So-called 'black rounds' were widely described as useable only in submachine guns. This is a common and popular misconception for the most part. There was a 9mm cartridge developed for use with the Luger carbine (and possibly with submachine guns) that developed chamber pressures approx. 15% higher than normal. The cases were of brass, but chemically blackened and should not be confused with the cartridges of later years. The cartridge you describe is probably the 9mm Pistolepatrone 08 mE or the Pistolepatrone 08 mE Trop, that could be used safely with the P.08, P.38 or the various machine pistols. These cartridges are similar in appearance, with steel cases, coated with a greenish lacquer and chemically blackened steel jacketed or sintered steel bullets. Due to the lower weight of the steel bullets (approx. 101 grains or even slightly less with sintered steel), muzzle velocities were higher with the same powder load and the same chamber pressures. Your particular cartridge was manufactured by Waffenfabrik BrÃ?Â¼nn AG, Povazska Bystrika Works, Czechoslovakia (dou), manufactured as Lot 7 in 1943, with steel case (St+). The most obvious difference between the mE and mE Trop was the sealing of the case mouth with lacquer.

01-31-2002, 01:58 PM	#3
jim haycraft User Join Date: Jun 2002 Posts: 20 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Re: Machine Pistol 9mm ammo So-called 'black rounds' were widely described as useable only in submachine guns. This is a common and popular misconception for the most part. There was a 9mm cartridge developed for use with the Luger carbine (and possibly with submachine guns) that developed chamber pressures approx. 15% higher than normal. The cases were of brass, but chemically blackened and should not be confused with the cartridges of later years. The cartridge you describe is probably the 9mm Pistolepatrone 08 mE or the Pistolepatrone 08 mE Trop, that could be used safely with the P.08, P.38 or the various machine pistols. These cartridges are similar in appearance, with steel cases, coated with a greenish lacquer and chemically blackened steel jacketed or sintered steel bullets. Due to the lower weight of the steel bullets (approx. 101 grains or even slightly less with sintered steel), muzzle velocities were higher with the same powder load and the same chamber pressures. Your particular cartridge was manufactured by Waffenfabrik BrÃ?Â¼nn AG, Povazska Bystrika Works, Czechoslovakia (dou), manufactured as Lot 7 in 1943, with steel case (St+). The most obvious difference between the mE and mE Trop was the sealing of the case mouth with lacquer.